Gotta get to Church

  • Thread starter Thread starter Mike_V
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Wow this thread has escalated in the last day. I see there are lots of amazing thought and input from both sides. I have been a Christian since I can remember and have been through discussions like this many many times. Faith is something that every man has, he just chooses to put it in different things. My faith is in the Bible and God, and I believe Jesus is the only way to heaven.

Somebody said earlier that whatever you believe in if it makes you a better person then it cannot be bad. Why does everyone gets such satisfaction by tearing down anothers beliefs and faith. I really do not mind that others believe or not. If they are open minded and want to hear me out, I gladly will share the gospel with them.

To make statements like Jesus did not exist or worship a shoe is quite funny to me. I let history dictate how i feel about this. When you have a movement of people that have nothing to gain, and many actually lost their life for belief in something based on what they saw in that time it is quite moving. Especially those like Paul.

I think everyone on here would do better to not belittle and be so arrogant and sarcastic in their posts. Believe in God or not, to be so blatantly negative makes no sense to me. It does nothing but proves a rational conversation can not be had with those like that.

I have already been called a noob and told to stfu. I am sure it would be easy to continue the harrasment. However my belief is one shared by many others. And all of what you see in the world in regards to negativity towards God and his people can be found directly in the Bible.

For those of you who are rational lets try to keep the discussions to questions and answers based on belief, for those of you who want to just harass and be cruel grow up. Hopefully you do not treat music the same way.
 
I really like watching porn on my new monitor. Tits just look so much larger...... and nipples! Gawd...the nipples! Pinch pinch!
 
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ttosh":50817 said:
Wow this thread has escalated in the last day. I see there are lots of amazing thought and input from both sides. I have been a Christian since I can remember and have been through discussions like this many many times. Faith is something that every man has, he just chooses to put it in different things. My faith is in the Bible and God, and I believe Jesus is the only way to heaven.

Somebody said earlier that whatever you believe in if it makes you a better person then it cannot be bad. Why does everyone gets such satisfaction by tearing down anothers beliefs and faith. I really do not mind that others believe or not. If they are open minded and want to hear me out, I gladly will share the gospel with them.

To make statements like Jesus did not exist or worship a shoe is quite funny to me. I let history dictate how i feel about this. When you have a movement of people that have nothing to gain, and many actually lost their life for belief in something based on what they saw in that time it is quite moving. Especially those like Paul.

I think everyone on here would do better to not belittle and be so arrogant and sarcastic in their posts. Believe in God or not, to be so blatantly negative makes no sense to me. It does nothing but proves a rational conversation can not be had with those like that.

I have already been called a noob and told to stfu. I am sure it would be easy to continue the harrasment. However my belief is one shared by many others. And all of what you see in the world in regards to negativity towards God and his people can be found directly in the Bible.

For those of you who are rational lets try to keep the discussions to questions and answers based on belief, for those of you who want to just harass and be cruel grow up. Hopefully you do not treat music the same way.
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i wasn't trying to belittle. i'm trying to get you understand my point. you say you don't care what others believe yet tote around a "i believe in god" flag...which is fine, BUT, the mere mention of someone not believing in your god, and all the sudden, you're bearing your testimony. i don't recall telling you why i don't believe in god yet i sure as hell remember you telling me why you do.

statements like the shoe are funny to you but statements about believing in something that isn't there are funny to me. so do i not get my say? you say it's real, i say it might not be and all the sudden, i'm some satanist that's all wrong and goin' to hell? well, if that's how your religion is...then i want no part of it. talk about arrogance.
and there is PLENTY to gain by siding with a certain religion...ask the moors or the jews. just cuz a shitload of people believe in the same thing, doesn't make it true...remember, at one time, the MAJORITY of people thought the earth was flat. were they right?

you can't have positive without the negative...it just don't work. your beloved "faith" would be weaker than a 90 year old woman if you didn't constantly have people (or things) testing it, no? so what's wrong? can't take the heat? "biblebook jesus" was tempted by "satan himself"...he never buckled.

