Message from Mark Cameron as relayed to a5150guy

[scriptphase]

Brad, I've pretty much concluded that you're too level-headed, tactful, and mature to be in the guitar gear business. I'm continually amazed by the class you've shown. Don't you realize this is an industry for middle-aged adolescent, immature man-boys (of which I'm one as well )???

 

[plexipwrd]

I personally don't care who designed the Atomica. Outstanding build quality and killer tone!! Blows away any other amp I have owned / played.

And as far as Brad King goes.... he personally drove / delivered my Atomica to my home on a Friday afternoon so that I could have it that night....talk about customer service!

 

[Mailman1971]

I personally don't care who designed the Atomica. Outstanding build quality and killer tone!! Blows away any other amp I have owned / played.

And as far as Brad King goes.... he personally drove / delivered my Atomica to my home on a Friday afternoon so that I could have it that night....talk about customer service!

Now that is service!!
I have done deals with Brad as well....Funny thing?
I traded a guitar I had for a Cameron modded amp.
This was long before the Cameron Company he started.

He was always top notch and answered and shipped promptly.

 

[ztevin]

Brad, I've pretty much concluded that you're too level-headed, tactful, and mature to be in the guitar gear business. I'm continually amazed by the class you've shown. Don't you realize this is an industry for middle-aged adolescent, immature man-boys (of which I'm one as well )???

While I think it's clear that Mark is...an interesting fella...Brad could have taken the high road in the last thread and not basically told the guy who threatened him, "You want some, come and get it"...which is exactly what he did. That's tasteless, and completely unprofessional on every level. To label him innocent, is a little misguided. I don't care what someone says, you don't tell a customer who paid you thousands of dollars that kind of thing...I don't care what the circumstances are. There are infinitely more professional ways to handle that...and he did none of them.

 

[Gorehog]

^^^^^

 

[Deleted member 16554]

Brad you are aces in my book man!

Don't let these idiots get you down!!!

 

[scriptphase]

Brad, I've pretty much concluded that you're too level-headed, tactful, and mature to be in the guitar gear business. I'm continually amazed by the class you've shown. Don't you realize this is an industry for middle-aged adolescent, immature man-boys (of which I'm one as well )???

While I think it's clear that Mark is...an interesting fella...Brad could have taken the high road in the last thread and not basically told the guy who threatened him, "You want some, come and get it"...which is exactly what he did. That's tasteless, and completely unprofessional on every level. To label him innocent, is a little misguided. I don't care what someone says, you don't tell a customer who paid you thousands of dollars that kind of thing...I don't care what the circumstances are. There are infinitely more professional ways to handle that...and he did none of them.

Man, I didn't see that. I hope this all gets worked out. Seems like tensions couldn't get much higher.

 

[King Guitar]

Brad, I've pretty much concluded that you're too level-headed, tactful, and mature to be in the guitar gear business. I'm continually amazed by the class you've shown. Don't you realize this is an industry for middle-aged adolescent, immature man-boys (of which I'm one as well )???

While I think it's clear that Mark is...an interesting fella...Brad could have taken the high road in the last thread and not basically told the guy who threatened him, "You want some, come and get it"...which is exactly what he did. That's tasteless, and completely unprofessional on every level. To label him innocent, is a little misguided. I don't care what someone says, you don't tell a customer who paid you thousands of dollars that kind of thing...I don't care what the circumstances are. There are infinitely more professional ways to handle that...and he did none of them.

Your probably right. I am a human being and I don't like internet tuff guys weather they are past clients or not. I give tons of respect to people who give it in return. This guy did none of that and I still let him say it but when he goes off like that publicly, guy doesn't PM or call me privately and threatens violence to me in calling me out as a fat Krispy Kream eating loser who he cant wait to "introduce himself too" aka beat me down at NAMM I had enough. Alls I said is I fly into town and I would be happy to meet with him. Take what you will from that. Was it right? I am sure it wasn't but I don't take kindly to threats no matter who you are. I will try to be a better person going forward.

 

[Mailman1971]

You said it Brad....I am sure you heard it....as I have....
"PRESS ON!!"

