Diezel VH4 Nightmare - solved

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Empire Prod

Empire Prod

New member
First off, please allow me to thank the owner, mods, and members of this forum for making this such a cool place. I just got turned onto rig-talk from a friend, and it looks like a great community rich with outstanding resources and helpful people. That being said, this is the reason for my first post here. A producer buddy of mine who is a total guitar/amp junkie swears by the Diezel VH4 for recording modern hard rock rhythm. I have seen some guitar players I respect start to use the VH4's as well, so I thought it would be a good thing to buy one to have around the studio. So when one popped up on Ebay, I bought it. (This is the first amp I have ever purchased based upon reputation alone.) It arrived in the original Diezel box, but was shipped with the tubes in the sockets (this might be important, not sure). Upon inspection, the head is in mint condition. It is a 2008 I believe. Anyways...I take off the back grill, make sure all the tubes are seated in the sockets properly and that there is no visible damage etc, and replace the grill. I hooked her up to a Mills Afterburner cab loaded with V30's to hear what the Diezel could do. Immediately I was bummed out that channels 3 and 4 squeal with feedback at any moderate volume. It is completely unusable! and on top of that it is by far the muddiest amp I have ever heard in my life. even with the presence cranked all the way up, the treble pegged, the deep off, and the bass rolled off, it has zero cut. I tried a variety of guitars and it made no difference at all. I swapped out cables, and changed the cab to an original grey face Diezel cab with 2 v30's and 2 of the v12's and that added a hair more cut, but every head I have ever owned including the Crate that I bought when I was 16 stomp all over the Diezel. Please tell me something is wrong with this thing and that it can be fixed! Any help would be great!
 
ok...
did you check the preamp tubes?? sometimes they go microphonic & that would cause the squeal.
what power tubes are you running?
i just used mine last nite out and it was just fine. cut like a knife. start with the preamp tubes...swap some around. its possible one is bad & making you crazy. most of the time its the simplest thing that will make you nuts. usually a bad tube is just the culprit.
 
I would definitely say since you bought it off ebay a re-tube would be wise. Vh4 is most definitely NOT a muddy amp, some people even think it too articulated. Now as far as cut depending on certain factors that's a maybe but that's a maybe with most amps. You need to buy some Ruby EL34B's and two high grade+ ruby 12ax7's for v-1 and 2 and regular high grades for the rest. Do a re-tube and go from there. If it still is giving problems, then report back, there might be something wrong with the amp. If nothing is found wrong, you just don't like it then, they're not for everyone. Being it is a Diezel and you bought it used you're not going to lose any real money(besides maybe the tubes, but hey it was bought used) on it so it's not even really a gamble. I'm not trying to be snotty I'm just saying.

Take it easy,

-Nick
 
First of all, welcome to the forum and congrats for your new amp!! :rock:

As Pauly says, the first thing I would check: the tubes. They are the usual suspects for the most of the problems like yours..

Best,
Raul.
 
yeah dude, for real, check the tubes.....you should always retube and rebias an amp after buying it from a place like ebay. i had a similar situation years ago with an amp i bought, and once i retubed it everything was better. honestly unless it was thrown down a flight of stairs during shipping i bet the only problem is your tubes. diezel amps do not have an issue with being muddy....i think that's why the majority of us play them....that diezel clarity and crunch.
 
A VH4 getting stomped by a Crate ? I doubt even in hell that would ever be the case.

Sadly, you cannot piss all over the VH4 when you did not expect any tube issues after
buying pre-owned and after UPS/Fed-Ex had their way with it.
Calling common tube amp ownership knowledge a "Nightmare" is over dramatic.

Replace the preamp tubes one at a time until you rule out a bad tube.
It does have 7, so their is always the possibility of two being bad.
You can pull the chassis to make this much easier. If this does not repair
the amp, replace the power tubes and bias them. That amp is a tank, so I
highly doubt you have any serious issues unless it was seriously abused by the previous owner.
 
