Are there any differences feel/tonewise between front loaded 4x12's and rear loaded 4x12's?

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Bash_Man said:
My ears hear this between my RL Splawn 412 and FL Soldano 412.

RL: deeper sound, more pronounced low end. Spreads a bit more around the room, BUT the sound changes between the front and and side of cab

FL: Sound not as deep, but not lacking on the low end. low end is tighter than RL, however, it has more pronounced high end or you could say more high-end sparkle. I actually had to turn down the bass control on my amp with the FL, but that may also be cause the Soldano 412 is a bit of a smaller size box overall.

Again, that's what my ears hear.

Cheers
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And this.

FL- more 'present', raw/open sounding, less perceived lows.
RL-Deeper, thicker, smoother sounding with less perceived high end.
 
Alright, so I used a router to modify my Avatar 4x12 Contemporary to be front loadable and did a back to back comparison.

FL definitely increases the high end. Walking around the room the cab was no more or less directional but the increased highs can fool you into thinking FL is more directional 'cause when you stand right in front it's like, "damn that's a lot of high end blasting my face".

FL sounds more present, and for lack of a better description it's like it's alive in the room right in front of your face.

RL sounds more like the sound is coming from an adjacent room, kind of cavern-like I guess, sort of hollow sounding.

That's the best I can do trying to describe it, beyond that you'll need to see for yourself.

Side note, I've never liked rear loaded cabs, I picked this cab up recently and it's mega stiff (only the tiniest amount of resonance), I thought I was gonna get rid of it, but now that it's front loaded and I removed the center brace (to increase resonance) it's a really good sounding cab. Night and day difference, this cab went from meh to awesome.

beforeAfter2.jpg
 
boltzthrower said:
Alright, so I used a router to modify my Avatar 4x12 Contemporary to be front loadable and did a back to back comparison.

FL definitely increases the high end. Walking around the room the cab was no more or less directional but the increased highs can fool you into thinking FL is more directional 'cause when you stand right in front it's like, "damn that's a lot of high end blasting my face".

FL sounds more present, and for lack of a better description it's like it's alive in the room right in front of your face.

RL sounds more like the sound is coming from an adjacent room, kind of cavern-like I guess, sort of hollow sounding.

That's the best I can do trying to describe it, beyond that you'll need to see for yourself.

Side note, I've never liked rear loaded cabs, I picked this cab up recently and it's mega stiff (only the tiniest amount of resonance), I thought I was gonna get rid of it, but now that it's front loaded and I removed the center brace (to increase resonance) it's a really good sounding cab. Night and day difference, this cab went from meh to awesome.

View attachment 279962
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Get pillow stuffing and fill the cab. That’s how Bogner did the FL Uberkab. You will lose yourself in crunchy riff bliss!

Also, FL cabs benefit IMMENSELY from Mitchell Donuts. Ask @stephen sawall
 
The donuts make the cab much less directional. The tone sounds pretty much the same everywhere in the room.

I have used them in 4x12 cabs in the past.
 
Nigel said:
Amen. Maybe we should make a forum cab or something.
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It's darker with the donuts. Just adjust the amp to make up for it.

I have not used them for years. But still have the foam to do a few 4x12 cabs.

Not everyone likes them. In some ways it reminds me of a open back sound.

If you like the sound directly in front of the cab you kind of loose that.

All you can do is try it and see if it works for you.
 
Yngwie’s crew once tried outfitting his entire Marshall back line with Mitchell donuts to curb the volume. Unfortunately, the show was as loud as ever as Yngwie was famished.
 
Isn’t there typically different construction techniques used on these cabs also? RL have a thin removable back vs FL with a thick permanent back & easily removable grille. This has to affect the tone..right? I have some old Carvin V212s that I love…FL, vertical, angled.. They have a lot more low end than other 2x12s I’ve tried.. I love a 4x12 but they are a close second.
 
I had an old V4 cab that was like 800lbs empty that I loaded with Altecs to make a nice 1500lbs. LOL
Seriously the cab was the heaviest empty cab I've ever owned. Compared it to other V4s and this one was always much heavier. I used this cab with a 1992 Recto cab on top. That stack just always sounded glorious. The V4 wasnt beamy, but more direct sounding than my RL Boogie. I know a few guys who play very tight agressive stuff and love the way the FL sounds for what they are doing. For overall styles I would go RL but if you regularly play with a stack I would try the FL on the bottom. Could also have been the speaker mixing, but RL and FL did sound great together.
 
Scordare said:
Isn’t there typically different construction techniques used on these cabs also? RL have a thin removable back vs FL with a thick permanent back & easily removable grille. This has to affect the tone..right? I have some old Carvin V212s that I love…FL, vertical, angled.. They have a lot more low end than other 2x12s I’ve tried.. I love a 4x12 but they are a close second.
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I’ve never seen a quality cab with a thin rear panel; all the ones I’ve owned have been the same ply that the sides/bottom/top are made out of. If it’s properly sealed I doubt there’s any difference and IME a “fully sealed” cab sounds just the slightest bit different from one where a little air leaks out the jack plate/rear panel/etc.

As far as what affects the low end, I don’t fully understand it. More internal volume will increase lows, thinner baffle increases low end resonance, but I recently picked up an ENGL Pro slant 4x12, it’s a smaller cab with typical ~3/4” ply but it’s heavy as hell and has an enormous low end, it’s so much I’m probably gonna get rid of it, it almost sounds like there’s a bass player come through the cab, its kind of ridiculous.
 
boltzthrower said:
all the ones I’ve owned have been the same ply that the sides/bottom/top are made out of.
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I haven't owned many, but that's my experience too. Peavey 412MS had 3/4" plywood for the back panel, and the Kustom 412Q(?) had MDF the same thickness as the rest of the cab from what I can tell.
boltzthrower said:
I’m probably gonna get rid of it, it almost sounds like there’s a bass player come through the cab, its kind of ridiculous.
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1) Does it have batting inside it?
2) Are any of it's dimensions the same, or divisible by each other? E.g., height and width are the same.
 
7704A said:
I haven't owned many, but that's my experience too. Peavey 412MS had 3/4" plywood for the back panel, and the Kustom 412Q(?) had MDF the same thickness as the rest of the cab from what I can tell.

1) Does it have batting inside it?
2) Are any of it's dimensions the same, or divisible by each other? E.g., height and width are the same.
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1) Yes, egg crate foam on the rear panel.
2) Yes, the interior length and height are both 27.25”. Is that some sort of enclosure design issue?
 
boltzthrower said:
1) Yes, egg crate foam on the rear panel.
2) Yes, the interior length and height are both 27.25”. Is that some sort of enclosure design issue?
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My understanding is that identical dimensions promote resonances. In this case, about 240Hz and its harmonics if I did the math right. For the foam, I think Kyle Bull had an engl cab with foam in it that he found had strong bass too if I recall. I don't know enough to comment on the foam though.
 
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