two problems with my new vh 4

[durbodill]

Hello everybody,

I'm new to this forum, although I've been playing about 15 years. I've been using a 6L6 Hughes&Kettner Triamp MK1 for the past 10 years, recently with a tc electronic NOVA system in the parallel FX-loop. My main guitar is a Gibson Les Paul Studio with an EMG 81 in bridge position and an EMG 89.

Recently I needed to renew my amplifier because it's been pretty much falling apart after years of intense (ab)use. I decided to try something new and got myself a brand new EL34 loaded Diezel VH 4. I actually got it today and even though I just tried it at bedroom level, I'm amazed about how good it sounds.

That was until I tried my NOVA system with it. I only use the unit to thicken up the lead sound with some delay and the usual chorus/delay/compressor combination when playing clean. Here comes problem #1: I basically swapped the NOVA from my old amplifier's parallel loop (all wet) to the Diezel's (all wet, too). Although I made no changes to the FX-unit whatsoever and the wet/dry-knob on the Diezel is all wet, I get those nasty phasing cancellations described in the manual. Sounds like a "stuck" phaser. Never had any problems with that on my other amp. The only way to get rid of them is to put the unit in the series loop but that means compromising some of the tone plus it's not switchable. So that's not really an option. Or am I doing something seriously wrong? How can I get rid of the cancellations and still use the switchable parallel loop?

Problem #2, speaking of loops: Of course, although right now I don't really have a use for them, I had to try the channel inserts with the NOVA. Everything works as expected on channel 2-4. But channel 1 just turns mute (not quiet, but mute - no sound at all) when the channel insert is active. Again: Am I doing something wrong or is there really a problem with the insert?

Maybe there's something I missed, or maybe I just got a Monday's model (as we say in Germany). Either way, I'm thankful for any input, even if that would mean I'd have to have the amp replaced.

Ihr könnt mir auch gern auf deutsch antworten, ich bin dankbar für alles. Ich brauche den Amp dringend für Aufnahmen und live, also muss ich die Sachen schnell in den Griff bekommen.

Vielen Dank schonmal, thank you in advance ;-)

Till

 

[slyvren]

#1 As far as I know the nova system doesn't have a "kill dry" or 100% wet feature. Unless they've updated it? You'll probably need a unit that offers this to run with the vh4 (or alternatively use the serial loop). I've seen other posts with this same problem.

#2 try a patch cable that you know works directly connecting send to return on the channel 1 loop, and then double check you still have no sound with the insert activated.. if that's the case you may have a problem with the amp.


-John

 

[durbodill]

#1 As far as I know the nova system doesn't have a "kill dry" or 100% wet feature. Unless they've updated it? You'll probably need a unit that offers this to run with the vh4 (or alternatively use the serial loop). I've seen other posts with this same problem.

#2 try a patch cable that you know works directly connecting send to return on the channel 1 loop, and then double check you still have no sound with the insert activated.. if that's the case you may have a problem with the amp.


-John

Thanks for the quick reply, man I could have thought of the patch cable thing myself...It works on all loops except the channel 1. If I crank the master volume to 12 o'clock, I can hear what I play at about speech volume. That must be an issue and I'll probably have to ship it back...sucks!!!

Concerning #1: I guess you're right, I stumbled upon a couple of posts in the tc electronic forum that described the same problem with a bunch of different amps including the vh 4. I just haven't thought of it until now because it has worked so flawlessly in my old amplifier. Why did it work there and why doesn't it work here? Guess I'll never know, I just think expensive gear should be functioning together, per se.

 

[slyvren]

No problem!! Email Diezel. It might be something easy to fix. As for the TC electronic stuff it's their choice in thinking the unit is "best" in a serial loop so they chose not to include an option for the parallel guys. I think you just got really lucky it worked on your last amp as the nova system is not made to be used in that way. Try a digitech or lots of people have luck with Diezel and the g-major(2) from tc electronics ran in the serial loop. I'm pretty sure it also has the kill dry for parallel.

 

[Peter Diezel]

Hallo Till,

anscheinend hast Du Probleme mit Deinem Effektgerät.
Du kannst gerne mit dem ganzen Zeug mal nach Bad
Steben kommen.

