ChurchHill
New member
Been doing some tweaking lately, rolling tubes through some of my amps, so I thought I'd run the following past everyone just to see if I'm missing something.
First, I'm limiting this to just 12AX7s and excluding any of the variants. AT, AU, AY, 5751, and various mid-gain AX I've left out only because I'm trying to keep this relatively simple.
Second, while I've got a decent stash of NOS tubes, I'm also leaving those out. I have some "vintage" amps that those are reserved for, mostly since that's what they were designed around. I think most if not all new amps are designed around new production tubes, so I try to stay true to that. It's not that I think I couldn't find at least as good if not better NOS. It's just that I'm trying to keep mine for the amps that really do need them.
Right now, I've got ten types that I've run through different amps with different results. I expected that, as some tubes work better in some circuits than they do in others, not to mention the differences between similar tubs due to manufacturing tolerances. Then, there are four that I am aware of that I do not currently have. I'll note all of these below.
What I'd like to learn about is what everyone else has experienced with these tubes. Are there any others that I'm not listing that I should try? Also, I doubt all of this information is correct and/or complete. So, please correct me as necessary and please let me know if I'm missing any details about these tubes.
OK... here's the list in (roughly) alphabetical order. If I seem to, or just flat out say, that I prefer one tube over another, it's an over-generalization. The truth is that I've had good luck with ALL of these tubes, in the right amp for them. None of them *always* work, regardless of the amp. Sure, I have my favorites, but it's not my intention to give the impression that any one is better than any other. Just my opinions and in my amps (with my cabs, guitars, fingers, etc.).
1. Electro-Harmonix 12AX7EH Gold Pin - From what I can tell, this is the same tube as the standard pin 12AX7EH. Good amount of gain, not a lot of definition, fairly balanced tone, but the highs can be a little smeared. I've had good luck with these in lower-gain amps like a Fender Champ.
2. Genalex 12AX7/ECC83/B759 Gold Pin - While the plate's not short, it's not as long as some of the other long plate tubes. Average gain, good definition, pretty balanced tone. The mids are a little weird. They either seem to be exactly what the amp needs or exactly what it doesn't. It's a good tube, no doubt, but doesn't quite live up to the hype (and the price). Still, though, it's a great tube and is one of my favorites.
3. Genalex 12AX7/ECC83 Standard - I've heard that these are the same as the next generation Chinese, e.g. Ruby 12AX7 AC7 HG+. Sounds like a modern Chinese, in other words, pretty good. Good gain, decent clarity, wide tonal response with thick mids, almost congested in some amps.
4. JJ 12AX7/ECC83S Gold Pin - This seems identical to the standard pin JJ 12AX7/ECC83S. I'll admit, I'm not a big fan of this one. It's not bad and used to be one of the best available. Compared to some others, it just seems a little lifeless and bland in everything I've tried in it recently.
5. JJ ECC803S Gold Pin - This also seems identical to the standard pin JJ ECC803S. This one is almost the opposite of the JJ ECC83S. Good gain, but not over the top, warm full tone, good definition. Works well in later stages to smooth things out a bit. Works well in the first stage, in some amps, where you want a solid foundation to start with. Starting to think that there really is something to the "long plates have better tone" thing.
6. Mullard 12AX7/ECC83 - This long plate works really well in some amps, and really doesn't in others. Kind of similar to the Gold Lion 12AX7/ECC83/B759, the Mullard seems a little brighter, neither are harsh. One of my favorites.
7. Mullard CV4004/12AX7 - Not quite as toneful as the 12AX7/ECC83, but still nice. Noticeably more gain, too. Thick mids without as much smearing as the 12AX7EH.
8. Ruby 12AX7 AC5 HG+ - I'm not sure, but I think this may be the same Chinese tube that Mesa is using currently for their SP12AX7. I haven't peeled off the shrink wrap to find out, but the exposed parts look the same and they sound the same. Great gain, bright without being harsh, good separation considering the gain levels. I've had great luck with this tube in several amps and it never sounded bad in anything I've tried it in so far. This one may not always my favorite, it's a great tube all-around.
9. Sovtek 12AX7LPS - Another long plate that really surprised me. I've always heard this one is good in the PI, but it works well in the first stage, too. It's a little smoother than the JJ ECC803S, but otherwise sounds pretty similar.
10. Tung Sol 12AX7/ECC803S Gold Pin - As with some others, this seems to be the same tube as the standard pin version. This is another tube, like the Gold Lion and Mullard, that either works wonders or not at all. In some amps, it was just too dark sounding. In others, it had the perfect amount of upper-mid bite. Another of my favorites.
Here's the list of the ones I don't have... should I be trying these, too?
1. Sovtek 12AX7WA/7025 - I last tried this one about 15 years ago and just wasn't impressed. It may have improved since then, and I know it came stock in some amps. I just don't have any current samples to test.
2. Sovtek 12AX7WB/7025 - I think I tried this around the same time as the 12AX7WA. I remember it being a little different, but I didn't really like it any better. Just don't have any laying around.
3. Sovtek 12AX7WC - This one, I haven't tried. I've seen some good things about it online, when I've seen anything at all. There's not much to go on, bad or good, so I just didn't bother with this one.
4. Svetlana 12AX7SV - This is the one made by New Sensor (not Winged =C=, I don't think they're making any tubes at the moment). I've never tried it and only recently became aware of it.
So... what am I missing?
I've got to admit, all the different brands/types coming out of China these days are confusing to say the least. I'm sure a lot of them are just relabeled, but I've read a few things that suggested there may be two or three factories in China that are manufacturing tubes now. Has anybody made any sense of what's going on over there?