Cant move forward looking backwards.

 

[ztevin]

Brad, I've pretty much concluded that you're too level-headed, tactful, and mature to be in the guitar gear business. I'm continually amazed by the class you've shown. Don't you realize this is an industry for middle-aged adolescent, immature man-boys (of which I'm one as well )???

While I think it's clear that Mark is...an interesting fella...Brad could have taken the high road in the last thread and not basically told the guy who threatened him, "You want some, come and get it"...which is exactly what he did. That's tasteless, and completely unprofessional on every level. To label him innocent, is a little misguided. I don't care what someone says, you don't tell a customer who paid you thousands of dollars that kind of thing...I don't care what the circumstances are. There are infinitely more professional ways to handle that...and he did none of them.

Your probably right. I am a human being and I don't like internet tuff guys weather they are past clients or not. I give tons of respect to people who give it in return. This guy did none of that and I still let him say it but when he goes off like that publicly, guy doesn't PM or call me privately and threatens violence to me in calling me out as a fat Krispy Kream eating loser who he cant wait to "introduce himself too" aka beat me down at NAMM I had enough. Alls I said is I fly into town and I would be happy to meet with him. Take what you will from that. Was it right? I am sure it wasn't but I don't take kindly to threats no matter who you are. I will try to be a better person going forward.

Classy response, and kudos for that. Listen, we all make mistakes, like you said; we're all human. But when you're the face of a company, it's your job to be professional...If someone threatens you like that, step away from the keyboard, grab a coffee/beer/whatever and come back when you're cooled off...I'm not saying anything you aren't aware of, either.

The guy who made that threat wasn't right either. The e-toughguys are the worst, because chances are high he wouldn't actually do anything he said he'd do...over 200 bucks? If so, dude needs to be in a mental institution.

Regardless, I was just pointing out how I saw it. Being that it's memorial day weekend and all, and I grew up with a pops who served in the USAF for 26 years, thank you for your service to this country. As a Marine, it's easy to see how you may fly off the handle at threats. You jarheads are a fiery breed!

 

[Mailman1971]

[No message]

 

[Rushtallica]

I thought responding to the threat with another threat was a bad idea, as well. But at the same time I can imagine myself in the place of being a business owner seeing someone post a lot of great talk about a past business associate who bailed but still posted a lot of negative things regarding the amp, then turn and push the amp so hard for a sale in addition to also making a threat. The response is something I could see myself doing and regretting afterward.

I can also definitely get the part of the post talking about taking on the name being a curse with all the past people being owed money and amps. I don't have any stake in any of this but have always hated to see fellow musicians get ripped off. I don't really know what occurred with the email situation, but IMO it would've been worth making another call or two and then addressing it on the forum if need be before going to Cameron. At the same time, if I put a lot of money into something and felt let down, I could see being a bit impatient and frustrated.

Anyway, it's cool to hear he did a lot for no money other than for the transformer and that the amp sounds great. But it might be a good idea to avoid trying to push the person in too favorable a light in case others who don't know the history of horrible dealings may see your posts and try and do business.

 

[RedB4Black]

Brad, I've pretty much concluded that you're too level-headed, tactful, and mature to be in the guitar gear business. I'm continually amazed by the class you've shown. Don't you realize this is an industry for middle-aged adolescent, immature man-boys (of which I'm one as well )???

While I think it's clear that Mark is...an interesting fella...Brad could have taken the high road in the last thread and not basically told the guy who threatened him, "You want some, come and get it"...which is exactly what he did. That's tasteless, and completely unprofessional on every level. To label him innocent, is a little misguided. I don't care what someone says, you don't tell a customer who paid you thousands of dollars that kind of thing...I don't care what the circumstances are. There are infinitely more professional ways to handle that...and he did none of them.

Who was it who said the customer is always right?

Sometimes the customer is just an asshole.

 

[Mailman1971]

Who was it who said the customer is always right?

Sometimes the customer is just an asshole.

Sometimes?? Man....customer service for years....
Almost ALWAYS.

 

[glip22]

Sad situation but life goes on.