Beste Grüße,

Peter

 

[durbodill]

Hallo Peter,

vielen Dank für die schnelle Antwort! Nochmal, der Amp klingt wirklich toll und ich bin froh, dass ich ihn gekauft habe!

Ich habe auch ehrlich gesagt daran gedacht, dass es u. U. an dem Effekt liegen könnte. Wie gesagt, im TC-Forum hatten einige Leute Probleme mit dem Nova, mit allen möglichen Amps.

Das einzige, was mir tatsächlich etwas Sorgen macht, ist der Insert von CH 1. Ich habe den mal mit einem Klinkenkabel überbrückt und es war tatsächlich so, dass der Amp nahezu stumm war, wenn ich den Insert aktiviert habe.

Ich würde darum gern das Angebot annehmen, mal nach Bad Steben zu kommen, zumal ich zum Glück nicht sehr weit fahren müsste (wohne in Halle). Bin aber (leider) berufstätig und darum bis Ende August erstmal indisponiert. Würde den nächsten Gig erstmal mit dem Effekt im seriellen Weg spielen und Anfang September mal vorbeikommen.

Geht das einfach so? Muss ich jemanden anrufen/bescheidgeben etc.?

Besten Dank nochmals und liebe Grüße,

Till

 

[Peter Diezel]

Ruf´ einfach an, bevor Du kommst.

Meine Emailadresse ist:

peterdiezel (at) diezelamplification (dot) com

 

[elfredoo]

check your gate in the nova if you have it turned on. perhaps the clean sound is not as hot as channel 2-4, so that the gate wouldn't open.

 

[sickgoose]

The "stuck" phaser sound is only there when the Nova System-unit is ON and all the Nova System-effects are off...right?

 

[durbodill]

The "stuck" phaser sound is only there when the Nova System-unit is ON and all the Nova System-effects are off...right?

Hey sickgoose,

I tried to find that out actually. I think once a modulation effect is engaged, the phase problem almost disappears. That makes total sense to me, because of the way modulation effects work. As long as I only have a delay or reverb on, it's still there. Kind of annoying. As much as I do like a chorus, I don't want to keep it on all the time - especially not for leads. Do you by chance know how to get rid of that? My spare/old cheap Zoom multi effect unit doesn't sound as good as the Nova but works perfectly in the VH4 parallel FX loop.

Guess the Nova and the VH4 aren't a good combination after all. I just found out that I couldn't get the Nova to switch channels on the VH4. I thought I was a complete idiot but after reading posts on some boards, the problem seems to be in the way the Nova sends the MIDI program change messages. And there is no cheap way to get rid of that problem so I might have to get rid of the unit in favor of something like a G-Major 2.

Greetings,

Till

 

[Peter Diezel]

Till,

komm´ doch erst mal vorbei und lass´ uns das
mal gemeinsam checken.

Besten Gruß,

Peter

 

[durbodill]

Till,

komm´ doch erst mal vorbei und lass´ uns das
mal gemeinsam checken.

Besten Gruß,

Peter

Peter, so machmers Bin halt etwas undgeduldig und will spielen
-> und komme mir bei dem Versuch vor wie in Vollidiot

Bis dann, viele Grüße und vor allem vielen Dank für die angebotene Hilfe, ist ja nicht selbstverständlich,

Till

 

[sickgoose]

The TC Nova System is designed for use in front of the amp, (still a tone-sucker).
imho this is the only way to use the TC Nova-System with the VH4 in the parallel loop of the amp (see pic)

- don't use the unit for switching channels.
- check if the "speaker simulator" in the nova is off
- check the input&output gain level in the nova
- check the gate in the nova
- Get a Diezel Columbus !

 

[durbodill]

Sickgoose,

thanks for the help. Put my Nova in the serial loop and borrowed an old Digitech Control Seven for amp and effect switching. Works perfectly. It was definitely designed for both in front of the amp and its effects loop (why else would it have a drive and line input). With the VH4 or any other good sounding amp I don't see any reason to use it in front, though.

Greets, Till