OD PEDALS AND HIGH PRICED AMPS - Start A War

[crwnedblasphemy]

They actually have on a lot of amps...Bogner, Splawn, etc all come standard with a normal overdrive setting and a boost switch/or second overdrive switch on the foot pedal. Now, that being said, do I always want it there if it was built right in? No. Do I run a seperate OD pedal...yes. A Xotic BB into my splawn. Why? Cuz it gives me a different overdrive than the previous 2 I have, and more flex and control.

 

[ke2]

Different people like different things?
Should Diezel offer the Einstein with the ts-9-mod, the sd-1-mod, the germanium treble booster mod etc..?

Where should the limits be? Even if you offer an amp model with 100 different "od pedal mods" there will be someone that can`t get EXACTLY the sound they want from it. The guitar, player and cab will also make a difference

(edit: I forgot the most important thing, the player`s ears. What do you HEAR when you play? I bet if you and me were to sit down with one amp one pedal and one guitar, we would tweak it differently, even if we decribed the same sound in words)

I`m not much of a tweaker, if it sounds good, I`ll leave it alone But there will always be a demand for something a little different than stock options, no matter how many options you can get stock

 

[glpg80]

yeah im all for each guitar player having their own interpretation of "their tone"

take 1 amp, 1 guitar, and 1 pedal.

each person could EQ it differently and use different tools to get "that tone" that sounds best from what they have =]

 

[anomaly]

Why does it matter so much?

Whatever gets the sound you are looking for, use it.

Personally, i feel alot of amps don't have the low end tightness that i like, so i use a boost on some of my amps. Most of the amps i own require a boost to get that tightness, and it's not as if a overdrive is very expensive, so... , it doesn't really alter the voicing and tone of the amp either, just focuses it a bit.

 

[duesentrieb]

a) Does a Boss SD-1 sound the same (gain = 25%, tone = 25%, level = 100%) into either a

Fender Champ
or
Herbert /ch3.

b) why has a Diezel three loops? Isn't that also a sign of imperfection?

 

[LordOVchaoS]

The correct answer is if an overdrive pedal was built into the amp the corksniffers wouldn't buy the amp because it has solid state clipping diodes in it Sad but you all know it's true.

That said I have a $3000 amp that I put an overdrive in front of and a 4-space rack full of goodies in the loop. NO amp can get me the tones I need without effects. That's what effects are for.

 

[bill]

I keep it simple just a plain vintage amp, a single 12" speaker and a modest pedalboard for some basic tone shaping. See signature for list of pedals.

 

[Marshall Law]

All valid points.

I just think sometimes that by using the pedals in front of you or in your loop, you tend to rely on them (knob turning/tweaking) to EQ/achieve tone and forgot sometimes you have knobs on the amp, other than volume, for turning/tweaking.

my pedal board is as follows, I Run a RMC wizard wah into Keeley modded sd-1 into a Keeley bd-2 into a Keeley mt-2 into a fulltone ocd, into which ever amp I'm using at the time, I run these pedals in many combinations for tone, sometimes 3 at a time for some nasty ZZ topp style over saturated type leads, It gives me lots of different sounds with just a single channel amp

 

[MARK1970]

I understand some like different drive pedals as it allows for different gain structures. I myself use a pedal for bluesy stuff, but mainly play with my amps ch 2. It is the reason I purchased it. What I don't get is some people have signature heads and use a pedal in front. I went to the launching of Steve Vai's Legacy. He was talking about how he worked with Carvin to make the amp to his liking. About a month later, I see he plays it with a Boss Sd-1 on for his overdrive tone. Now why could he not have had Carvin build the amp with a gain structure he likes. Joe Satriani is an exact example. He has an overdrive pedal called the Satcherator or something like that by Vox.

 

[Shiny_Surface]

Alright this will probably start a war, but I am just looking for thoughts:

Scenario: You walk into a music store to buy a amp. I real expensive amp. Say like a Diezel or Soldano or ENGL or Marshall or whatever. After trying one, you decide that a TubeScreamer or Boss SD-1 or whatever overdrive pedal you choose is needed to tighten up your tone. Does that make sense? I mean if a $3000-$4000 dollar amp cannot give you your tone, how does a $50-$200 pedal suddenly make it magic?

I mean look at the list of guitar players out there that have a amp with their name on it and they still claim they use a overdrive to fatter up their sound. Why didn't they just design the amp to compensate for that little foot pedal? It just drives me crazy when I hear someone say that I use this or that pedal to get my tone, but when you look at their rig it is top of line stuff with rack gear, processors, etc.

I would think an amp company/designer would have figured that out by now and sold a amp that has the magic little foot pedal sound added to the amp......................

That's one way of looking at it, but a stressful one imo

You can always tighten up a looser amp, but you can't really loosen a tight amp.

If an amp has a core sound that pleases you but you need to get it tighter, an overdrive pedal can take you the rest of the way.

It's such a time proven method, and so many great recordings and tones have been made that way.