 

[EXPcustom]

King Amps.

Put a crown for the dot in the i, would look cool.

 

[Tone Merchant]

The following is what he emailed me as his IP is banned....




I would post this myself, But brad wont let me on here... I cant get in

Ok Ive had enough of this bullshit..
Show me/us a licensing agreement....there is none.
The contract we had.......YOU.....breached by not giving me my TAX info and other things that will get you guys into trouble.....Also by ignoring my certified letters to you...and....to all of you involved.

The reason I have gotten so pissed at you right now is....in every response to MY customers (I am Cameron amps)......you blame me for your fuck ups....they think I have something to do with YOUR amps....I do not!!!......and you know damn well you have no schematics of anything but the CCV.......The other two amps I did not make and you had/have no info from me....I haven't even talked to you in a year....you can't blame me for a bunch of amps and decisions I did not make.......shouldn't a Marine stand on his own?.........I had no say so over cameron amps when I went into this with you rob and dave and you know it....I was even told to get a part time job and only lost money.
I don't get why you want to use MY name to sell amps I did not make.....the customers don't want that either.......I don't get why you don't just use the Friedman logo and move on....after all thats what they are. Go ahead make the amps.....I don't care......I don't want any money from you or anything ever..... just change the logos and Ill take back the amps that I sold to people that you will never deliver......because the amp you are giving them is not what they ordered. My amps are being made...the same way.. no redesign...and I will never take a down payment again for anything

Mark

http://webcache.googleusercontent.com/s ... =firefox-a

Response from Brad?

ok I will reply even though its against my better judgement. my replies in red.

Hey Guys, this is Rob from Tone Merchants and my brothers Brad King from King Guitar and Dave Friedman of Friedman Amps are my Partners in Cameron Amplifiers LLC. I wasnt going to reply to all the drama, but once Mark chimmed in, I will defend ourselves from his lies.

I would post this myself, But brad wont let me on here... I cant get in

Mark, my memory is that you asked to be removed from Rig-Talk because you were over the drama and didnt want to deal with the people calling you out and you were threatened with violence.

Ok Ive had enough of this bullshit..
Show me/us a licensing agreement....there is none.

Read the agreement we all made before we decided to take this on. You signed over the rights to the name and any past, current and future designs. Its a fairly simple document.

Mark I do not need a licensing agreement with you when Brad, Dave Friedman and I own all your designs and your name. How do we own your designs and name? Here is the first section of the legal document you signed.

The Parties, Brad King, Robert Navarrette, and Dave Friedman, also known as Cameron Amplification (and collectively referred to as “CamAmp”), and Mark Cameron (“Mark”), hereby enter into this Agreement

on ______________2011 regarding CamAmp’s manufacture, distribution, and sales of guitar amplifiers, guitar speaker enclosures, and accessories designed by Mark.
WHEREAS the parties are desirous of entering into an agreement whereby Mark will design products, including but not limited to, guitar amplifiers, guitar speaker enclosures, pedals, other enclosures, and accessories (collectively referred to as the “design function”); and,
WHEREAS the parties are desirous of entering into an agreement whereby CamAmp will have the sole rights of manufacturing, distributing, marketing, and selling all products designed by Mark (collectively referred to as the “manufacture and sales function”),

IT IS AGREED by the Parties as to the terms set forth below.
Use of Individual Name and Brand Name
1. Upon the execution of this Agreement, Mark agrees that he is assigning, transferring, and/or signing over any and all rights to the use of his name as well as the use of his brand name(s) to CamAmp for its sole use in its manufacture and sales function. As such, all past, present, and future ownership interest Mark may have had, has, or would have had in same is immediately forfeited and ceases to exist.
2. Upon the execution of this Agreement, Mark agrees that he is assigning, transferring, and/or signing over any and all ownership interest he had in the past, has in the present, or would have had in the future in any and all products that comprise the design function. As such, any and all such ownership interest is immediately forfeited and ceases to exist.
3. As of the date of execution of this Agreement, the products that have been identified and are presently included in the design function are Models: CCV100; CCM100; Custom 75; Mini CCV; Mini CCM; Rackmount Preamps; Rackmount Power Amplifiers; Jose High Gain; the Aldrich and Ocean modifications; and various pedal designs.


