New (to me) TwinJet! But I think it might have a problem.

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daa2202

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Hello, everyone. First post here, although I've been lurking for a while.

I have wanted an Uberschall ever since hearing a used one in a guitar store a few years ago. It sounded awesome - so heavy and thick! I would have bought it on the spot, except for the fact that the reason I heard it at all was because it was being played by a guy who was in the process of buying it.

So, last week I found a 2012 TwinJet in near-mint condition on eBay, and I bought it. After a cross-country trip (CA to MD), it got here and I eagerly hooked it up, using a Marshall 1960BV straight 4x12 cabinet loaded with V30s. Looks great, very clean...almost "as new".

And...it doesn't sound the same. Not even close, actually. It doesn't sound bad...after reading through some posts here for suggested settings, it actually sounds pretty good in a boosted-Marshall sort of way. But what makes me think that something may be wrong is that even on channel 2, the amount of gain on tap seems surprisingly low...even when the gain control is turned up pretty high (2:00-3:00), and it doesn't have the same massive thickness that I was anticipating. Overall I'd say it the TwinJet has less gain even when maxed out than my ENGL Powerball has on the gain channel with the (Powerball's) gain on 12:00. The Powerball also has more depth and low-end punch, and that's always been something where I thought the Uberschall was without peer. It's a little hissy, too...I realize that comes with the high-gain territory to some degree, but it seems a little hissier than it ought to be, even with the treble and presence controls at very moderate levels.

Any thoughts? It's loud as all get out, so I don't think there's any problem with the power tubes or output stage. Could I have a bad/weak (or loose) pre-amp tube? Like I said, it's in near-mint condition and to my knowledge is unmodified. I don't know if there are any Bogner repair experts anywhere close (I'm near Baltimore), so I'm not what to do other than trying to swap out the preamp tubes.

Any thoughts or ideas would be welcome. Thanks, guys.
 
New preamp tubes. Try a JJ or Tungsol in V1, V2, V3, and V4. Mix and match until you are happy.
 
I don't know how the Twin Jet version is internally but I have two Rev Blues which had weak gain and it was an intermittent problem. The issue was the large ribbon cable that goes between the two channels. One end of it was never soldered to the PCB from the factory. So basically it was just laying there making intermittent contact. My gain would sound fine one day then similar to what you described the next. Once my tech dropped some solder where it should be all was good with my Ubers again. One I purchased brand new and the other used but in mint shape, both had the same problem. I had a picture of my new one without solder that I showed to Charley from Bogner and he cringed :lol: :LOL: Easy fix though. Perhaps your has a similar issue?

Rudy
 
Chinese 12ax7b's probably have the most gain, and is what the Uber should've came with stock. Swap out for some new ones, but do them 1 at a time, testing the amp in between each one. I'm going to do this with mine soon. Was the one you played at the store a Twin Jet as well or a normal Uberschall? The KT88's in the TJ tighten up the amp significantly, and can give the impression of the amp having less "gain." Just a thought. My Rev. 1 made gob loads more pre amp saturation than my Ultra Lead does, but the TJ only makes slightly more. It sounds really good, but I'm thinking it may need some fresh 12's in it as well.
 
leib10":3ssistik said:
New preamp tubes. Try a JJ or Tungsol in V1, V2, V3, and V4. Mix and match until you are happy.
Click to expand...

I would do Tungsol before JJ's personally.
 
OK, time for an update. I had a chance to do some experimentation today.

I had a single, known good spare JJ 12AX7 on hand, and this morning I spend time swapping out the existing Chinese tubes in V1-V4 with the JJ. And...it didn't sound much different, certainly not enough for an "aha" moment, with the JJ in any of the positions. I think it was a little better with the JJ in V2, but it wasn't a huge difference. In the end, I decided to leave all of the existing tubes in place, and will order a new set of either JJ or TungSol 12AX7 and replace them all, just to be sure.

Interestingly, when I had the back cover off, I noticed that one of the KT88s was not sitting squarely in its socket. It was definitely making contact and working, but there was room to push it more firmly and squarely into the socket. This presumably was the result of its cross-country trip at the hands of FedEx. I didn't think that was likely to make any difference so I didn't do a careful before/after comparison, but I do think it sounded better after I did that - if nothing else, the hiss seemed to be reduced.

So now I'm actually pretty happy with how it sounds, but I'm still not sure it sounds like an Uberschall is supposed to sound! It pretty much nails the George Lynch/Jon Levin Dokken tone with the gain on the high gain channel at about 2:00 (which I gather is pretty high for an Uber), and that's one of my favorite tones, so that's cool. But there doesn't seem to be too much more gain on tap and I don't think that's the classic Uber sound, and it certainly doesn't sound like most of the clips that are on the Bogner site and posted here. I think I need to find another Uberschall to compare it to! I'll have to call Washington Music Center (a/k/a Chuck's, for the Maryland locals) - they're a Bogner dealer, and see if they have one out on the floor I could check out. I've tried to dial it in a few different ways, and I haven't found any combination that produces the "brootalz" sound that you hear in a lot of the clips. That's not a problem (that's not really the sound I was looking for)...but I'm just curious as to what's going on with this thing.

Thanks everyone for the help and comments so far. I'd welcome any other thoughts you may have.
 
moronmountain":3d4pkm8d said:
leib10":3d4pkm8d said:
New preamp tubes. Try a JJ or Tungsol in V1, V2, V3, and V4. Mix and match until you are happy.
Click to expand...

I would do Tungsol before JJ's personally.
Click to expand...
They're not recommended for CF positions though - so I've heard :dunno:
 
Something is wrong with it. You should have a ton of gain on tap, like a powerball or rectifier.

Look on the bright side, the previous owner wasn't an idiot and did not convert it to EL34's. The TJ sounds terrible with 34's, and monsterous with the 88's.
 
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