Gibson Les Paul going sharp instead of flat.

[mightyjoeyoungxnj]

Hello all,

It's been a while! I've been out of the gear buying game for a while. I've recently had a Mark IV which I recently sold, but have settled on a DSL 100. I've concluded that it sounds fantastic regardless of price point. Imagine that.

Anyway, I'm posting this as a last ditch effort to diagnose tuning problems that have plagued my Les Paul since I've owned her (ten years or so).

Either I'm crazy, my drummer (also a guitar player) is also crazy, or I've yet to conquer the quirks of this awesome guitar. I've downtuned to various tunings over the years: Drop D, Drop C#, Drop C, and most recently C# standard. My band plays a mix of rock/metal similar to Neurosis.

Anyway, new strings, old strings, whatever, the guitar will consistently go SHARP after tuning and playing, jamming at practice, or during gigs. I've tried the thicker strings of various gauges, I've had the nut filed for the appropriate gauge. It's not that - the nut is not binding in any way.

I'm curious: are there any quirks that I need to just simply adjust to with this guitar? I'm wondering if I've been tuning wrong for all these years? Do you guys hit the string with the same force you do when playing and then tune the string? I hit pretty hard and have been doing this lately to diagnose the issue, but alas, same result.

I'm aware that it may be the climate - it's been an absolutely frigid winter here and of course the tuning will fluctuate. It's just super annoying to be playing a gig and be perfectly in tune, and then check between songs and the notes are significantly sharp.

What are my options?

- Tune each string slightly flat?
- Hit the strings with a lighter touch while tuning?
- Buy a different guitar?

I love this guitar and it sounds massive - I'd hate to get rid of it!

Sorry for the long and drawn out post! This has been bugging me for years. Every tech I've taken the guitar to has not noticed any issues, but again they aren't playing it for 2-3 hours at a time like I do.

Any help is appreciated!

 

[fuzzyguitars]

Evertune

No seriously

Are u saying after u play. The open strings will ring sharp unfretted?

Or are u sharp only when fretted.

If the latter the nut may be cut too high.

If the former, then u need to try to wrap the string around the post a max of two times with the locking method that u can learn on you tube.

If you have too many wraps can cause tuning issues

U also need to set the strings with a yank and slowly tune up to pitch too.

 

[johnpace2]

I'm sure there are different approaches, but I definitely use a gentle touch when plucking the strings for tuning.

 

[mightyjoeyoungxnj]

Evertune

No seriously

Are u saying after u play. The open strings will ring sharp unfretted?

Or are u sharp only when fretted.

If the latter the nut may be cut too high.

If the former, then u need to try to wrap the string around the post a max of two times with the locking method that u can learn on you tube.

If you have too many wraps can cause tuning issues

U also need to set the strings with a yank and slowly tune up to pitch too.

Strings will go sharp unfretted after playing for a period of time. I have locking Grovers so the wrapping isn't really an issue.

 

[moltenmetalburn]

I'm sure there are different approaches, but I definitely use a gentle touch when plucking the strings for tuning.

It's important to understand that each individual's attack changes things.

With the metal guys I have to tune to attack, or their heavy right hands make things go sharp.


Jack endino explains it we'll on this page in the nightmare begins .
http://www.endino.com/archive/tuningnightmares.html

 

[mightyjoeyoungxnj]

I'm sure there are different approaches, but I definitely use a gentle touch when plucking the strings for tuning.

It's important to understand that each individual's attack changes things.

With the metal guys I have to tune to attack, or their heavy right hands make things go sharp.


Jack endino explains it we'll on this page in the nightmare begins .
http://www.endino.com/archive/tuningnightmares.html

Thanks for the reply. I actually read Jack's article and took his advice on tuning to attack as you say. I use a relatively heavy attack, so I will usually attempt to recreate this attack via individual strings when tuning. Even so, I still seem to experience this problem.

Perhaps I should jam on the guitar for 10 minutes or so before tuning anything? Warm it up a bit? Even so, I realize Les Pauls are finnicky instruments; mahogany isn't the hardest wood and the scale length certainly doesn't help. I'm just trying to devise some sort of system so I don't have to fumble around in rehearsal or on stage.

thanks

 

[Wayniac3]

A few things you can try, if you have ruled out the nut slots

Wrap the posts, and wind strings from the top DOWN to get a slight downward pull across the nut.

Lube the nut - use graphite, Big Bends Nuts sauce, or (depending on the nut material) a silicone based material.

When in doubt - - you can push quickly on the string behind the nut to see if it is binding.

