Peavey 6505 1992 Original vs 6505 (mic)

[Deleted member 27494]

Since I got my 6505 1992 Original recently I figured I'd do a comparison of that vs my previous gen. 6505 (made in China). I went into this with no expectations really and it surprised me a little bit that I did prefer the 1992 Original in the end. I definitely can hear (and feel) differences! Could that have something to do with the upgraded components? I would assume so, yes! Maybe they could be dialed in to sound closer but to me the differences are pretty clear but I would advise to listen on good monitors or headphones!

Check it out:

 

[ClintN667]

I have a US made 6505 that I was contemplating selling and getting the 1992. Since I need a retube and a few other repairs. I'm still 50 50 on it.

 

[TheGreatGreen]

Ok so first of all, we need to talk about how you found a riff and groove that fit the amp's clean channel so well. I can't remember if I've heard a single other 6505 clean clip I've even liked, much less thought sounded great. Very nice.

The difference in the high gain sounds are interesting. They're both pretty similar but for me the OG sounds just slightly better, being just a bit warmer and fuller. For me personally think it edges out the previous 6505, but just barely.

Great video.

 

[Deleted member 27494]

Ok so first of all, we need to talk about how you found a riff and groove that fit the amp's clean channel so well. I can't remember if I've heard a single other 6505 clean clip I've even liked, much less thought sounded great. Very nice.

The difference in the high gain sounds are interesting. They're both pretty similar but for me the OG sounds just slightly better to me, being just a bit warmer and fuller. For me personally think it edges out the previous 6505, but just barely.

Great video.

Thanks! In terms of tone for the clean sound that guitar and pickup works really well. It's one of my LTD Phoenix Deluxe 1000s and it's the one with the Fishman Modern alnico in the neck, just a beautiful sounding pickup for cleans, one of my favorites ever in fact!

I definitely agree about the "warmer and fuller" comment! I wasn't expecting that per se as a lot of people claim that they all sound exactly the same. Some people on Facebook are blaming the differences on the tubes and the bias and while that to some extent will make a difference I don't think it makes THAT big of a difference. I also saw a post recently by someone else who compared the same two models and he basically had the same conclusion as I although he worded it slightly different. "More creamy" he said. Good description!

 

[easstudios]

Commented on the youtube video, but did you use the same valves in each? are both amps set to 220V? checked the bias?

Different sets of poweramp valves could pull a yield different bias and give you the sort of difference in tones I'm hearing. The Chinese 6505 sounds like a cooler bias, and I personally like that sound better. Its a bit less squishy, a bit tighter/harder and more aggressive. Both sound cool but I honestly doubt there is much difference if all things are set equal. I'd imagine 5 new 6505 1992's or 5 chinese 6505's etc would show the same kinds of differences, so I don't think its something that is characteristic across all builds of each reissue.

 

[Deleted member 27494]

Commented on the youtube video, but did you use the same valves in each? are both amps set to 220V? checked the bias?

Different sets of poweramp valves could pull a yield different bias and give you the sort of difference in tones I'm hearing. The Chinese 6505 sounds like a cooler bias, and I personally like that sound better. Its a bit less squishy, a bit tighter/harder and more aggressive. Both sound cool but I honestly doubt there is much difference if all things are set equal. I'd imagine 5 new 6505 1992's or 5 chinese 6505's etc would show the same kinds of differences, so I don't think its something that is characteristic across all builds of each reissue.

Both have the brand new factory tubes and they are both set to the same voltage. I do believe that the different transformers can definitely have an impact on the tone. Apparently there are more component differences aside from the transformers but I personally can't comment on what that might be.

 

[easstudios]

Both have the brand new factory tubes and they are both set to the same voltage. I do believe that the different transformers can definitely have an impact on the tone. Apparently there are more component differences aside from the transformers but I personally can't comment on what that might be.