The Design Function and Non-Compete Clause
4. Mark fully understands and acknowledges that he is the designer, and only the designer, of the products which comprise the design function. Accordingly, Mark agrees that he shall neither represent or portray himself as a participant in CamAmp or as an owner of any of the products which comprise the design function.
5. Mark fully understands, acknowledges, and agrees that he shall not design any product(s) for anyone or entity other than CamAmp that may be considered in any manner or fashion by CamAmp in its sole judgment to be in competition with the products herein referenced that comprise the design function.
6. Mark fully understands, acknowledges, and agrees that he is responsible for designing at least a minimum of four new designs each year, one design every quarter based on a calendar year.
Modification of Existing Amplifiers
7. Mark may modify existing amplifiers from other brand names on a case by case basis with the prior written approval of CamAmp.
8. All such amplifier modification orders must be placed through CamAmp.
9. At such time as CamAmp approves a written request for an amplification modification, Mark fully understands, acknowledges, and agrees that he shall have no contact with the receiving customer and that all such transactions, including responsibility for delivery, shall be handled exclusively by CamAmp.

The contract we had.......YOU.....breached by not giving me my TAX info and other things that will get you guys into trouble.....Also by ignoring my certified letters to you...and....to all of you involved.

You walked out on us and left us with all the mess to pick up. We had no interest in responding to your rambling letters after the fact demanding we do this or that after you left us hanging

After Mark tried to extort money from us for the millionth time, we refused to give him any more money unless he actually did the work we assigned him to do. Once mark relized we were serious, he quit. At this time Mark was in severe breach of his contract. Shortly after quitting, Mark informed me by mail that he wanted to see the accounting. I received the letter on a friday and in his letter Mark said he would be at Tone Merchants on the next Monday. I called my attorney and on the advice of counsel, my attorney told me to give Mark or his attorney her information and they could contact her. Mark showed up at the shop and I gave him my attorneys information, end of story.

With regards to breaching the contract. The only way We breached the contract that you signed was paying you about ten times the money that you were legally entitled to as specified in subsection 10-13 of the legal document that you signed. Why did we pay you more money than you were entitled to, because you absolutely refused to assist us in this project unless we continued to pay you and this tis extortion plain and simple and 90% of the time you still didnt do the work we needed to get done.

Regarding the certified letters that you sent us, neither I or Cameron Amplification LLC. have no obligation under any civil law in the State of California to respond to the completely incoherent personal letters you sent us. These letters were not a subpoena, and werent even from an attorney. These letters were nothing more than a personal letter from Mark Cameron that he tried to make official. I told you Mark the last time I saw you, if you need any questions answered, you have my attorneys number. Mark is actually telling people that because we didnt respond to his letter that he is now the owner of Cameron Amplification. Sorry Mark, you are incorrect. If I write Bill Gates a certified letter demanding ownership of Microsoft and he receives such letter and doesnt respond, I cant now claim to be the owner of Microsoft Mark.

The reason I have gotten so pissed at you right now is....in every response to MY customers (I am Cameron amps)......you blame me for your fuck ups....they think I have something to do with YOUR amps....I do not!!!......and you know damn well you have no schematics of anything but the CCV.......

Your "customers" were ready to track you down and kill you when I met you. I dont blame you for my fuck ups. I do blame you for walking on us in the middle of it.


The only customers of yours Mark were the guys you ripped off forty five thousand dollars from and like Brad said, we were getting calls every week from someone new looking for amps you had of theirs or guys you owed money to or never sent them the amps that they sent to you for mods and repair. Every customer of Cameron Amplification LLC. has received the amps that they have ordered except for the guys on the 2nd run of the CCV. All 25 guys on the first run received their amps and 3 of the guys you ripped off received amps from money that came out of Cameron Amplification LLC pocket, not yours. Every customer that has ordered an Old Bitch and Atomica have received their amps. In a year and a half, we have shipped more Cameron products that you have since you started Cameron Amplification.