Empire Prod":1rld1fq0 said:
First off, please allow me to thank the owner, mods, and members of this forum for making this such a cool place. I just got turned onto rig-talk from a friend, and it looks like a great community rich with outstanding resources and helpful people. That being said, this is the reason for my first post here. A producer buddy of mine who is a total guitar/amp junkie swears by the Diezel VH4 for recording modern hard rock rhythm. I have seen some guitar players I respect start to use the VH4's as well, so I thought it would be a good thing to buy one to have around the studio. So when one popped up on Ebay, I bought it. (This is the first amp I have ever purchased based upon reputation alone.) It arrived in the original Diezel box, but was shipped with the tubes in the sockets (this might be important, not sure). Upon inspection, the head is in mint condition. It is a 2008 I believe. Anyways...I take off the back grill, make sure all the tubes are seated in the sockets properly and that there is no visible damage etc, and replace the grill. I hooked her up to a Mills Afterburner cab loaded with V30's to hear what the Diezel could do. Immediately I was bummed out that channels 3 and 4 squeal with feedback at any moderate volume. It is completely unusable! and on top of that it is by far the muddiest amp I have ever heard in my life. even with the presence cranked all the way up, the treble pegged, the deep off, and the bass rolled off, it has zero cut. I tried a variety of guitars and it made no difference at all. I swapped out cables, and changed the cab to an original grey face Diezel cab with 2 v30's and 2 of the v12's and that added a hair more cut, but every head I have ever owned including the Crate that I bought when I was 16 stomp all over the Diezel. Please tell me something is wrong with this thing and that it can be fixed! Any help would be great!
Click to expand...

Good to see ya here Empire
 
MARK2C":11ve63qq said:
Sadly, you cannot piss all over the VH4 when you did not expect any tube issues after
buying pre-owned and after UPS/Fed-Ex had their way with it.
Calling common tube amp ownership knowledge a "Nightmare" is over dramatic.
Click to expand...

You are probably right. I am an engineer/producer by trade and so my ignorance of "common" tube amp issues is most likely what led me to use the term nightmare. And the only reason a Crate would stomp on the Diezel right now is because you can turn the volume up on a crate. It's really odd. There is that high feedback and as you turn up the master volume it sounds like someone is turning down the treble and presence knob at the same time.

Thanks for the great responses guys! It is very reassuring to hear from all of you that what I am hearing is not normal. I can't wait to hear this amp when it is dialed in! It looks super well built, and reading the manual it really seems like the designer thought this amp through.
 
Empire Prod":1ef6exhc said:
Immediately I was bummed out that channels 3 and 4 squeal with feedback at any moderate volume. It is completely unusable! and on top of that it is by far the muddiest amp I have ever heard in my life.
Click to expand...
It appears that you got the designer VH4 boutique version that incorporates digital training wheels.

In this case you must master channels one and two before the digital training wheels will default and then you will only have access to channels three and four and channels one and two will become disabled with the high pitched squealing sound from the digital training wheels, until so.

Happy Oxcart!
 
King Crimson":2x9t8l31 said:
In this case you must master channels one and two before the digital training wheels will default and then you will only have access to channels three and four and channels one and two will become disabled with the high pitched squealing sound from the digital training wheels, until so.[/i]

Happy Oxcart!
Click to expand...

:lol: :LOL: Diezels answer to Guitar Hero
 
Empire Prod":111pe5md said:
First off, please allow me to thank the owner, mods, and members of this forum for making this such a cool place. I just got turned onto rig-talk from a friend, and it looks like a great community rich with outstanding resources and helpful people. That being said, this is the reason for my first post here. A producer buddy of mine who is a total guitar/amp junkie swears by the Diezel VH4 for recording modern hard rock rhythm. I have seen some guitar players I respect start to use the VH4's as well, so I thought it would be a good thing to buy one to have around the studio. So when one popped up on Ebay, I bought it. (This is the first amp I have ever purchased based upon reputation alone.) It arrived in the original Diezel box, but was shipped with the tubes in the sockets (this might be important, not sure). Upon inspection, the head is in mint condition. It is a 2008 I believe. Anyways...I take off the back grill, make sure all the tubes are seated in the sockets properly and that there is no visible damage etc, and replace the grill. I hooked her up to a Mills Afterburner cab loaded with V30's to hear what the Diezel could do. Immediately I was bummed out that channels 3 and 4 squeal with feedback at any moderate volume. It is completely unusable! and on top of that it is by far the muddiest amp I have ever heard in my life. even with the presence cranked all the way up, the treble pegged, the deep off, and the bass rolled off, it has zero cut. I tried a variety of guitars and it made no difference at all. I swapped out cables, and changed the cab to an original grey face Diezel cab with 2 v30's and 2 of the v12's and that added a hair more cut, but every head I have ever owned including the Crate that I bought when I was 16 stomp all over the Diezel. Please tell me something is wrong with this thing and that it can be fixed! Any help would be great!
Click to expand...


