Diezel Amps with Deep turned off and Presence low -> like a new Amp!

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valve said:
i own my Herbert for almost 2 centuries now and i can't believe i never tried this.
Seen Ola's VH4 Metal clip and saw the "odd" setting of Deep and Presence at 0! I gave it a try.

Since the Diezel recommendation is to start of with everything at noon, i think i never swept away with the Deep knob too far from noon, let alone 2 knobs:D (well that's not really true).
Well i dropped it down to 3 before, but if you leave the presence around noon, it really get's thin and brittle. I do alot of Bass/Deep exchange and Treble/Presence exchange, but never did the simultaneuos Deep and Presence change.
if you turn them down the same amount, you get similiar brightness and cut, but a different response from the Amp.

I think everything that bothers me with my Diezels from time to time (say 1 out of 10 sessions) can be removed this way.
That stuffy fatness i can't stand for low Gain can be dialed out, but in a differnt way than reducing Bass/Deep and/or increasing Treble/Presence i did normally.

If you sometimes think you Diezel sounds too fat/stuffy/muddy and just get's harsh/thin if you increase treble/presence or lower bass/Deep you should really try this.
It behaves more like a tradtional amp this way i think.
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Just use p90s and bump that Deep up till it sounds like humbuckers..
 
Gain at noon...
valve said:
Nah, way too much gain for a convincing Angus type sound. That‘s a very shallow interpretation.

I had a real freaky phase where I really got obsessed with their sound.
Even got an old metropolus Marshall kit for that stuff.
It‘s much cleaner than most think.
Even for solos that setting is too high.
Depending on the album try channel 1 with the gain very high or channel 2 with the gain from 9:00 to 10:00 o‘clock and raise the master.
Especially for this slicing rhythm work you do want the deep very low!
That fatness you get with the diezels with deep around noon always threw me off for something like ac/dc.
The feel is just off. It‘s kind of muddy and shrill at the same time with deep and presence at noon (plain strings sting, low strings boom).
It‘s Marshalls with cutting highs and mids.
You have to get rid of all of the diezel trademark sound
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OK, got it...I'll try getting rid of all the Diezel trademark sound...While using a Diezel. That's a good idea. Appreciate the advice.
 
Peter finely tuned deep and presence to be usable all the way from zero to max, so nothing wrong with using extreme settings!
 
Leo Diezel said:
Peter finely tuned deep and presence to be usable all the way from zero to max, so nothing wrong with using extreme settings!
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This makes complete sense to me. At manageable living room volumes, I typically push the presence ad deep to 2 - 3 o'clock and it sounds fantastic to my ears. Thank you.
 
JustinCorrigible said:
I did NOT like turning deep and presence down all the way whatsoever in the room. However, it did reset my ears for how I had the presence set before, so I guess that's a plus.
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Cool you tried it.
I make adjustments to the amp only when I am close and in the full beam of the speaker. Room sound is very different where you stand anyway. So I usually make no judgement about the room sound.

Presence could be of course set higher, but if you have deep on zero and presence on say 12:00 is already really pretty harsh, depending on the treble of course.
 
Leo Diezel said:
Peter finely tuned deep and presence to be usable all the way from zero to max, so nothing wrong with using extreme settings!
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Yes I don‘t know any other amp company (haven‘t tried them all), where the amps still sound in control even under extrem settings.
 
angelspade said:
Gain at noon...

OK, got it...I'll try getting rid of all the Diezel trademark sound...While using a Diezel. That's a good idea. Appreciate the advice.
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Well I hear no diezel in AC/DC.
I didn‘t buy my VHX to be limited to the diezel trademark sound (which I like, but not for everything)

After all this years I finally found the way to get rid of the „diezelness“ (or at least my perception of it) for a low gain crunch sound. I don‘t want the diezel fatness for this specific sound.
Makes me stop thinking about getting an additional amp and maybe others too.

It‘s great too have both (and everything in between)
 
Dominik said:
Just use p90s and bump that Deep up till it sounds like humbuckers..
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that's one of the few popular pickup types i don't have, would be nice in the future, but need to get rid of some other guitars first
 
valve said:
that's one of the few popular pickup types i don't have, would be nice in the future, but need to get rid of some other guitars first
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I was using P90s through my VH4 yesterday and it works really well. The natural thickness of the amp (depending on settings) and the added cut of the P90s is a good mix
 
i have no doubt i would like them, but...
(I don't wanna brag, i am more ashamed, actually) i have a lot of guitars already.
But yeah an SG with some P-90 was already on my wishlist.
Also i think another box with a different speaker will do more for me at this point.

Had another real loud sessions yesterday.
It was a Les Paul with BKP RiffRaffs straight into the VHX and Mesa Trad with V30s.
This fuckin' kills. The best low gain sound i ever had!
Never thought i could achieve this with a Diezel.
 
valve said:
What year is this VH4. I read these days, that the old ones gain did vary quite a bit from a modern one. So i might have misjudged you.
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No...you judged me correctly. It's a later model that is slightly more aggressively voiced, and a bit brighter.
 