Now this is where this gets fun. You have designed every product that Cameron Amplification LLC has launched. The first incarnation of the CCV was a joint design because you didnt know how to design a proper effects loop and you couldnt figure out how to install the midi board. We paid to use the (Metro Loop) which you didnt even bother to properly install in about 10 of the 25 CCVs that shipped. All of which had to be returned and had to be fixed on Cameron Amplification LLCs dime. Ron from RJM designed the Midi board again several amps had to be returned because you didnt install the midi board properly.

The Atomica was and is a simple design that you wrote out onto a piece of paper infront of Dave Friedman, Brad and I. and I have to admit, it was inspiring to watch and listen to you and Dave Friedman discuss the layout and all the techie crap that Brad and I dont understand. This information was then relayed to George Metropoulos and we paid George alot of money to properly draw up a schematic in a CAD file.

Regarding the Old Bitch, on 12-16-2011 at 11:41 AM, you emailed me a handwritten schematic which you guys will find at the end of this post. So Mark when you say

".they think I have something to do with YOUR amps....I do not!!!......and you know damn well you have no schematics of anything but the CCV.......

This is just another one of your lies that you tell people and now Im exposing you for the liar that you are. I had to pay George Metropoulos to fly out to North Hollywood to translate your scribble and then properly create your schematic in a CAD file all of which cost thousands of dollars to do and all paid for by Cameron Amplification LLC.

Every amp we have launched is exactly the way you designed them to be. You didnt want to use Mercury transformers on the Atomic and Old Bitch and that is a fact. Additionally, Dave and george could go into much more detail on every aspect of the input you had and how they followed it.

The other two amps I did not make and you had/have no info from me....

That is dead incorrect. We paid George Metroplis to fly in and we also had to pay Ron Menalli from RJM to drive in from San Diego and we had you sit with Dave Friedman and write down the schematic and design for the Atomica and the Aldrich designs. You dont remember sitting with them in North Hollywood and making sure they had the design and the build of materials. I had to come pick you up and get you to these meetings mot of the time in between feeding you and buying you clothes at Target, remember.

See Mark Cameron's handwritten document he emailed me on 12-21-11

I haven't even talked to you in a year....you can't blame me for a bunch of amps and decisions I did not make.......

I dont blame you, I blame myself, I never should of went and found you to begin with and I never should of tried to get the Cameron business out of the ditch. The reason we had to redo everything from Scratch is that your original design while sounding good was a ad hoc nightmare that could not be repeated by any professional builder. It also didnt help that in the middle of it you called daily for money and you then decided you didnt want to help any more or share any more designs.

except for cosmetic decisions, Mark made every design decision that was necessary to achieving and staying true to his schematics and verbal input he provided. To Mark's credit, he was for the most part he was always interested in hearing input from us. the only time I ever vetoed Mark was when he wanted to use parts he had laying around or unusable parts he would find at an electronics junkyard called Apex which was across the street from Mark's house. On one occasion I remember, Mark wanted to use these rusty beat up volume pots in the CCV that he found at Apex. I told him that we couldnt in good conscious put that crap in a brand new 3500.00 amplifier. But that's just the way Mark is used to doing his business.

shouldn't a Marine stand on his own?.........

I have stood on my own since I was 17. You are the last guy who should be talking about standing on their own my friend. How many times did I pay YOUR landlord the rent money you owed or buy you a phone or take you to the bank to open a bank account etc...

It amazes me that of all people, Mark Cameron would try and attack someones character. This guy not only ripped people off for 45 grand, but deliberately destroyed jay strange's amp just because jay outed mark out on Rig-talk. I could gone on and on from all the places Mark was fired from for stealing and other unethical behavior, but I wont. What also amazes me is how mark attack our character after all we did for him. We paid Mark's rent every month and made sure he always had food or pocket change. I gave Mark over a grand of my own personal money by giving him money for food or pocket change every time I saw him was 20 to 40 bucks out of my pocket. In an effort to get Mark to eat healthier, we took Mark to the grocery store to buy some decent food and he still bought candy bars and celeste pizzas and a ton of Hostes ding dongs. Brad made an appointment for Mark to see and an eye doctor for new glasses. We tried to get him to see a shrink when we suspect he was bipolar which Mark freely admits he has sever depression problems however he wouldnt or refused to go to any of these appointments. Geez, what else could we do for the guy.