Good luck

 

[mightyjoeyoungxnj]

A few things you can try, if you have ruled out the nut slots

Wrap the posts, and wind strings from the top DOWN to get a slight downward pull across the nut.

Lube the nut - use graphite, Big Bends Nuts sauce, or (depending on the nut material) a silicone based material.

When in doubt - - you can push quickly on the string behind the nut to see if it is binding.

Good luck

Thanks for the reply, but I'm using locking tuners so the wraps are not an issue. Also, the strings move freely through the nut slots when tuning - no binding that I am noticing at all.

Joe

 

[mightyjoeyoungxnj]

A few things you can try, if you have ruled out the nut slots

Wrap the posts, and wind strings from the top DOWN to get a slight downward pull across the nut.

Lube the nut - use graphite, Big Bends Nuts sauce, or (depending on the nut material) a silicone based material.

When in doubt - - you can push quickly on the string behind the nut to see if it is binding.

Good luck

Sorry, must have misread your post - might the nut sauce help even if the nut slots are cut properly and don't seem to be binding at all?

 

[Ratou]

Tune the guitar while standing up and holding it in the same position as when you play. Guitars go slightly sharp or flat depending on their orientation (gravity, pressure of the straps when hanging on your shoulders vs. to sitting on your lap)

 

[mightyjoeyoungxnj]

Tune the guitar while standing up and holding it in the same position as when you play. Guitars go slightly sharp or flat depending on their orientation (gravity, pressure of the straps when hanging on your shoulders vs. to sitting on your lap)

I tune standing up and in my normal playing position. The issue does fluctuate - it's worse on certain days than others, so it should be something I can work around. I'm not trying to say it's some crazy anomaly, perhaps I just need to be extra vigilant since I am downtuning and because of the scale length.

Then again, plenty of guys downtune with LPs and I don't see this as a common issue.

Thanks for the replies guys.

 

[Ratou]

yeah i figured you did that already Just saying in case!

By curiosity what string gauges are you using for C#?

 

[mightyjoeyoungxnj]

yeah i figured you did that already Just saying in case!

By curiosity what string gauges are you using for C#?

I recently went up a bit to 11-54. I've still had the issue, MAYBE less so - hard to tell since it is a randomly fluctuating issue; recently ran out of 11-54 so I believe the current gauge is a tad thinner.

Also, would this happen with strings that are worn out?

Another issue this guitar has had since day one would be the speed at which is eats new strings! I swear I can strum the thing after 1.5 rehearsals (1.5-2 hours each) and the strings will be dead rubber bands. Totally perplexed by this thing yet it sounds too good to axe. I even remember installing new strings years ago before a show and having them dead right after our set was finished lol.

Joe

 

[Ratou]

Hmm well i really don't know what to tell you, especially since it's a LP, no springs to fiddle with or anything... if anything strings lose tension over time so they should go flat as they wear out and no sharp.

 

[Wayniac3]

Check your bridge as well - see if there are any loose saddles, or if the slots on that end are too tight (or loose). Make sure your studs are not moving or loose either.

And yes - the Sauce or graphite helps the string move and release as needed if it is binding..

 

[Badronald]

A few things you can try, if you have ruled out the nut slots

Wrap the posts, and wind strings from the top DOWN to get a slight downward pull across the nut.

Lube the nut - use graphite, Big Bends Nuts sauce, or (depending on the nut material) a silicone based material.

When in doubt - - you can push quickly on the string behind the nut to see if it is binding.

Good luck

Thanks for the reply, but I'm using locking tuners so the wraps are not an issue. Also, the strings move freely through the nut slots when tuning - no binding that I am noticing at all.

Joe

Just because the strings don't creak when your tuning doesn't mean they don't catch when you let go of a bend to come back to pitch.
I never put strings on a guitar without nut sauce or similar.

 

[mindseye]

Tune your guitar then push each string down behind the nut, recheck tuning and report back with your findings.

 

[155]

if a lp isnt set up properly you will fight it everyday, if it is you will have no such hassles...

 

[chunktone]

I have done thousands of LP setups. It may seem that the nut is fine, but unless you've have it replaced and slotted for the specific gauge of strings you are currently using, then that is where the problem is. The nut material can have an effect on this as well. I prefer bone personally.

 

[napalmdeath]

Find the culprit and move saddle back toward tailpiece. I've experienced on some they just can't get there. I'd suggest a Gotoh Japan bridge. They have more play, and always did the trick for me in those cases. Inexpensive from Stewmac. Get one, and DONT look back! Just set it roughly where your saddles are now, and make small adjustments. It'll solve it.