First welcome to the forum :thumbsup:

Please first retube the amp with:

V1/V2 : 12AX7AC5 HG+
V2-V7 : 12AX7AC5 HG
Power tubes: EL34BHT

These tubes are available from Ruby Tubes / Magic Parts.
For the 12AX7AC5 HG+ ask for Diezel selection.

If the amp runs without squeal check the highs.
Diezel amps have no earcutting treble, but You
should get the right amount. If not, we easily can
replace a resistor to get more presence in the gain
channels.

For further help and instruction please email to:
peterdiezel (at) diezelamplification (dot) com.

Best,

Peter
 
Peter Diezel":1z60k1jm said:
First welcome to the forum :thumbsup:

Please first retube the amp with:

V1/V2 : 12AX7AC5 HG+
V2-V7 : 12AX7AC5 HG
Power tubes: EL34BHT

These tubes are available from Ruby Tubes / Magic Parts.
For the 12AX7AC5 HG+ ask for Diezel selection.

If the amp runs without squeal check the highs.
Diezel amps have no earcutting treble, but You
should get the right amount. If not, we easily can
replace a resistor to get more presence in the gain
channels.

For further help and instruction please email to:
peterdiezel (at) diezelamplification (dot) com.

Best,

Peter
Click to expand...
Thanks so much! :thumbsup:

So let me ask you guys this...I have some Electro Harmonix 12AX7eh's new in the box. Would it be ok to use the 12AX7AC5 HG+ in v1 and v2 and to use the Electro Harmonix in the rest?
 
It won't really sound all that great, the chinese are really the way to go. I would at least try and put chinese in v-1 through v-4.
 
Empire Prod":28nebyk7 said:
Peter Diezel":28nebyk7 said:
First welcome to the forum :thumbsup:

Please first retube the amp with:

V1/V2 : 12AX7AC5 HG+
V2-V7 : 12AX7AC5 HG
Power tubes: EL34BHT

These tubes are available from Ruby Tubes / Magic Parts.
For the 12AX7AC5 HG+ ask for Diezel selection.

If the amp runs without squeal check the highs.
Diezel amps have no earcutting treble, but You
should get the right amount. If not, we easily can
replace a resistor to get more presence in the gain
channels.

For further help and instruction please email to:
peterdiezel (at) diezelamplification (dot) com.

Best,

Peter
Click to expand...
Thanks so much! :thumbsup:

So let me ask you guys this...I have some Electro Harmonix 12AX7eh's new in the box. Would it be ok to use the 12AX7AC5 HG+ in v1 and v2 and to use the Electro Harmonix in the rest?
Click to expand...

Sure, you can pop the EH's in, as your used VH4 obviously has a pre-amp tube problem. It wouldn't take but a few minutes. I would be more interested in getting it to sound near what it should, as opposed to looking at it and waiting on tubes. Meanwhile, you can do as Papa D suggested and order up a box full of Ruby's and replace them later. More than likely, just replacing V1 (preamp tube nearest the input) will solve your problem, if the sound is sucking across all channels.

Steve
 
steve_k":32m7zxco said:
More than likely, just replacing V1 (preamp tube nearest the input) will solve your problem, if the sound is sucking across all channels.
Click to expand...

Yeah I played it today again and it sounds terrible right now. Something is definitely not right. I can't wait to get this head going. The clips I have heard online sound awesome.
 
Empire Prod":1arwhzga said:
steve_k":1arwhzga said:
More than likely, just replacing V1 (preamp tube nearest the input) will solve your problem, if the sound is sucking across all channels.
Click to expand...

Yeah I played it today again and it sounds terrible right now. Something is definitely not right. I can't wait to get this head going. The clips I have heard online sound awesome.
Click to expand...

Man you may want to have Friedman tube it and give her a once over. Dave's awesome and has a sweet spot in his heart for VH4's.
 
James Lugo":12b6n0ix said:
Man you may want to have Friedman tube it and give her a once over. Dave's awesome and has a sweet spot in his heart for VH4's.
Click to expand...

Yeah...Thanks James. I am going to call him tomorrow. Hmmmmmm might have to drop off my JCM800 2204 for a Brown Eye mod while I'm up there!

:D
 
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