Mesa Dual Recto Comparison - Rev C, Rev F, and Rev G

[skullfxr]

Part of why I made the video was exactly what was stated above - to show the minimal differences among revisions. I'm not a world class engineer by any means, but I do feel like the video captures the subtle differences.

DISCLAIMER:

I think part of the problem with a lot of videos is that people try to dial amps in to sound the same as one another. I don't think that helps give a sense of how they contrast. With this video, I chose one set of standard issue Recto settings to use on all the amps so you could hear the differences. Is it the optimal settings for each of them? No, and all of them would have sounded better/worse if I'd chosen different settings, and you might feel differently about each revision then. Had I darkened up the C, the settings would have put a blanket over the G, and so forth. So keep that all in mind when listening. It's a video to show the tonal differences, not which is "best". None of them were dialed in to sound best.

That all said, I also wanted to help dispel some myths. I've preached it for years, but people have to hear it for themselves.

"The Rev C is tighter and Rev G is loose and flubby!" - Bullshit.
"The older transformers are so much better/tighter!" - Bullshit.


Reality is, the Rev C has more hair on the top end, and less low mids and low end as a result. Channel 1 is a different animal on the C vs the others, but most folks like channel 2/modern. Rev F isn't brighter or tighter than G, it has a little more upper mid push and seems brighter because of it.

None of those revisions are tighter than another. They're just different flavors.

TBH you did a fantastic job. I would love a clip where you have each at your personal optimum.

I really enjoyed this, and I appreciate the time you put into the video.

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You are the man so one beer stack for you!

 

[NewWorldMan]

I really dig the Rackto here.

What tubes did you have in them? Similar tubes in all?

Yes, they're all using '90s era Mesa 12AX7s (Beijing era "C8") and Mesa STR 420 6L6s.

 

[NewWorldMan]

TBH you did a fantastic job. I would love a clip where you have each at your personal optimum.

I really enjoyed this, and I appreciate the time you put into the video.

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You are the man so one beer stack for you!

Thanks! Glad someone got some value out of it I have similar clips with a couple Mesa Marks, Diezel VH4, Bogner Uber, and a JCM 800. If anyone wants, I could toss them together into a clip as well.

 

[turtlefingers]

I do not think those comparisons are fair.
We know the tubes make a big diference how amplifiers sounds.
To be fair you should use the same tube in those amps and record each by each.

 

[fearhk213]

Thanks for doing this. I found it informative. I went in fully expecting to like the F best, but I too prefer the racto here. Makes me feel like I need one ?

 

[NewWorldMan]

Thanks for doing this. I found it informative. I went in fully expecting to like the F best, but I too prefer the racto here. Makes me feel like I need one ?

They're great amps! I like them all, but gravitate towards the Rev F and Rev G Rackto depending on the situation. When blending amps, there's times I prefer Rev F. I should probably pull together two more videos. One that has the similar clips with the Bogner Uber, VH4, Mark IIC+, and JCM 800...and a 3rd video that does combos of two amps blended (e.g., Rev F/Bogner, Rackto/VH4, etc).

 

[311splawndude]

I liked the G tube amp the best. Had just the right amount of sag for me.

I could see the tube variances coming into play. But even if you bought brand new tubes (like all JJs for example or whatever) the variances between those tubes would be a thing too. Plus you'd have to buy what 30 tubes. LOL

 

[NewWorldMan]

I liked the G tube amp the best. Had just the right amount of sag for me.

I could see the tube variances coming into play. But even if you bought brand new tubes (like all JJs for example or whatever) the variances between those tubes would be a thing too. Plus you'd have to buy what 30 tubes. LOL

Yes, all of those amps have NOS power tubes in them, and I've swapped preamp tubes (all C8s) around over time in the amps to find the ones that sound best in each. It's about as close as you're going to get. No one is going to take the time to swap the exact same tubes into every single amp. Then it would be "but the pots are never 100% the same, and that one had a micro fraction of a smidge higher on the volume knob, and that one"

 

[skullfxr]

TBH you did a fantastic job. I would love a clip where you have each at your personal optimum.

I really enjoyed this, and I appreciate the time you put into the video.

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You are the man so one beer stack for you!

Thanks! Glad someone got some value out of it I have similar clips with a couple Mesa Marks, Diezel VH4, Bogner Uber, and a JCM 800. If anyone wants, I could toss them together into a clip as well.

I have seen most if not all of the clips you have posted to date and love them.

If you don't mind tossing them together I would throughly enjoy them.

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[Racerxrated]

If you want to know the skinny on Mesa amps, and the truth about how they all compare, not just someone who wants to 'blow up' their own amps value, talk to New World Man. He's had them all, compared them all, and will give you a great honest TRUE assessment of how they compare and the real differences. He's not the only one here on RT but he knows his stuff.

 

[311splawndude]

Hey NewWorldMan,

If you have a spare minute. I have a Series II Rectoverb Solo 50. I really like the grind and various tones I can get out of it.

Can you juxtapose that amp with the other Rectos? If not, that is OK. I doubt I would ever sell/trade for a Dual because I got this for $490 and couldn't pass it up. It had a borked Reverb, which I was fine with.

Thanks,

 

[NewWorldMan]

The reverb on the Rectoverb seems to get screwy a lot. Half the time it's probably previous owners dicking with things they didn't understand.

