To re-voice the Rebel 20 amp

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thickwood

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I was amazed the warm sounding DiGiTech Bad Monkey over-drive pedal had such a natural rock guitar sound !
I like highs but the R-20 amp is too bright for me !
I never liked the slap you in the face pick attack.
Its a totally fun r&r Blues amp sound and its fun as heck.

You can re-voice the amp with any pedal but that warm overdrive is perfectly matched and what I wanted !
Eureke I like this amp and pedal combination !

My Bad Monkey was modified by modestmikesmods !

None of my post are valid if you can not hear a difference changing the V1 preamp 12ax7 tube !
Some folks just hear no difference , maybe they play blaring loud ?

I have vastly improved the Rebel 20 and use that preamp signal out of the FX loop to feed a BadCat Cougar and its amazing and a full sound , the Radial Big Shot ABY amp Switcher pedal that plays both at once !!!!

I never had this sound using stock 12ax7 tubes .
 
To be honest .. I'd never put a Digitech in front of my egnater, and seems you're unable to eq properly your amp.
 
The Bad Monkey is a great OD bang for the buck.....never rule out anything on principle.
 
Never mind the good sounding Digitech Bad Monkey pedal I put a Tungsram 12ax7 in the OD socket and a GE5751 next to it and wow .
That Rebel 20 head sounds soooo gooood it sounds like a totally different amp ?
I played it through a Celestion 70/80 speaker and no nasty garage grundge crunch but smooth sustain and silky beautiful highs without that crispy highs pick attack now awesome !

If you ever heard a RCA long black plate 12ax7 tube pushed,the sound the Rebel 20 has now sounds similar but better especially the highs which are magic !
TUNGSRAM ARE RARE !
 
What cab and speakers might get you where you want ? I wish mine had more thump.... But small amps I never found one that really did that.
 
The GE 5751 has the deepest bass response but some amps get too boomy !

But I remembered a new 7025 a new china designed tube hard too find but its on flea bay about $15 .
So I put this 7025 in to push the GE 5751 and better still , no harshness in the highs and big bottom end too !

I think I found the best Blues & Classic Rock sound with Humbuckers ive ever experienced with the R20 amp !

My R20 is so even in tone I do not need a warm Bad Monkey overdrive pedal too tame it !

So freaks for a great tone the GE5751 tube in the first socket and the 7025 china design with no chrome plate support note is the 2 tubes you need.
Anyone not using a sovtek 12ax7LPS tube for the PI socket get one that is if you use overdrive breakup is a must !
 
It seems that the worse valve/cone matching is the factory one. How could it be ?
IMHO many of us suffer of some common disease, called "I changed this little thing and MAGICALLY I have seen an unicorn".

Just turn it loud and play it, dudes.
 
When a Amp and Guitar sounds right I know it because I actually listen to it !
The texture of the pick attack must not be harsh or I can not play it truthfully !
If you can just play your stock sounding amp then more power too ya !

Blues and blues rock must in my opinion sound great and took many years for me to get a perspective on how to get a tone that I'm happy with.
Glass slide will not lie , cut the highs and it sounds lifeless , get the highs sweet and sounding awesome and your there.
The sound is why I play the guitars I have , not too show off but I want the best sound I can get .
 
thickwood":1j124enn said:
When a Amp and Guitar sounds right I know it because I actually listen to it !
The texture of the pick attack must not be harsh or I can not play it truthfully !
If you can just play your stock sounding amp then more power too ya !

Blues and blues rock must in my opinion sound great and took many years for me to get a perspective on how to get a tone that I'm happy with.
Glass slide will not lie , cut the highs and it sounds lifeless , get the highs sweet and sounding awesome and your there.
The sound is why I play the guitars I have , not too show off but I want the best sound I can get .
Click to expand...

This or you are unable to get the best from the gear you have, and you need to continuosly pump - swap - change components, while you can get the same results with a proper eq and/or a proper volume/gain settings. In general, I trust Egnater and their engineer: they know a lot more than me. But these are opinions :)
 
A EQ adjustment is needed but the controls for it are resistors that cut the tone and mids & bass !
Preamp tube types have there own EQ output some good and some bad in the particular circuit its in !
No exact science has been perfected for guitar amp tube tone due too the circuits have wide ranges of resistance in there designs and transformers also are key componets !

