A loud way to start the week (vintage Marshalls)

ZEN Amps

ZEN Amps

Well-known member
Happy Monday you depraved amp junkies - two new beauties in the house.

Top: Sept 1969 Super Lead. All original except for newer filter caps and one preamp cap. Sounds outrageously good.
Bottom: 1982 JCM800 2203. All original and is a major trouser flapper.
Middle one is our '79 JMP we've had for a while.

Clips to come at some point.

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c+addict said:
Nice! Back when I was a kid in the 70's it was a big deal if someone owned a Marshall. We all wanted a stack and a Les Paul.
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Nothing's really changed for me!

I love all manner of amps, new and old, but the power of a NMV Marshall into a nice old cab is undeniable.
 
ZEN Amps said:
Happy Monday you depraved amp junkies - two new beauties in the house.

Top: Sept 1969 Super Lead. All original except for newer filter caps and one preamp cap. Sounds outrageously good.
Bottom: 1982 JCM800 2203. All original and is a major trouser flapper.
Middle one is our '79 JMP we've had for a while.

Clips to come at some point.

View attachment 287468
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Looks like my basement!
 
Where I’m seriously lacking is the cabinet end of the deal. Years ago for some reason I sold off my 4x12 Marshall cabs and started using Bogner OS 2x12 which sound good but I really want to go back to a couple of old 4x12 but am scared to death about buying one sight and sound unseen.
 
Curious about mic ing. When it says 'Zen' not sure if its Leon or? I know he is part of the group and does a lot of great videos. One thing I notice wanted to ask him is why use just a single 57 when mic ing? That generally sounds thin the IR he graciously provides is clear sounding but really. Just curious as to the rationale of using a single 57 when most would pair with a ribbon or other condenser?

Lastly, because I just got a 79 JMP 2203 -from your and Dave Friedman's recommendation. Wondering how the Super lead compares to the JMP at band volume?
 
cragginshrd said:
Curious about mic ing. When it says 'Zen' not sure if its Leon or? I know he is part of the group and does a lot of great videos. One thing I notice wanted to ask him is why use just a single 57 when mic ing? That generally sounds thin the IR he graciously provides is clear sounding but really. Just curious as to the rationale of using a single 57 when most would pair with a ribbon or other condenser?

Lastly, because I just got a 79 JMP 2203 -from your and Dave Friedman's recommendation. Wondering how the Super lead compares to the JMP at band volume?
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They typically won't have as much gain or growl (especially in the midrange area) and are a bit more airy/less density to the notes, but sound more clear, a lot more open and punch harder, but the '60's ones I've played were darker and softer. The early '70's ones are very bright and brash typically
 
The dark smooth sound of the late 60s your talking about mainly comes from those old transformers that can’t be replicated even by high end ones like magnetic mercury
 
braintheory said:
They typically won't have as much gain or growl (especially in the midrange area) and are a bit more airy/less density to the notes, but sound more clear, a lot more open and punch harder, but the '60's ones I've played were darker and softer. The early '70's ones are very bright and brash typically
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I'd take it a step farther; I've had a 78, 79, 81 and a few 82/83 2203s and none of them hit anywhere near as hard as my 72. It's almost like the 2203, as great as it is, goes to 10 but the SL goes to 15. When I compared the 83 2203, with new ARS caps, strong GE 6550s boosted to the 72 boosted, the 2203 sounded flat and noticeably smaller in comparison. And the 83 2203 sounded very good. The 79 2203 I had, was good as well but I don't remember it sounding much different than the 83.

When you add a master vol and then compare it to a NMV amp, the MV amp sounds smaller nearly every time if the wattage is the same.
 
Zen, I'm gonna need you to do me a favor. Im gonna need you to let me come down there and play really loud on a few of those amps, and then me, you, and Leon can go grab a few beers and talk shop 😆
 
Racerxrated said:
I'd take it a step farther; I've had a 78, 79, 81 and a few 82/83 2203s and none of them hit anywhere near as hard as my 72. It's almost like the 2203, as great as it is, goes to 10 but the SL goes to 15. When I compared the 83 2203, with new ARS caps, strong GE 6550s boosted to the 72 boosted, the 2203 sounded flat and noticeably smaller in comparison. And the 83 2203 sounded very good. The 79 2203 I had, was good as well but I don't remember it sounding much different than the 83.

When you add a master vol and then compare it to a NMV amp, the MV amp sounds smaller nearly every time if the wattage is the same.
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True about the power and punch/hard hitting advantage of the nvm, but the late ‘70’s JMP2203/4’s have IME more richness and growl/purr to the sound (mainly on powerchords) than the ‘80’s JCM counterparts. It’s the one key attribute they have for me over other Marshall models and for me at least a pretty noticeable difference vs jcm’s. The 72 I have certainly hits a lot harder and would be the bigger, more open amp, but in sheer size none of these are to me really big sounding amps since they’re all relatively lean in the lows, so as open and hard as they can hit (and even knock stuff over) they don’t really shake or fill the room the same way as amp with really big low or low mids like my OG Uber, Blueface, beta, etc.

