PAFs and High Gain...

SFW

SFW

Well-known member
Since the topic was swirling... I recently install a set of ThroBak SLE-101 Plus pickup in my 2005 Les Paul Standard. The below clip is through a Peavey 5150 block letter/ Mesa Recto OS cab profile on my Kemper. They definitely sound good and have a clarity. I will say that higher output pickups tend to have a tighter bottom end as well as that initial push to the tone. Pardon the clams. carpal tunnel surgery is looming, and my hands don't do what I want them to do all the time anymore...lol!

 
Last edited:
my €0.02 on this whole thing PAF and high gain.

In the 80s:
- the high gain amps were JCM 800s (some modded other not), SLOs and MarkII. None of them there were tight nor compressed sounding.
- there were a couple of overdrive pedals like TS, OD-1s and SD-1s.
- The idea of a high output or active PUs made sense because PAFs with a TS in the chain was not able to push any of the above amps into tight and compress sounding.

Nowadays:
we have a bunch of high gain amps such as 5150s, Diezels, Engls, Rectifiers and others with tons of options for shaping the sound. Plus we have now 100s of iterations of TS, Fortins 33 or Clean boosts to cut lows.

With modern gear, chain a guitar with a PAF, with a Fortin 33 in front of a 5150, is more than enough to sound tight, compressed, clear and modern.
Why would it probably sound better than a high output active PU ? Because you are not overloading the input of the amp with signal and tone shaping. That is the job of a modern amp.

PS: The only problem with PAFs, is that many are unpotted and/or have covers which might lead to unnecessary feedback.
 
Nice clip! I've always gravitated to lower output pickups with high gain and higher output pickups with lower gain. YMMV...
 
MetalGOD84 said:
my €0.02 on this whole thing PAF and high gain.

In the 80s:
- the high gain amps were JCM 800s (some modded other not), SLOs and MarkII. None of them there were tight nor compressed sounding.
- there were a couple of overdrive pedals like TS, OD-1s and SD-1s.
- The idea of a high output or active PUs made sense because PAFs with a TS in the chain was not able to push any of the above amps into tight and compress sounding.

Nowadays:
we have a bunch of high gain amps such as 5150s, Diezels, Engls, Rectifiers and others with tons of options for shaping the sound. Plus we have now 100s of iterations of TS, Fortins 33 or Clean boosts to cut lows.

With modern gear, chain a guitar with a PAF, with a Fortin 33 in front of a 5150, is more than enough to sound tight, compressed, clear and modern.
Why would it probably sound better than a high output active PU ? Because you are not overloading the input of the amp with signal and tone shaping. That is the job of a modern amp.

PS: The only problem with PAFs, is that many are unpotted and/or have covers which might lead to unnecessary feedback.
Click to expand...
I honestly believe that higher output pickups do a thing in front of a high gain amp. Take for example a set of Fishman Fluence moderns. They definitely spank the front end. That has a tone and a feel. And I honestly believe that it has more to do with feel than anything else. Ther is an immediacy to the attack that a lower output pickup is not going to give you. I don't think one approach is better than the other. It's just two different ways to get to the tone you hear in your head. How ever you get there is the "right" way.

Hell, an entire amp market is chasing the tone of a SD-1 into a JCM800. lol! When we could just use an SD-1 and a JCM800. As long as you are making a noise that you like... who care how you get there?!!? That's my opinion anyway...
 
Probably depends on the sound you're going for.

Lower output PAF or Hot PAF type pickups are sufficient these days for that classic 80s metal tone.

In fact they were already back in 80s. See Dimarzio's PAF Pro.
 
If you don't mind me adding a clip; I was messing around recoding a Kemper profile of my Marshall 2204 I'd made.

Tokai LPC with their PAF type pickups. Boosted with a CAE Line Driver into an OD808.
 
EQ curve is more important than output, but yes, PAFs into high gain amps sound awesome.

I've got a set of Lollar Imperials in an LTD and it sounds awesome through my GZA Hellion.
 
Use what gets you the feel and sound you want with what you have. I personally like a PAF level output myself but have had plenty of fun with hotter stuff that gives a thicker grind in the lower mids.
 
I've come to like both low and high output pickups for high gain tbh

Feel like they have their own uses
 
To PAF Metal fans: how to you control the feedback with unpotted and/or covered PU with high gain ? Reduce treble or noise gate ?
 
That playing sounds pretty darned clam-free to me! Seriously - cool tone, great playing, and what a variety of riffs from killer songs we all have heard and love but haven't taken the time to learn.