i never called noob or told you to stfu but myk will be myk...he's young, i'm not (altho mike v sure likes to think so)...you're the one pushing it on us so the burden of proof is on you. you wanna tell me that god is everywhere and everything fine...you call it god, i call it nature. you okay with that?

all i'm trying to say is...don't try and tell me i'm wrong when i'm not trying to tell you i'm right. and i honestly do not give a fuk if you believe in god or allah or aliens or the force...if you believe then believe and leave it at that. don't get so offended by people fukin with ya.


oh, and btw...mike v... your proof in point comment...weak. i expected more...there was no proof and there was no point...better hit the painkillers some more bro. :D
 
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The bible says that true religion is visiting orphans and helping widows. You don't see much of that. As I said before truth stands as truth even if no one believes it. If a million people think something is truth that doesn't make it so. I also said we re present Jesus somewhat poorly and that is a fact. Seek and you will find, God will fill the thrist we all have for his presence in our lives.
 
:|::QBB:The Bible teaches us of a loving God, and makes no mention of "life after death" as in a spirit realm heaven or hell.[/quote]

:lol: :lol: :lol:

Try reading it first!![/quote]

Fair enough.

It has been a while since I have read/studied the Bible, and I suppose I am still a card-carrying agnostic, even though I want to believe. I honestly don't remember an afterlife mentioned in the Bible. I have been under the impression that the Bible tells of a loving God who will resurrect the dead for final judgement. Those worthy will re-awaken so to speak in paradise where there is no death, since Jesus already handled that ransom for us. Those judged not-worthy will continue in death, which is nothingness.

But like I said, it has been several years, so I do apologize if I have "missed the bus" here in some way :thumbsup:
 
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cloudnine":d31df said:
The free will debate is the main reason why I don't and can't believe in God.

Free will and an all-powerful God are an oxymoron.

God knows what your decisions are before you make them. God knows what your decisions will be millions of years before you make them. He creates everything and knows everything, the definition of all-powerful.

And yet people tell you you have free will and will go to Hell if you make the wrong decisions.

God certainly isn't all-loving if he KNOWS you will reject him all the days of your life before he even creates you and STILL sends you to Hell.
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1) God created you and gave you life
2) God gave you FREE WILL ...so He 'risks' that you will possibly *CHOOSE* to deny Him and choose to live apart from His gift of Jesus and His Spirit to empower you to do good.
3) God puts 'self evident' proofs in our minds, spirits and in the world around us (please read Romans ch 1) that He is *EXACTLY* as He says He is in the Bible.
4) Some ACCEPT God's gift and return His offer of 'life' with *FAITH* in Jesus as LORD.
5) Some DENY God's gift and spend their time here and now dis'ing Him. They spend the bulk of their time trying to pursue and fulfill carnal selfish pleasures, usually at the expense of others.
6) Because of the ACCEPTANCE of God's simple gift of Jesus, people that are judged by God as FAITHFUL and TRUE in Christ will spend eternity in heaven with Him.
7) Because of the CHOICE to DENY God's *ONLY* provision of salvation, those that *CHOOSE* this route will get *EXACTLY* what they want: eternity away from the presence of God's favor and goodness...or, HELL.

*REMEMBER*!!! God didn't 'throw' you in there...you CHOSE it....you made the choice and will spend eternity on YOUR OWN DECISION! ;)
 
Without the harrassment and just plain being an idiot by a few, this is a pretty good conversation.

Good points on both sides.

Believe as you will. I am not a missionary trying to PUSH my faith on others (Like Jahavahs Witnesses).

All I know is that I was minutes/hours away from INSTANT DEATH with a golf ball sized tumor blocking cerebral fluid from flowing in my brain. It was smack in the middle of the third ventricle (a major artery in the brain). I came through it with the help of MY GOD.

Thank you LORD--I am done for now...