The NMV’s also (until turned up loud enough) seem to take on more power with boosts than the 2203/4’s, but if both are compared unboosted it’s not as drastic in contrast in IME

I think long story short, as I often say about the 2, the ‘70’s JMP2203/4’s (like the guy that asked about has) has a distinct to those amps midrange juicy growl that is very satisfying and otherwise doesn’t have as much to offer vs the NMV earlier Marshall’s, at least when I compared them
 
Racerxrated said:
I'd take it a step farther; I've had a 78, 79, 81 and a few 82/83 2203s and none of them hit anywhere near as hard as my 72. It's almost like the 2203, as great as it is, goes to 10 but the SL goes to 15. When I compared the 83 2203, with new ARS caps, strong GE 6550s boosted to the 72 boosted, the 2203 sounded flat and noticeably smaller in comparison. And the 83 2203 sounded very good. The 79 2203 I had, was good as well but I don't remember it sounding much different than the 83.

When you add a master vol and then compare it to a NMV amp, the MV amp sounds smaller nearly every time if the wattage is the same.
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BUT,.... how long can you sustain that kind of jet propulsion volume?? My 2203 gets cranked to about 3 and it's punch you in the chest beyond band volume loud -thats with the Mr scary mod giving it a killer added gain stage. Which also allows the amp to be used and MV on 2 which is stays thick and a more manageable loud band volume. without eh Scary V2 mod it gets thin there. Also with it the Lo input is a fat killer clean to slight break up tone!

MV on 3 and you turning the cab away. I live on 2 acres and can crank it all hours and do!
Back to the original question, did you ever use the SL in a band rehearsal or live context or was it a 'wow that really punch but my ears are damaged and I'm not gonna do that again anytime soon scenario'?
 
braintheory said:
True about the power and punch/hard hitting advantage of the nvm, but the late ‘70’s JMP2203/4’s have IME more richness and growl/purr to the sound (mainly on powerchords) than the ‘80’s JCM counterparts. It’s the one key attribute they have for me over other Marshall models and for me at least a pretty noticeable difference vs jcm’s. The 72 I have certainly hits a lot harder and would be the bigger, more open amp, but in sheer size none of these are to me really big sounding amps since they’re all relatively lean in the lows, so as open and hard as they can hit (and even knock stuff over) they don’t really shake or fill the room the same way as amp with really big low or low mids like my OG Uber, Blueface, beta, etc.

The NMV’s also (until turned up loud enough) seem to take on more power with boosts than the 2203/4’s, but if both are compared unboosted it’s not as drastic in contrast in IME

I think long story short, as I often say about the 2, the ‘70’s JMP2203/4’s (like the guy that asked about has) has a distinct to those amps midrange juicy growl that is very satisfying and otherwise doesn’t have as much to offer vs the NMV earlier Marshall’s, at least when I compared them
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That 'Juicy mid range' thing you mentioned seals the deal for me! It's that ZZ to Zep to early Def Lep and Ac Dc
The Mr scary V2 mod allows me to get into Ratt /Dokken and even thrash if I wanted to revisit that stuff
 
cragginshrd said:
BUT,.... how long can you sustain that kind of jet propulsion volume?? My 2203 gets cranked to about 3 and it's punch you in the chest beyond band volume loud -thats with the Mr scary mod giving it a killer added gain stage. Which also allows the amp to be used and MV on 2 which is stays thick and a more manageable loud band volume. without eh Scary V2 mod it gets thin there. Also with it the Lo input is a fat killer clean to slight break up tone!

MV on 3 and you turning the cab away. I live on 2 acres and can crank it all hours and do!
Back to the original question, did you ever use the SL in a band rehearsal or live context or was it a 'wow that really punch but my ears are damaged and I'm not gonna do that again anytime soon scenario'?
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No, unfortunately I stopped playing out in 17 at 50; just can't stay out till 3 or 4am anymore after playing/teardown/getting paid. So it's been basement jamming/volume.
The way I set it up, with a decent dist pedal(not OD) the volume on the pedal works as a MV or attenuator. I have a BE OD clone by Griff, works killer. I can get whisper vol out of the amp this way, and at unity gain it shakes the windows. If I went without pedals I'd probably get a beam blocker to help with the volume.
I have a 72 50 that was mostly changed caps in the pre; so I've restored it with the same yellow chicklets that are stock in my other 72...I've done some small gain mods but kept it a NMV circuit and it's just insane sounding....I'd put this 50 on par with a 2203 in volume girth.

I think 2203/4s are great, and if you're a Marshall guy you need one...but I'd also suggest a late 60s/early 70s NMV as well so you can understand how amazing the sound is; raw, open and for me perfect for what I like.
My 72 100 even made my C+ Coliseum disappear when I ran both with my ABY pedal. Insane but true.
 
Racerxrated said:
No, unfortunately I stopped playing out in 17 at 50; just can't stay out till 3 or 4am anymore after playing/teardown/getting paid. So it's been basement jamming/volume.
The way I set it up, with a decent dist pedal(not OD) the volume on the pedal works as a MV or attenuator. I have a BE OD clone by Griff, works killer. I can get whisper vol out of the amp this way, and at unity gain it shakes the windows. If I went without pedals I'd probably get a beam blocker to help with the volume.
I have a 72 50 that was mostly changed caps in the pre; so I've restored it with the same yellow chicklets that are stock in my other 72...I've done some small gain mods but kept it a NMV circuit and it's just insane sounding....I'd put this 50 on par with a 2203 in volume girth.

I think 2203/4s are great, and if you're a Marshall guy you need one...but I'd also suggest a late 60s/early 70s NMV as well so you can understand how amazing the sound is; raw, open and for me perfect for what I like.
My 72 100 even made my C+ Coliseum disappear when I ran both with my ABY pedal. Insane but true.
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Nice! BTW it is possible to gig without 3 am load outs. My band does all kinds of spring through fall outdoor shows -parks winery country clubs where we are loading out from 8-10 pm :m17:
 
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