Having factory tubes doesn't mean they'll pull the same bias though, its why most amps have bias adjustments (because valves vary so much). The huge stash of factory tubes won't all be matched - each set of 4 should hopefully be somewhat close in each amp but each set of 4 would have a wide variety of tolerances and pull a different bias. IMO you are not really going to hear the individual characteristic of a transformer with the MV that low (at least with differences like this), but you absolutely would hear the exact differences in tone your video is showing if the biases aren't consistent.

Like, the reason one amp is louder (and more squishy) than the other is probably 95% because its bias is hotter, 5% because the pot tolerances may be slightly different. I think as guitarists we're WAY to quick to point towards the transformers as being something that instantly has a noticeable effect on tone when 9/10 its something far more straightforward.

I'm not saying transformers don't make any difference at all, but you have to rule out other factors like valves being graded differently before assuming its that. The difference transformers would make, particularly at low MV settings where they are operating in a comfortable and linear way isn't going to be that noticeable as what the video shows.

 

[Deleted member 27494]

Having factory tubes doesn't mean they'll pull the same bias though, its why most amps have bias adjustments (because valves vary so much). The huge stash of factory tubes won't all be matched - each set of 4 should hopefully be somewhat close in each amp but each set of 4 would have a wide variety of tolerances and pull a different bias. IMO you are not really going to hear the individual characteristic of a transformer with the MV that low (at least with differences like this), but you absolutely would hear the exact differences in tone your video is showing if the biases aren't consistent.

Like, the reason one amp is louder (and more squishy) than the other is probably 95% because its bias is hotter, 5% because the pot tolerances may be slightly different. I think as guitarists we're WAY to quick to point towards the transformers as being something that instantly has a noticeable effect on tone when 9/10 its something far more straightforward.

I'm not saying transformers don't make any difference at all, but you have to rule out other factors like valves being graded differently before assuming its that. The difference transformers would make, particularly at low MV settings where they are operating in a comfortable and linear way isn't going to be that noticeable as what the video shows.

I totally know what you're saying. Maybe just see this as a comparison of "my two amps". Although, as I said previously, someone on FB compared the same models and described the exact same differences. Maybe someone will do a comparison with the same tubes and same bias one day, but I don't feel like going THAT deep tbh.

 

[easstudios]

I totally know what you're saying. Maybe just see this as a comparison of "my two amps". Although, as I said previously, someone on FB compared the same models and described the exact same differences. Maybe someone will do a comparison with the same tubes and same bias one day, but I don't feel like going THAT deep tbh.

Probably too much effort now, but next time I'd just swap the power amp valves so you use the same set of 4 in each amp. If you can really be bothered then I'd do the preamp valves too, just means removing that weird drawer thing to get to them. At least that way it helps remove a variable

Its a cool video (great riffs and tones as always!) and I think Peavey have done a cool job with the reissue. I think this video is basically just showing that different bias's will sound a bit different though, its absolutely a factor that needs considering if its a like for like comparison.

 

[BesaMoogie]

Thanks for the comparison. It was really nice and the different things your heard in the amps are the same as I would describe it.

My first question when watching the video was (as stated above already), do both amps have the same tubes in it or did Peavey change something. Although you say, the tubes are factory branded, that doesn`t really say anything. My old USA made 6505+ has Ruby branded 6L6 which were produced in the Shuguang factory. Not sure what Peavey uses these days, but the factory burned down in 2019.
Same goes for preamp tubes. Have you compared them? Are they russian, chineses or JJ etc?

I really don`t want to shit on your work in any kind of way, I`m happy people are doing good quality videos to comparing those amps and actually I was waiting for this comparison. I`m just interested what tubes they use as I would possibly shoot for the same configuration.
Thanks

 

[Deleted member 27494]

Thanks for the comparison. It was really nice and the different things your heard in the amps are the same as I would describe it.

My first question when watching the video was (as stated above already), do both amps have the same tubes in it or did Peavey change something. Although you say, the tubes are factory branded, that doesn`t really say anything. My old USA made 6505+ has Ruby branded 6L6 which were produced in the Shuguang factory. Not sure what Peavey uses these days, but the factory burned down in 2019.
Same goes for preamp tubes. Have you compared them? Are they russian, chineses or JJ etc?