Finally, I'd really like to hear your experiences with these (or other) tubes, too.
First, I'm limiting this to just 12AX7s and excluding any of the variants. AT, AU, AY, 5751, and various mid-gain AX I've left out only because I'm trying to keep this relatively simple.
Second, while I've got a decent stash of NOS tubes, I'm also leaving those out. I have some "vintage" amps that those are reserved for, mostly since that's what they were designed around. I think most if not all new amps are designed around new production tubes, so I try to stay true to that. It's not that I think I couldn't find at least as good if not better NOS. It's just that I'm trying to keep mine for the amps that really do need them.
Right now, I've got ten types that I've run through different amps with different results. I expected that, as some tubes work better in some circuits than they do in others, not to mention the differences between similar tubs due to manufacturing tolerances. Then, there are four that I am aware of that I do not currently have. I'll note all of these below.
What I'd like to learn about is what everyone else has experienced with these tubes. Are there any others that I'm not listing that I should try? Also, I doubt all of this information is correct and/or complete. So, please correct me as necessary and please let me know if I'm missing any details about these tubes.
OK... here's the list in (roughly) alphabetical order. If I seem to, or just flat out say, that I prefer one tube over another, it's an over-generalization. The truth is that I've had good luck with ALL of these tubes, in the right amp for them. None of them *always* work, regardless of the amp. Sure, I have my favorites, but it's not my intention to give the impression that any one is better than any other. Just my opinions and in my amps (with my cabs, guitars, fingers, etc.).
1. Electro-Harmonix 12AX7EH Gold Pin - From what I can tell, this is the same tube as the standard pin 12AX7EH. Good amount of gain, not a lot of definition, fairly balanced tone, but the highs can be a little smeared. I've had good luck with these in lower-gain amps like a Fender Champ.
2. Genalex 12AX7/ECC83/B759 Gold Pin - While the plate's not short, it's not as long as some of the other long plate tubes. Average gain, good definition, pretty balanced tone. The mids are a little weird. They either seem to be exactly what the amp needs or exactly what it doesn't. It's a good tube, no doubt, but doesn't quite live up to the hype (and the price). Still, though, it's a great tube and is one of my favorites.
3. Genalex 12AX7/ECC83 Standard - I've heard that these are the same as the next generation Chinese, e.g. Ruby 12AX7 AC7 HG+. Sounds like a modern Chinese, in other words, pretty good. Good gain, decent clarity, wide tonal response with thick mids, almost congested in some amps.
4. JJ 12AX7/ECC83S Gold Pin - This seems identical to the standard pin JJ 12AX7/ECC83S. I'll admit, I'm not a big fan of this one. It's not bad and used to be one of the best available. Compared to some others, it just seems a little lifeless and bland in everything I've tried in it recently.
5. JJ ECC803S Gold Pin - This also seems identical to the standard pin JJ ECC803S. This one is almost the opposite of the JJ ECC83S. Good gain, but not over the top, warm full tone, good definition. Works well in later stages to smooth things out a bit. Works well in the first stage, in some amps, where you want a solid foundation to start with. Starting to think that there really is something to the "long plates have better tone" thing.
6. Mullard 12AX7/ECC83 - This long plate works really well in some amps, and really doesn't in others. Kind of similar to the Gold Lion 12AX7/ECC83/B759, the Mullard seems a little brighter, neither are harsh. One of my favorites.
7. Mullard CV4004/12AX7 - Not quite as toneful as the 12AX7/ECC83, but still nice. Noticeably more gain, too. Thick mids without as much smearing as the 12AX7EH.
8. Ruby 12AX7 AC5 HG+ - I'm not sure, but I think this may be the same Chinese tube that Mesa is using currently for their SP12AX7. I haven't peeled off the shrink wrap to find out, but the exposed parts look the same and they sound the same. Great gain, bright without being harsh, good separation considering the gain levels. I've had great luck with this tube in several amps and it never sounded bad in anything I've tried it in so far. This one may not always my favorite, it's a great tube all-around.
9. Sovtek 12AX7LPS - Another long plate that really surprised me. I've always heard this one is good in the PI, but it works well in the first stage, too. It's a little smoother than the JJ ECC803S, but otherwise sounds pretty similar.
10. Tung Sol 12AX7/ECC803S Gold Pin - As with some others, this seems to be the same tube as the standard pin version. This is another tube, like the Gold Lion and Mullard, that either works wonders or not at all. In some amps, it was just too dark sounding. In others, it had the perfect amount of upper-mid bite. Another of my favorites.
Here's the list of the ones I don't have... should I be trying these, too?
1. Sovtek 12AX7WA/7025 - I last tried this one about 15 years ago and just wasn't impressed. It may have improved since then, and I know it came stock in some amps. I just don't have any current samples to test.
2. Sovtek 12AX7WB/7025 - I think I tried this around the same time as the 12AX7WA. I remember it being a little different, but I didn't really like it any better. Just don't have any laying around.
3. Sovtek 12AX7WC - This one, I haven't tried. I've seen some good things about it online, when I've seen anything at all. There's not much to go on, bad or good, so I just didn't bother with this one.
4. Svetlana 12AX7SV - This is the one made by New Sensor (not Winged =C=, I don't think they're making any tubes at the moment). I've never tried it and only recently became aware of it.
So... what am I missing?
I've got to admit, all the different brands/types coming out of China these days are confusing to say the least. I'm sure a lot of them are just relabeled, but I've read a few things that suggested there may be two or three factories in China that are manufacturing tubes now. Has anybody made any sense of what's going on over there?
Finally, I'd really like to hear your experiences with these (or other) tubes, too.