Schaller Vintage Tremolo 3801 tuning problem

[Vagrant123]

Hey guys,

I recently replaced Floyd Rose with Schaller Vintage Tremolo and I can't tune my guitar properly. I must say though, that I have standard (non-locking) tuners.

The thing is, that after picking open strings and making sure that they're in tune, I'm moving forward to setting intonation.
I'm checking each string at the 12th fret, and it turns out that it's sharp compared to the pitch of an open string. So I'm lengthening the strings by adjusting the saddle backs, but that doesn't help with intonation. Moreover, it raises the pitch of the whole string! I have never experienced the same thing with my Floyd...

So, what am I doing wrong? Is it because I have standard tuners installed and locking tuners are necessary to properly tune the strings?
Please help.

 

[PWE Amplification]

It will never work. The position of the studs relative to the nut is different on the Schaller Vintage. Buy the non fine tuner Floyd instead. Also, it's completely normal for the pitch of the strings to change once you move the saddles on this bridge as well as a Floyd Rose. Locking tuners would only make a difference when using the tream, not during setup.

 

[Vagrant123]

Thanks for your reply.

I saw a video of a guy who replaced his Floyd with Schaller Vintage on Youtube. It seemed to work well, so I figured out I should give it a shot...

 

[Dave L]

Yeah, if the saddles are placed differently in relation to the pivot points than on the Schaller Floyd the range of intonation could be too little in one direction or the other. It could intonate properly with other string gauges and/or brands, though. But are you saying that moving the saddle doesn't change the intonation at all?

I just checked the tech drawings, and there is 0,7mm difference in how the pivot point relates to the front edge of the baseplate. Probably enough to mess up intonation range in some cases.

 

[Vagrant123]

But are you saying that moving the saddle doesn't change the intonation at all?

It doesn't. At all.
It changes the pitch of a string. So when I'm moving the saddle of 1st string away from the bridge pickup, it's changing the pitch of the string, as if I was turning a tuner on the headstock. But the intonation remains the same.

 

[Dave L]

So when you retune to the right pitch the intonation is exactly as before you moved the saddle? Since you're moving the saddle the pitch will rise as you do it, that's just how it works since you're stretching the string, but that it doesn't change the intonation as well seems odd.

 

[Vagrant123]

Right, I'm picking the 1st string, which is e, and checking the pitch on the 12th fret, which is e +20 cents. Then I'm moving the saddle, and the pitch of the open string rises up to, say F, so the pitch on the 12th fret rises accordingly (F +20 cents). The same is on the other strings: 2nd open - B, 12th is B +30 cents and so on... It doesn't matter whether I move the saddles to the right or to the left, the difference between the open string and the 12th fret is the same, let alone the higher frets.

I'm really confused and don't know what to do. The tremolo is a real Schaller, not a fake, and like I mentioned earlier, I have never had the same situation with my Floyd Rose...