I really don`t want to shit on your work in any kind of way, I`m happy people are doing good quality videos to comparing those amps and actually I was waiting for this comparison. I`m just interested what tubes they use as I would possibly shoot for the same configuration.
Thanks

All good! To be honest, I didn't open the amps up to take a look. I believe most people won't really go through that "trouble" unless there's something wrong, so I guess my comparison is more from a "average consumer" perspective in that sense.

 

[pipboy90]

I think people put way too much stock into how much tubes contribute to the sound of an amp. You can almost always dial in an amp to sound nearly the same regardless of tube type with different EQ/knob settings. In this case the biggest contributing factor to the difference in sound is the types of parts used in each build and their tolerances.

 

[easstudios]

I think people put way too much stock into how much tubes contribute to the sound of an amp. You can almost always dial in an amp to sound nearly the same regardless of tube type with different EQ/knob settings. In this case the biggest contributing factor to the difference in sound is the types of parts used in each build and their tolerances.

Just to be clear, I'm not saying that brands or even types of tubes are going to sound noticeably different (often when people compare its not a like for like test). But the bias between these 2 amps is almost certainly not the same, even if everything else in the amp is identical , a different bias will have a noticeable effect on a 5150/6505.

Bear in mind that the stock circuit has a fixed resistor rather than a bias adjustment, so the actual bias of the amp is TOTALLY dependent on how each particular quad of valves measure. They are biased so cold that you'll really notice if its particularly low, or just starting to get into a kind of "normal-ish" operating range.

 

[Nolly]

I agree with the comments here, it's a very subtle difference and is definitely well within the realm of pot tolerances and bias. There is some consistency though, in that my OG block letter does need the treble and presence slightly higher than my early signature or 6505.

 

[blackie13]

When you started the demo, what was obvious was the difference in power tube biasing...
The cold biasing results in this crossover distortion (metallic-sterile)...
When you said about volume difference it is clear...its the biasing...

 

[Deleted member 27494]

What's always interesting to me with these types of things is that some people hear "massive differences" while others perceive the differences as very subtle or virtually non existent. In this case I'm somewhere in between. I can definitely hear a noticeable difference and it's far from subtle.

 

[gibson5413]

I thought it was a great comparison. Usually I can't hear any major differences in these kinds of videos but I definitely heard them hear. The 6505 sounded a bit brighter and fizzier (not in a bad way). The 1992 sounded creamier but still had that core 5150 tone. Both sounded great but if I could only have one it would be the 1992. I like that you used the same exact settings for both amps. Love your videos!

 

[saxxamafone]

Nice test as always mate.

A test that would be interesting would be to see if 2 amps of the same model show the same subtle differences as your test here?

Eg. Would 2 of the new 1992 amps sounds EXACTLY the same or would they show these subtle differences too?

 

[Deleted member 27494]

Nice test as always mate.

A test that would be interesting would be to see if 2 amps of the same model show the same subtle differences as your test here?

Eg. Would 2 of the new 1992 amps sounds EXACTLY the same or would they show these subtle differences too?

I believe that if you would compare two 1992s they would sound much more similar but that's just my opinion. In the past I have compared (modern) amps of the same model or variations of very similar designs and in my experience they tend to sound quite similar most often, despite me not touching the tubes and bias etc. Maybe with older amps there are bigger variations due to switching out components etc.

 

[saxxamafone]

I believe that if you would compare two 1992s they would sound much more similar but that's just my opinion. In the past I have compared (modern) amps of the same model or variations of very similar designs and in my experience they tend to sound quite similar most often, despite me not touching the tubes and bias etc. Maybe with older amps there are bigger variations due to switching out components etc.

I'm guessing manufacturing processes are tighter these days too which results in less component differences.


by the way, you should do a video on your mixing and mastering process at some stage.

What sort of plug-ins and tricks you use etc.

You pull a great mix!