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VESmedic
Well-known member
This is exactly to the T why I think the amp is massively overrrated. Exactly what you just said. Except to me, a boosted recto does that tone so much better, is much much more dynamic, and way less compressed. In fact, the recto is arguably the most dynamic high gain I’ve ever heard. It kind of bounces around a track and grabs your attention unlike very few other things, Atleast to me.
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VESmedic
Well-known member
GEE….I WONDER WHY??? It’s almost like, I have a point….
But I’m sure it’s just…I dunno…TOO good to be just on ANY persons record….that’s probably it….
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VESmedic
Well-known member
Imagine thinking a studio will splurge 100k+ for an SSL console, or shit close to a MILLION on a neve, but won’t spend a couple grand for an amp that is supposedly the most amazing guitar amp on the planet that would be the most amazing thing since sliced bread and instantly make their tone sound like the black album and make that producer sell more records than god ….just imagine that.
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VESmedic
Well-known member
Well, we have known each other for I don’t know, 25 years? Probably known him longer than anyone on the planet. I do share a lot of the same opinions as him, that’s nothing new. Apparently alot of people do, as he’s a pretty decent producer if you haven’t noticed.
However, there are a ton of things I don’t share his opinion on. VHT amps being one of them. But yea, the 2c+ opinion is definitely one I share, and always have. When you volume match the 2 amps in a track with the same DI, it’s not even close , and never has been. It is what it is man, the amps a turd.
Tone Monster
Well-known member
lol or be a blowhard pedal booster. Go die alone on that hill.
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VESmedic
Well-known member
It’s a hill you weren’t invited to homie, a hill occupied by someone on the internet you don’t even know that makes your head explode. And it’s hillarious to me. But not as hillarious as you thinking you’re smarter than Bob Rock. THATS hillarious.
Tone Monster
Well-known member
You just are too cool (in your own mind)
to have an actual conversation. You live to troll. Do whatever you need to do but my God what a waste of time and energy.
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VESmedic
Well-known member
I’m reiterating, once again, for that small brain of yours in there, that you yourself are the one that walked into this. You do realize that, right? Call me crazy, but randomly talking about someone in a thread that said person ( me) hadn’t even commented on, doesn’t exactly scream “I’d like to have a real conversation about this”. Or, your sorry attempt as usual at taking a jab at me in the next post, either. Are you mad at yourself for wasting your time and energy? You got no one to blame but yourself homie. You asked why I think the amp is a turd, and I told you for every single reason why I feel the way I do about the amp. Accept it, or don’t, I don’t care, not my problem. I’m not sure what you expect me to say. I’m always gonna troll you, I’m not sure why you are so surprised by this.
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braintheory
Well-known member
Overall I do like the Rev C & D Recto’s I had more, but they don’t do what the iic+ does (boosted or not). I don’t think either amp really covers the exact same ground as each other (just different flavors). The c+ has more density and firmness to the notes, Recto’s have a softer attack (even my Rev C), they’re better for leadwork (more liquid note connection, imo one one of the best high gain lead amps out there), and have a certain clarity to it vs even my Rev C IME comparing them
Also, for compression, the pentode, non-simul-class versions (my strong preference) are a lot less compressed and more raw and gritty (Metallica used the simul-class). At least vs the non-simul version, a few of your current amps I’d consider actually a bit more compressed than a iic+ HRG. I can still see why many can consider it overrated in some ways (at least overpriced), but imo it’s an undeniably great amp. I’m a huge recto fan too, the Rev C is my 2nd favorite amp, but I’d probably have to give wizards the nod for most dynamic and may also rank a few others a little ahead the Recto’s in that department
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VESmedic
Well-known member
I actually haven’t played a wizard, about the only thing on my list and has been for a long time ive never played. But, I know without a doubt I’ll love it , I can tell for sure.
I’d agree with you on lead work, I’d take a c+ over a recto in general for leads for sure. No doubt about it. But never for high gain rhythm tones, to me it’s just not even close. And again on the wizards and dynamics, I can tell I’d probably agree with you on that as well, that it’s even more dynamic than a recto, I can hear it when people say this about these amps , I just try not to comment or give an opinion on something I’ve never played before, that’s all.
Tone Monster
Well-known member
Perfect! Get in on the Wizard raffle for sick kids.
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VESmedic
Well-known member
Tone Monster
Well-known member
Yep. St Jude’s
311splawndude
Well-known member
I miss Craigslist.
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VESmedic
Well-known member
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braintheory
Well-known member
I think so. The Wizard Hell Razor is in my personal top 3 or 4
Yeah for leads it’s imo one of my favorite amps and that alone makes it not overrated in my book. I think it depends maybe what kind of high gain rhythm sound you want. For a lot of modern metal like you do I’d generally reach for other amps, but for older thrash and a few other styles the iic+ can also be up there for me. Wizards are great. Some of the few imo legit non-vintage amps
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Racerxrated
Well-known member
Sorry dude, but Bob Rock's memory isn't what it used to be. It's ok, it happens. In that interview he states that when he recorded John Sykes for the 87 WS album, he remembers John using V30s. Oops. V30s weren't out in 1985. Sorry Bob, better luck next time. And, John has stated he used G12 65s for leads and Mesa Halfback cabs for rhythm. This is the normal aging process, we tend to forget things. So, while I don't think I know better than him about anything I DO say his memory is questionable. And, I'd believe the actual GUITAR PLAYERS when they tell you what they used. Lol
Then, to say that NO ONE RECORDED EVAR with the 2C+ is just plain stupid. So, in your C+ hating world (please tell us on the doll where the C+ hurt you so bad!) I guess Metallica's HUGE ALBUMS Master of Puppets, AJFA...I guess they don't count huh?