I am going through a 'lower output' pickup phase myself right now - but I am reminded how much clarity a hotter pickup can have if you lower it just that magic distance from the strings.

Cool video and good luck with carpal tunnel surgery. If you play this well now, just imagine when you no longer have to fight that cold, numb, tingling shit in your hands. When you are this good, it all comes back faster than you think it will after a brief layoff.
 
  • Like
Reactions: SFW
MetalGOD84 said:
To PAF Metal fans: how to you control the feedback with unpotted and/or covered PU with high gain ? Reduce treble or noise gate ?
Click to expand...
Honestly, it comes down to pickup build. I have three sets of unpotted PAF style pickups. The ThroBaks in this video. A set of Pete Floance Voodoo 59s and a set of Duncan Antiquities. I haven’t had any issues with squeals on any of them. If the pickup is wound tightly and the cover has been installed correctly, you’re good to go.

On the ones that I have seen squeal, it was simply a matter of putting a piece of tape between the cover and the pickup.
 
I have some guitars with Seth Lovers (unpotted) and they only seem to squeal if I'm right next to the amp. As long as you can stand away from several feet, it's not been an issue.
 
You have to keep in mind that what people call output is really DC resistance and is only part of the equation. DCR only tells you how easily current will flow through the wire in that given pickup, but doesn't translate 1:1 to output. You'd have to measure pickup output on a scope while playing to get actual output. It is possible to have a pickup with high resistance and lower output and vice-versa. And of course you can have a pickup with both high resistance and high output and vice-versa. The other thing to note with pickups is higher resistance typically produces a darker tone, which can be perceived as less clear.

There is merit in the though that hitting a high gain amp with a hot signal compresses it too much and makes it sound like mush. I think what people are experiencing with PAF's through a high gain amp is a product of them having both low resistance and low output. It has a comparatively brighter tone that meshes well with the compression of a high gain amp. The lower signal doesn't hit the front end to overly compress the signal. All that combined comes out as really sweet sounding.
 
I've had the Sheptone Brian Kahanek PAF's (alnico V) in my Tokai since about day 1 over 15 years ago and they've absolutely killed it for every style of music.

I did a video years ago with numerous guitars and pickup types into my Mesa Studio preamp and Fryette PS50 and had an 80's thrash metal type sound dialed up. The EBMM with the BKP Miracle Man was always my favorite but the LP with PAF's was no slouch.

These days my Lizzy Hale Explorer with the Gibson 70's tribute (alnico V) pickups is my absolute #1 go to. The guitar/pickups just sounds absolutely huge.

 
FastRedPonyCar said:
I've had the Sheptone Brian Kahanek PAF's (alnico V) in my Tokai since about day 1 over 15 years ago and they've absolutely killed it for every style of music.

I did a video years ago with numerous guitars and pickup types into my Mesa Studio preamp and Fryette PS50 and had an 80's thrash metal type sound dialed up. The EBMM with the BKP Miracle Man was always my favorite but the LP with PAF's was no slouch.

These days my Lizzy Hale Explorer with the Gibson 70's tribute (alnico V) pickups is my absolute #1 go to. The guitar/pickups just sounds absolutely huge.

Click to expand...

Damn I remember watching your videos constantly like 10 years ago, didn't know you were member here also.

Great sounds in that vid. Only if you played Pull Me Under with that setup..
 
This is a 1979 LPC with the stock T-Tops. Roughly 7.5k output. I like the sludgier feel of lower output pups though I generally sit in the middle with like 13k output type pickups.

 
Last edited:
SFW said:
I honestly believe that higher output pickups do a thing in front of a high gain amp. Take for example a set of Fishman Fluence moderns. They definitely spank the front end. That has a tone and a feel. And I honestly believe that it has more to do with feel than anything else. Ther is an immediacy to the attack that a lower output pickup is not going to give you. I don't think one approach is better than the other. It's just two different ways to get to the tone you hear in your head. How ever you get there is the "right" way.

Hell, an entire amp market is chasing the tone of a SD-1 into a JCM800. lol! When we could just use an SD-1 and a JCM800. As long as you are making a noise that you like... who care how you get there?!!? That's my opinion anyway...
Click to expand...
Totally agree. Glad you mentioned that because it's also about the feel and attack of a pickup.

I've tried low output pups and it's the attack, the immediacy that always makes me go right back to something higher output.

As you said, however you get there is the right way for you.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top