I think i should also mention I don't own a Diezel cab. Just a Mesa Traditional (and a Marshall 1960BV). This might be indeed cab related.
It might very well be, the Diezel (or other) cabs might interact much better with the Deep knob.
 
So I have a 2020 VH4 with 6L6's. I turned down the deep and presence to zero and noticed the huge volume drop but could not dial in my tone I like.

My tone set up for channel 3 is gain at noon, bass at 9 o'clock, mids at 3 o'clock, treble at 3 o'clock, deep at noon and presence at 2-3 o'clock.

Then I boost it with a Warm Audio Centavo or Horizon Devices Precision Drive.

BUT keep in mind, my basement jam room is very boomy even with all the sound/foam wedges all over the place etc. So my settings may be extreme.

The Channel 1 clean on my VH4 I am not a fan of. Breaks up too easily when I use a chorus in the channel insert or loop. But then again the VHX clean is insane so I feel I am comparing the two.

I want to put 6L6's into my VHX for sure now.
 
Yes you loose a lot of volume if you turn down the presence and have to readjust the master or channel volumes.
with this setting Treble and Presence both around 3 o'clock is too bright with my setup (guitar, cab, room etc.). one of each at 3 o'clock and the other at 9 would be ok.
If that's you're normal setup you will not be happy with presence and deep at 0. Deep at 0 and presence at 10:00 might be more in the ball park, but then, if you trade deep for bass (9:00 vs 12:00) anyway, i don't think you're the "target group".
 
I gave this a try today and it really worked well for me. I was a little sceptical that it might suck the life out of my tone and be too thin.
Sounded really cool. Much more Marshally crunch to my ear. I'd just been playing my JCM800 a little before it so the sound was fresh in my head.

I was using my 'VH4 Ch3' preset on my VHX and just dialed back the Presence to 0 and the Deep down to 0 then back up a touch to 0.010.
Cranked the Volume and then also the Gain up for some more crunch. I found I didn't lose much volume, but I cranked it just for shiggles. Ears are ringing now but it was worth it. I'll have to give it a try on my VH4 another day to see how that goes.
(y) :cool:

edit: smh, I meant 0.10 on the Deep setting.
 
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Philhouse said:
I gave this a try today and it really worked well for me. I was a little sceptical that it might suck the life out of my tone and be too thin.
Sounded really cool. Much more Marshally crunch to my ear. I'd just been playing my JCM800 a little before it so the sound was fresh in my head.

I was using my 'VH4 Ch3' preset on my VHX and just dialed back the Presence to 0 and the Deep down to 0 then back up a touch to 0.010.
Cranked the Volume and then also the Gain up for some more crunch. I found I didn't lose much volume, but I cranked it just for shiggles. Ears are ringing now but it was worth it. I'll have to give it a try on my VH4 another day to see how that goes.
(y) :cool:
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haha that is the ONE thing that drives me nuts about Diezel's (or at least all of mine over the years)... is that the volume knobs taper too fast. I feel like mine always go from too low too EAR SHATTERING so fast. I even sometimes use a Bugera PS-1 so I can crank it and it tames it nicely without sucking tone much. But I have two cabs so I would need to run two PS-1's and that is annoying. :)

I try not to use the built in attenuator on the VHX as I found that sucks tone if lowered too much. I had it on like -8 or -10 for so long... then put it to zero and boom the amp came back to life.
 
Philhouse said:
I gave this a try today and it really worked well for me. I was a little sceptical that it might suck the life out of my tone and be too thin.
Sounded really cool. Much more Marshally crunch to my ear. I'd just been playing my JCM800 a little before it so the sound was fresh in my head.

I was using my 'VH4 Ch3' preset on my VHX and just dialed back the Presence to 0 and the Deep down to 0 then back up a touch to 0.010.
Cranked the Volume and then also the Gain up for some more crunch. I found I didn't lose much volume, but I cranked it just for shiggles. Ears are ringing now but it was worth it. I'll have to give it a try on my VH4 another day to see how that goes.
(y) :cool:

edit: smh, I meant 0.10 on the Deep setting.
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Glad you like it!
Yes, more marshally was also my association.
 
MesaSean said:
haha that is the ONE thing that drives me nuts about Diezel's (or at least all of mine over the years)... is that the volume knobs taper too fast. I feel like mine always go from too low too EAR SHATTERING so fast. I even sometimes use a Bugera PS-1 so I can crank it and it tames it nicely without sucking tone much. But I have two cabs so I would need to run two PS-1's and that is annoying. :)

I try not to use the built in attenuator on the VHX as I found that sucks tone if lowered too much. I had it on like -8 or -10 for so long... then put it to zero and boom the amp came back to life.
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isn't this the case with every tube amp Amplifier?
I never owned one where it behaved any other way
 
valve said:
isn't this the case with every tube amp Amplifier?
I never owned one where it behaved any other way
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Pretty much. My V3 went from barely audible to loud as hell with a tiny nudge.
 
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