Yeah, those are super small records that nobody ever heard...yep that must be it. Oh, and then there's Night Ranger, Prince, Dream Theater......yep, no C+ on any albums EVAR.
Greazygeo
Well-known member
I just heard a bunch of Nightranger the other day on Spotify at work….ugh did they have some terrible tones….they might as well of mic’d up some kazoos. Crosstown Traffic anyone?Sorry dude, but Bob Rock's memory isn't what it used to be. It's ok, it happens. In that interview he states that when he recorded John Sykes for the 87 WS album, he remembers John using V30s. Oops. V30s weren't out in 1985. Sorry Bob, better luck next time. And, John has stated he used G12 65s for leads and Mesa Halfback cabs for rhythm. This is the normal aging process, we tend to forget things. So, while I don't think I know better than him about anything I DO say his memory is questionable. And, I'd believe the actual GUITAR PLAYERS when they tell you what they used. Lol
Then, to say that NO ONE RECORDED EVAR with the 2C+ is just plain stupid. So, in your C+ hating world (please tell us on the doll where the C+ hurt you so bad!) I guess Metallica's HUGE ALBUMS Master of Puppets, AJFA...I guess they don't count huh?
Yeah, those are super small records that nobody ever heard...yep that must be it. Oh, and then there's Night Ranger, Prince, Dream Theater......yep, no C+ on any albums EVAR.
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VESmedic
Well-known member
Sorry dude, but Bob Rock's memory isn't what it used to be. It's ok, it happens. In that interview he states that when he recorded John Sykes for the 87 WS album, he remembers John using V30s. Oops. V30s weren't out in 1985. Sorry Bob, better luck next time. And, John has stated he used G12 65s for leads and Mesa Halfback cabs for rhythm. This is the normal aging process, we tend to forget things. So, while I don't think I know better than him about anything I DO say his memory is questionable. And, I'd believe the actual GUITAR PLAYERS when they tell you what they used. Lol
Then, to say that NO ONE RECORDED EVAR with the 2C+ is just plain stupid. So, in your C+ hating world (please tell us on the doll where the C+ hurt you so bad!) I guess Metallica's HUGE ALBUMS Master of Puppets, AJFA...I guess they don't count huh?
Yeah, those are super small records that nobody ever heard...yep that must be it. Oh, and then there's Night Ranger, Prince, Dream Theater......yep, no C+ on any albums EVAR.
Do you have any idea how many guitar players swear they think they know what was used on their album, only to find out later ( if ever) it was reamped after the fact? I’m not saying or insinuating this happened with Metallica, im
Simply making a point: I can give you 3-4 albums off the top of my head that I know of personally, and was personally told by the producer this happened. Again, not saying this happened with Metallica, just that not everything is as black and white as people want to believe.
So that’s your argument? Night ranger? Prince? Albeit great guitar players, but THAT is the pinnacle of tone and what has standardized on the internet the 2c+ as the greatest amp of all time? There’s just loads and loads of players out there dying to sound like prince…yea, totally. And no, don’t mistake that for me ragging on his music or his playing, I fucking love prince and he could’ve wiped the floor with all of us combined, im sure we don’t disagree on that.
And we all know that MOP and AJFA were not just one single amp, especially AJFA. the greatest amp ever made…and yet it can’t even hang by itself without some help from ADA and it’s big brothers power amp ( the strategy). Same thing with the black Album, and the list goes on and on…
Im not even talking about what it costs, that’s so laughable it’s not even worth mentioning. The amp has zero clout for how “amazing” the internet has made it out to be. Yes Metallica is the biggest of the big, and that’s commendable. But your guys justification about WHY it’s NEVER been more widely used in heavy music is so hillarious. “ oh it’s so expensive”….”oh it’s so rare, only 3000 made!” ….producers will spend hundreds of thousands of dollars on a console, but won’t spend comparatively chump change for the greatest amp EVAR MADE?! you guys are hillarious, but hey, if I spent 20k on an amp I’m sure I’d rationalize it too. Rationalize all you guys want, still doesn’t change the fact that comparatively, amps like 800s, Rectos, 5150s, and a laundry list of other amps, are far more “successful” if you will in heavy music, by a thousand miles. Does that mean they sound better? Hey, sound is in the ear of the beholder, and if you like the c+, by all means, play what you want! But there’s a reason it wasn’t more widely used in heavier music, and that’s not me saying it, it’s been said by the people and bands putting out albums for the last 40 years and how very, very, very few have ever used that amp on it. Those are the facts, plain and simple.
Mike morins Marshalls were on literally every record that came out of NRG studios in the 80s 90s and 2000s….guess how many of his amps are in existence? Guess it isn’t an issue of “rarity” on why the c+ was never used, is it???