:beardbang:
 
My comments were not pointed directly to you. But since you commented back I will gladly respond:

You said:
i wasn't trying to belittle. i'm trying to get you understand my point. you say you don't care what others believe yet tote around a "i believe in god" flag...which is fine, BUT, the mere mention of someone not believing in your god, and all the sudden, you're bearing your testimony. i don't recall telling you why i don't believe in god yet i sure as hell remember you telling me why you do.

My response:
If you were not trying to belittle then what I said was not pointed at you in the first place. I definitely understand your point. I also stated I enjoyed discussing the topic of the gospel with those that have an open mind. It has nothing to do with the mere mention of you believing in my God or not. You could have stated you do believe and my response regarding God would have been the same. You are correct I do not know why you do not believe in God, however belief in God is through faith not science as some like to point out.

You said:
statements like the shoe are funny to you but statements about believing in something that isn't there are funny to me. so do i not get my say? you say it's real, i say it might not be and all the sudden, i'm some satanist that's all wrong and goin' to hell? well, if that's how your religion is...then i want no part of it. talk about arrogance.
and there is PLENTY to gain by siding with a certain religion...ask the moors or the jews. just cuz a shitload of people believe in the same thing, doesn't make it true...remember, at one time, the MAJORITY of people thought the earth was flat. were they right?

My Response:
I never said you do not get your say. I love a good discussion with multiple opinions. I never said you ware a satanist. I never said you were going to hell. I did say I believe the only way to heaven is through Jesus, but I am do not know your nor your heart, so I cannot say anything about your judgement. I agree with your statement that just because a lot of people believe in something does not make it correct. That was not my point when I stated this.

You said:
you can't have positive without the negative...it just don't work. your beloved "faith" would be weaker than a 90 year old woman if you didn't constantly have people (or things) testing it, no? so what's wrong? can't take the heat? "biblebook jesus" was tempted by "satan himself"...he never buckled.

My Response:
I think I can take the heat. And actually being tested is fine. You are correct Jesus was tempted in the Bible. As were many in the Bible and in real life. I am not sure I agree with my faith would be weak if I was not tested all the time. I go to Church and my faith seems to grow rapidly with knowledge and understanding, the testing sometimes actually makes it weaker. I am human and good points regarding science always makes me think. However science cannot be certain itself, and again faith is just that, proof is not needed for faith, otherwise it would not be such.

You Said:

i never called noob or told you to stfu but myk will be myk...he's young, i'm not (altho mike v sure likes to think so)...you're the one pushing it on us so the burden of proof is on you. you wanna tell me that god is everywhere and everything fine...you call it god, i call it nature. you okay with that?

My Response:
I am fine with you having your own beliefs. I think nature is wonderful and God given. I am not trying to push anything on anybody. Yes definitley I love to share the Gospel. However it is up to each individual to believe or not believe. As far as a burden of proof is concerned I feel that the proof is in the very nature you speak of. I feel also that if we were speaking outside of a forum where I did not have to type everything I would like to say here I could give a good argument for Christ and proof that is as good as anything science has to offer.

You said:
all i'm trying to say is...don't try and tell me i'm wrong when i'm not trying to tell you i'm right. and i honestly do not give a fuk if you believe in god or allah or aliens or the force...if you believe then believe and leave it at that. don't get so offended by people fukin with ya.

My Response:
point taken here. I really was not saying you were wrong anywhere. I was stating my position as others have. I am not offended in people messing with me, that is why I could see the humour in MKT's responses. I think if somebody wants to truly discuss something that has in my opinion a great impact on their life here and after that it would be nice to be somewhat rational and discuss openly and not be exactly what you said I am which is arrogant and to the point of not listening to anything somebody else has to say because it is God and they feel they are above that.