The Single Recto and Rectoverb are cool amps. They lack some of the lows and low mid kick of their bigger brothers, and clean head room seems to run out quick (especially with hotter pickups), but the clean channels themselves are great. They do a very cool edge of breakup sound, and they take pedals really well. Headroom is only an issue if you play godly loud with a band (guilty). They sound like a more compact Recto to me, as opposed to the Mini Recto which has a slightly different vibe.

I actually have a Series I Rectoverb 1X12 that I use when I don't want to port a half stack around. If you want, I can plug it into the 4X12 cab like the others and add that to the clip list for comparison when I get a chance. Would be the same as running the head version through it.

 

[skullfxr]

The reverb on the Rectoverb seems to get screwy a lot. Half the time it's probably previous owners dicking with things they didn't understand.

The Single Recto and Rectoverb are cool amps. They lack some of the lows and low mid kick of their bigger brothers, and clean head room seems to run out quick (especially with hotter pickups), but the clean channels themselves are great. They do a very cool edge of breakup sound, and they take pedals really well. Headroom is only an issue if you play godly loud with a band (guilty). They sound like a more compact Recto to me, as opposed to the Mini Recto which has a slightly different vibe.

I actually have a Series I Rectoverb 1X12 that I use when I don't want to port a half stack around. If you want, I can plug it into the 4X12 cab like the others and add that to the clip list for comparison when I get a chance. Would be the same as running the head version through it.

That would be interesteing.

 

[skullfxr]

If you want to know the skinny on Mesa amps, and the truth about how they all compare, not just someone who wants to 'blow up' their own amps value, talk to New World Man. He's had them all, compared them all, and will give you a great honest TRUE assessment of how they compare and the real differences. He's not the only one here on RT but he knows his stuff.

That is a good healthy salute. I know you wouldn't say that if it wasn't legit.

 

[311splawndude]

The reverb on the Rectoverb seems to get screwy a lot. Half the time it's probably previous owners dicking with things they didn't understand.

The Single Recto and Rectoverb are cool amps. They lack some of the lows and low mid kick of their bigger brothers, and clean head room seems to run out quick (especially with hotter pickups), but the clean channels themselves are great. They do a very cool edge of breakup sound, and they take pedals really well. Headroom is only an issue if you play godly loud with a band (guilty). They sound like a more compact Recto to me, as opposed to the Mini Recto which has a slightly different vibe.

I actually have a Series I Rectoverb 1X12 that I use when I don't want to port a half stack around. If you want, I can plug it into the 4X12 cab like the others and add that to the clip list for comparison when I get a chance. Would be the same as running the head version through it.

Thanks. I appreciate your insight. I think that is probably pretty spot on.

 

[NewWorldMan]

https://soundcloud.com/311splawndude/mesa-rectoverb-tone

I'll check it out on the monitors tonight! I'm certainly not Randy Staub, haha, but I think everyone has heard enough clips these days that they know loosely how what they hear on a clip will translate to the amp in a room.

The Single Recto series really is great. I had a terrific sounding Single Rec for a while that I probably should have kept, but had (and still have) more stuff than I needed to keep around and sold it. Think someone here bought it, actually.

 

[311splawndude]

Edit: Didnt mean to derail from your thread

 

[Wizard of Ozz]

So, I did a thing. Here's a quick clip thrown together comparing 4 different 2 channel Rectos - Rev C (Ch 1 & 2), Rev F, Rev G, and a Rev G Racktifier for anyone that cares. Always get comparison questions. Disclaimers:

Clips are 100% raw tracks. Not even HP/LP.
No boosts, plugged straight in.
All clips are double tracked and split L/R.
All amps roughly the exact same settings.

I would typically dial them all in slightly different, but wanted to set them all the same to hear the subtle differences. If you're only listening on an iPhone speaker, you may not hear as much differentiation.

General thoughts:

Rev C is clearly the brightest of the lot, with less bass and low mids on channel 2. Also has the most attack. Rev F and G have more girth and meat by comparison, also a little more low end.

You can hear some differentiation in the F and G. They have a similar low end and thud on the attack, but the F has a little more push in the upper mids. I hear F frequently characterized as brighter than G, but I think it's more the upper mids you're hearing making it seem brighter. C is legitimately brighter on the top end.

Channel 1 Vintage on the C is probably the biggest anomaly of the entire 2 channel run. Also has the most gain by far. Gain on the clips were around 1:00, except channel 1 Vintage on the C. It was set on 10:00.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bTJUPLhR4s8

I liked the Rev C the best followed by the Rev F.

I do think the Rev C is tighter and has more presence, upper treble high-end cut to the sound (and by design ). The F sounded good as did the Rackto G... but the regular G sounder darker and more distant. I was listening on Adam A7X monitors... so I got a good reference. The Rev C is a very different animal compared to any later revision.

I also currently own 2 Rev Cs (sub #250 serials), 1 Rev D, 2 Rev F Triples, and a MW Triple Recto. I've owned enough Rev G Duals/Triples to know I don't like them nearly as much as my Rev Cs or Rev Fs. The Rev F does in the clip as do the ones sitting in front me, sound brighter and more present with more cut than the latter Rev G that is darker, more distant (even with the presence died) and more bass.

I did a similar back to back comparison that I posted here between these same amps and came to the same conclusion.

Good work!

 

[Giga.Blast]

Not withstanding the recording enhancements, it would be nice to hear the these rectos recorded in their "native" state.

For me in this state Rev(C, F, G) = Rev(F, G, C) = Rev(G, C, F)

 

[slyym]

Sounds like an eq in the loop could make all these sound pretty similar. I like the c and f the best but ain’t a damn thing wrong with the g.