Some players have no concept of what different harmonic textures are possible , so no need too explore it !
Words can not explain some things , trust your ears and try things like speakers / pedals of all types/ tubes /guitars/ but once your amp is good sounding you will reach yet another level in your playing I found out !
I never imagined I could get a Rebel 20 and Rebel 30 could sound as they do, as each is very different due too the designs, now My Jet City 2212c with a $19 tube tamed all the harshness I did not have on other tube amps ?

I was surprised and amazed when I put a vintage mullard 12ax7 in V2 , crunch channel is beyond my other amp tone improvements !
A tube change is like a microphone change from cardoid too ribbon in the studio and is a must !
 
Next amp I need too re-tube is a marvelous Laney VC-30 combo , its a great stage amp in my opinion !
Its a very Vox or Highwatt like, a bright sounding amp it is but has a very good Tom Petty American tone.

Next payday I will order the $19 7025 new designed china made tube like I used in the Jet City 2212c
That tube has bigger plates and no shiny plate support clamp.
Its not for warm sounding amps , but bright amps yep !
 
Did I mention for 3 years I did not like the Rebel 20 head tones.
I could only get a harsh grunge crunch that sounded ok only for garage punk rockers only when cranked !

I tube rolled the preamp 12ax7 tubes with all new production tubes and vintage ax7 many times.
I read the bright Marshall amp guys swore by pushing the Tungsram ax7 in the gain socket !

That tube in OD is by far has most harmonic resonate magic I have heard of all my tubes , the problem with amps is harshness so the bright as hell R20 head needed a major EQ adjustment so I found it when I put the 7025 new design china design in V1 the smooth smokey sound really set the tone smoother on the highs with a good bass response !

Tungsram 12ax7 are $$ expencive and rare but so good and your lucky too have one in the OD too hear that great tone !
I like the breakup set where chords work and leads sing nicely.
I do no high gain stuff I'm more classic rock or Blues with a glass slide .

I hate too say a China 7025 no shiny plate clip type in V1 set the EQ so perfect on the Rebel 20 and gave the Tungsram what it needed .

The GE 5751 in V1 gave huge bass response but a bit too many highs , so the 7025 gave singing silky highs that are magic sounding !

I am playing a better sounding Rebel 20 finally that I luv !
 
I luv the Rebel 20 at last , V1 GE 5751 has a fat midrange and extended bass range which I cut down !
V2 I put the Tungsram 12ax7 expensive but the most harmonic tone of most any vintage tube no joke .

V3- of course the best phase inverter you can find sovtek 12ax7 long plate balanced triodes.

JJ tesla 6v6gt and JJ el84 are strong , but hang on when you cut it up the power tubes have there own gain sound compared to the preamp !
Set the EQ after your pants are flapping too get the best sound.

Surprize was the Radial engineering BIG SHOT ABY pedal , my vintage Laney VC-30 sounds like the Rebel 20 as I feed the Laney the R20 FX loop signal with the big shot and wow the Laney has a magic tone it never had.
Ive learned much trying everything I can think of and the Tone IS BETTER THAN I COULD IMAGINE now !
The BBE Sonic stomp pedal at the end of my FX chain restores the thick mids and bass while slightly trimming the highs great pedal !
 
Listen and trust your ears , not the cheap tubes sellers put in there !
The Rebel 20 harshness is gone , the final tube change was needed because once I cranked the R20 up it was had to much bottom end and flubby but lower volumes were good practice setting with the GE 5751 tube.
I went with a RCA 12ax7 long black plate and whoa , being pushed by a Raytheon 5751 black plate kept the gain and sound way good and no pedals are needed !
Trust your ears and go thru all the gain settings and EQ tweaking until you realize it actually blows away the stock tubes !
My SRS bias probe reads plate voltage and it seems low 327vdc on the R20 and 335vdc on the R30 amp ?
Humm ? I thought it would be 365 and 372 about like other reviews .
 
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