In closing:
i have posted my response as honest and mature as I can. At the end of the day each of us will have our beliefs. I just feel that as important as this topic is each person should take the time to really learn about Jesus, who he was, what he did, etc... If you have already done that then fine, you have come to educated conclusions. If not then keep searching for answers. I know I spend a lot of time practicing guitar, and that does not affect my life nearly as much as my understanding Christ and accepting him as my Saviour.

Hope everyone has a great 4th of July.
 
Actually, thinking back to my athiest days(11 years ago?), you guys are scaring people away and not helping at all :D. Especially Mike... You guys sound as hypocritical as the others.
 
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Echoes":a8d11 said:
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1) God created you and gave you life
2) God gave you FREE WILL ...so He 'risks' that you will possibly *CHOOSE* to deny Him and choose to live apart from His gift of Jesus and His Spirit to empower you to do good.
3) God puts 'self evident' proofs in our minds, spirits and in the world around us (please read Romans ch 1) that He is *EXACTLY* as He says He is in the Bible.
4) Some ACCEPT God's gift and return His offer of 'life' with *FAITH* in Jesus as LORD.
5) Some DENY God's gift and spend their time here and now dis'ing Him. They spend the bulk of their time trying to pursue and fulfill carnal selfish pleasures, usually at the expense of others.
6) Because of the ACCEPTANCE of God's simple gift of Jesus, people that are judged by God as FAITHFUL and TRUE in Christ will spend eternity in heaven with Him.
7) Because of the CHOICE to DENY God's *ONLY* provision of salvation, those that *CHOOSE* this route will get *EXACTLY* what they want: eternity away from the presence of God's favor and goodness...or, HELL.

*REMEMBER*!!! God didn't 'throw' you in there...you CHOSE it....you made the choice and will spend eternity on YOUR OWN DECISION! ;)
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+10000000000 :thumbsup:
 
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MitchSchaft":702f3 said:
Actually, thinking back to my athiest days(11 years ago?), you guys are scaring people away and not helping at all :D. Especially Mike... You guys sound as hypocritical as the others.
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+1000 for reality!
 
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MitchSchaft":b05e5 said:
Actually, thinking back to my athiest days(11 years ago?), you guys are scaring people away and not helping at all :D. Especially Mike... You guys sound as hypocritical as the others.
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Mitch you have a great point here. I certainly am not trying to do this in any way. I definitely apologize if this is the affect I am having here in this conversation.
 
It freaks people out like you don't believe. I still have that taste in my mouth :D. I get what you guys are saying, but only we do. Everybody else thinks you're weirdos :lol:.
 
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MitchSchaft":0e3ff said:
It freaks people out like you don't believe. I still have that taste in my mouth :D. I get what you guys are saying, but only we do. Everybody else thinks you're weirdos :lol:.
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I am kind of a wierdo I guess.. :doh:

I definitely understand what you are saying also Mitch. :thumbsup:
 
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MitchSchaft":fe138 said:
Actually, thinking back to my athiest days(11 years ago?), you guys are scaring people away and not helping at all :D. Especially Mike... You guys sound as hypocritical as the others.
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You'd just LOVE to scare me away now wouldnt you Mitch????

*In Mitch's mind, he thinks*

Mike, please be gone--I cant stand your fucking guts...

:cry:
 
You're wrong, dude. I want these people to understand, too, but I try to be real about it. I try to remember what it was like just a few years back. I haven't found a way yet, but I don't try what I know won't work. I try to pull from my short experiences on this planet.
 
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MitchSchaft":6ac6d said:
It freaks people out like you don't believe. I still have that taste in my mouth :D. I get what you guys are saying, but only we do. Everybody else thinks you're weirdos :lol:.
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Somebody can't convince someone to be religious...it has to happen on it's own with someone. My friend has cancer and is now quite religious...sometimes I guess it takes being hit over the head hard with life.
Myself...I haven't been hit on the head hard enough yet. :D
 
You are correct. Most of these "christians" don't want to believe that. They scare more people away than help. Especially the ones on their high horse and aren't scared to tell people they're going to hell... WWJD? :lol:
 
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