Speaker/cab for low volume high gain

I have a question for lovers of high gain tone with children.

Like so many before me, I'm looking to get good tone at low volumes. I have a hand-made Granger 50 watt amp that does a phenomenal job of retaining tone and clarity at low volumes. I'm hunting for a speaker cabinet that will complement that ability. Currently I have a Bogner 412 loaded with an X of V30s and G12K-100s and an Avatar 112 with a G12K-100. The Bogner sounds great at decent volumes, the Avatar... Not so much (I like the K100 mix but by themselves, there just isn't enough mids).

As we all know, speakers just don't react the same when not receiving power to exercise them. I'm curious if anyone has a speaker setup that works pretty good even at low volumes. I'm considering swapping out the speaker in my Avatar to accomplish this. I've also thought about getting a 110 cab since then it seems it would move less air.

What have you guys done?

Maybe an attenuator (Rivera) or maybe a Jose? I am not an amp tech but I have an Jose MV on my amp and it can do whisper volumes and great sound/feel. I am not sure if there is a limitation to what amps you can put this in but maybe someone can chime in.. If you have a effects loop, you might can put a vol pedal in the loop and have it very low with the masters up, I can do that with my Rivera.

Swap the speaker for an Eminence Legend V12. I went from k100s to these exclusively. They work great at band volumes and at home volumes. I have an 11 month old kid. My other suggestion would be to get an iso cab...which is something Im going to be purchasing sometime soon.

The volume I'm getting is actually good. I have a Weber Mini Mass, but I don't use it much because the master volume is so effective on the Granger. Granted it's super touchy at low volumes, but I can manage. I'm looking for optimizing my tone at that volume potentially by a speaker and/or cab change.

I'll have to give the V12s a look. I've exclusively owned Celestions my whole life, but I'm by all means open to other brands. I haven't thought about an iso-cab. I always associate them with recording. Wouldn't it sound really muffled?

Just to give a better idea of what I'm thinking with regards to speakers... I have three thoughts on it which may or may not be valid:

1. A smaller diameter speaker will push less air, so I can push a little more power to it without producing as much volume.
2. A lower wattage speaker will be pushed to a greater percentage of it's capacity perhaps making it sing a little more.
3. A less efficient speaker will be less loud per watt of power.

Yeah, I'm a geek by trade.

Yeah, sorry, I was talking about the iso cab in reference to recording at lower perceived volumes. Anyway....heres my 5150 212 with V12s in it at volumes low enough for you to hear my 11 month old yelling and having a great old time in the background.

http://tonefinder.com/?section=id&value=14603

Specifically for speakers, look for speakers with low sensitivity ratings. This means they're less efficient and therefore not as loud as more efficient speakers. Greenbacks, for example, aren't all that efficient. EV12-L speakers are very efficient. Without changing any settings on an amp, the EV will be noticably louder that the Greenback.

I think the G12K-100 are a pretty sensitive speaker (more so than the V30, which is more sensitive than a Greenback, btw), which might explain why you don't like it so much at lower volumes. Also could just be the voicing of the speaker.

You mention a 1x10 cab: I'm using a 4x10 cab with G10L-35 Celestions, which are about as efficient as Greenbacks. With a SLO, it's the best sounding low volume rig I've ever used. Side-by-side with a Greenback 4x12, I can't say I really notices a volume difference, but it's easier to control the thumpy sub-lows with the 4x10. That maybe makes it seem quieter because it's not rattling the house.

TLDR: try Greenbacks for a quieter speaker.

cardinal":28o4040o said:

TLDR: try Greenbacks for a quieter speaker.

Click to expand...

Cool, a buddy of mine recommended the same thing to me the other day. I've noticed there's a handful of different flavors of Greenbacks, and there's always vintage ones to consider. I know this could start a holy war, but any recommendations in that regard if I go the GB route?

Well, here's something interesting. The standard Greenback is rated at 98db, but the Heritage is 96db. That makes me lean towards the latter for that spec. I verified that the sensitivity for the other three speakers are 99db and 100db. At least for that consideration, the Greenback will be a winner.

Note that the EVH Celestion is the same thing as the Heritage but cheaper somehow.

I've played through an EVH 4x12 and it was awesome.

Here we go!
The ultimate Celestion Greenback Shootout HD - YouTube
http://m.youtube.com/#/watch?v=k5Iqt38GM3w

Although a 25 watt speaker will breakup sooner, I don't think they sound that great at low volume. The idea behind them is that they are to be pushed, thus unlocking that sweet cone breakup.
Whenever I ran my Greenbacks at lower volume they sounded thin and hollow compared to their loud, pushed tone.

I've actually had better luck with higher wattage speakers when playing with high gain at low volumes.
Namely the Legend V12, which may be listed as 100 db efficiency, but are nowhere near as loud as V30's with the db same rating.
You need a BIG sounding speaker, with pleanty of body and lows at all volume levels.
The WGS BL80 is another choice, along with the Swamp Thang.