I had no say so over cameron amps when I went into this with you rob and dave and you know it....I was even told to get a part time job and only lost money.

You had say over the sound and the design, you had zero say in anything else as you had proven to be a disaster. You kept asking us to store the parts at your house while we know you were backdooring amps and repairs to guys when we weren't looking.

Yes, I told you to get a part time job Mark because Cameron Amplification took very little of your time. After designing the amps, you had nothing to do with no money and a ton of free time. I ordered and inventoried all the parts. We had the amps built by Barang. When we did get the amps for you to test, you refused to test the amps at Tone Merchants. So we let you test the amps at your house and made updates that amps were shipping. However weeks would go by and you wouldnt finish a single amp and then you would hide from us as we looked for you since you had the amps. I even had to have Brad fly in from Rhode Island just to help me look for you. And when we told you we were not going to pay you any more for doing nothing but sitting in your crack shack and smoking pot, you went ballistic and threw me out of your house Brad and I even gave you our personal amps to mod for extra money and it tokk you forever to do them and some you didnt even do. Brad still has an amp at Tone Merchants thats in pieces from your hatchet jobs. And I even offered you a job at Tone Merchants repairing amps and you refused to do that because you didn't want to leave your crack shack. Ill never forget when you you were so pissed for me just suggesting you get a part time job. You yelled at me and Brad and said "would you guys tell Reinhold Bogner to get a part time job". Well if Reinhold was in his 40s with not a penny to his name and he slept all day and stayed up all night doing god knows what, then yah I would suggest he get a job. And you didnt lose money, you owe cameron Amplification LLC over ten thousand dollars for money advanced to you.

I don't get why you want to use MY name to sell amps I did not make.....the customers don't want that either.......

If I could remove the name Cameron I would, its a fucking curse.


Actually we own your name not you. And maybe we will drop the Cameron name at some point and call it something else. If your interested in buying your name back, have your people call my people Im sure you can find another investor like you had with Chris Schmidt. i spoke to Chris, he only lost a couple hundred grand putting his money and trust in you

I don't get why you don't just use the Friedman logo and move on....after all thats what they are.

Incorrect, they are your designs, Dave wanted nothing to do with them or you. He doesnt need this BS as all the famous players are breaking down his door for HIS designs. He had to jump in and fix the board and work with George so we could fulfill the orders we took when we thought we had a partner in you. We had no choice as you were MIA. We kept all of the designs the same and just relayed them out to be able to be built in a repeatable fashion. Thats something you never bothered with the reason nobody could ever get anything from you.

I think Friedman Amplification is doing well enough where Dave Friedman doesnt need your designs

Go ahead make the amps.....I don't care......I don't want any money from you or anything ever..... just change the logos and Ill take back the amps that I sold to people that you will never deliver......

Thats the pot calling the kettle black, Your the last guy who should bust anyones balls for not delivering amps and unlike you we will deliver them and see this through.

Really Mark???? of the 45 grand worth of amps you took orders from, you havent delivered a single amp and dont have a penny of that 45 grand. So where did the money Mark. I do know one thing, 3 of the guys you ripped off received new Cameron amps from Cameron Amplification LLC

Mark dont forget to look at the schematic that you tell everyone that you didnt provide

 

[Mailman1971]

Sorry...that drawing made me laugh.

I am sure its legit. I didnt mean to laugh....

 

[metalmaniac93]

Man what a huge mess!!!

 

[metalmaniac93]

I personally don't care who designed the Atomica. Outstanding build quality and killer tone!! Blows away any other amp I have owned / played.

And as far as Brad King goes.... he personally drove / delivered my Atomica to my home on a Friday afternoon so that I could have it that night....talk about customer service!

I agree that it is a great amp!!!