Players these days are kind of spoiled by the modern high gain designs on the market so they expect everything stuck in the amp, but there's always a tradeoff imo...

 

[Marshall Law]

start a war
yes, thats OZZY

 

[DannyM]

Usually the people that bring up this whole "expensive amps and pedals" thing are players who dont have expensive amps and are trying to justify owning a cheaper amp. Its not always the case....but it seems like most of the time its just some one trying to make themselves feel good about their gear....or lack there of.

If the amp or rig cost 3, 4, or 5 thousand and the player is happy with it and uses pedals to achieve his happiness.....WHO CARES!

 

[GRK]

I think boost pedals are great to "add a channel" while playing live. AND they can be great for adding a different color to your tone if you need to.

Here's how I use my Bloody Murder with my Tiny Terror and Les Paul.

Tiny Terror set with enough gain for chunky rhythm distortion
Clean : Neck pup vol rolled off to give a clean sound. BM off
Warm Overdrive: Neck pup vol rolled off same as clean sound but BM is turned on
Distortion: Bridge pup vol full with BM turned off
Smooth Lead: Depending on song either Neck pup vol full or Bridge pup vol full and BM turned on


That way I have 4 channels that KICK MAJOR ASS. Thanks to that "$50-$200 pedal" I make 4 channels out of a 1 channel amp.

Let me ask you this. Have you used OD pedals on different amps? Is the resulting sound same on every amp? I'm guessing not. You know why? Cause amp still is a huge factor that defines your sound. Have you heard of the term "this amp loves pedals?" You know what's that about? It's about the fact that the "cheap" pedal doesn't make up your whole sound. It adds something or subtracts depending on your taste and how you look at it. If you don't like what it adds, you don't use it. If you do like it, you do use it.

When you get an amp, your tone should be like a white canvas board. You add a different color to make it a better painting or you leave that color out if you don't need it and think it's better without. It's completely your choice.

 

[ke2]

I think boost pedals are great to "add a channel" while playing live. AND they can be great for adding a different color to your tone if you need to.

Here's how I use my Bloody Murder with my Tiny Terror and Les Paul.

Tiny Terror set with enough gain for chunky rhythm distortion
Clean : Neck pup vol rolled off to give a clean sound. BM off
Warm Overdrive: Neck pup vol rolled off same as clean sound but BM is turned on
Distortion: Bridge pup vol full with BM turned off
Smooth Lead: Depending on song either Neck pup vol full or Bridge pup vol full and BM turned on


That way I have 4 channels that KICK MAJOR ASS. Thanks to that "$50-$200 pedal" I make 4 channels out of a 1 channel amp.

Let me ask you this. Have you used OD pedals on different amps? Is the resulting sound same on every amp? I'm guessing not. You know why? Cause amp still is a huge factor that defines your sound. Have you heard of the term "this amp loves pedals?" You know what's that about? It's about the fact that the "cheap" pedal doesn't make up your whole sound. It adds something or subtracts depending on your taste and how you look at it. If you don't like what it adds, you don't use it. If you do like it, you do use it.

When you get an amp, your tone should be like a white canvas board. You add a different color to make it a better painting or you leave that color out if you don't need it and think it's better without. It's completely your choice.

I`m using a Roger Mayer Concorde+, a ts-9, a Tonebone HB and a Damage control Solid Metal into my Mesa MK1.

ts is set to boost, Concorde is set to a little crunch, HB is set to 80`s and Solid metal is set to fairly loose Recto-type sounds. When boosting one of the hi-gain pedals with one of the lo-gain, I have just about everything I need. Granted, the pedals cost as much as the amp, but still...

 

[guitarslinger]

In my experience:

1. OD's remove bass, add noise, add compression, and make everything WAY more forgiving.

I truly don't consider that "TIGHTENING" an amp.

However, I enjoy preclipping my signal before the chorus pedal into a heavy rhythm channel for that watery deftones grind.

BTW,
I LOVE OD's for adding dirt to lo gain RAWK with single channel amps. It's essential, really.

my od's

1. Xotic AC
2. VS Route 66
3. Boss OD-2
4. Hao Sole Pressure
5. Digitech Bad Monkey



I'm not anti-pedal or anti-overdrive, but I still can't wrap my brain around this whole "tightening thing."

It seems like weaker players get a "tightening" effect on their playing with double the distortion and compression, but the amp doesn't sound any "tighter" to me.

 

[Telephant]

Wow this topic is beat to death. Ill tell you wehy we use overdrive pedals... Because it adds 5 years to our playing.

 

[guitar_god123456]

Wow this topic is beat to death. Ill tell you wehy we use overdrive pedals... Because it adds 5 years to our playing.

yep. nothing better than a pedal to hide those mistakes i make ALL the time

 

[dstroud]

I've thought about this and I think the amp is so expensive compared to the pedal just because of the cost of parts invololved. Just because it takes tons of money for amp parts (transformers and head shells in particular), and pedal parts are cheap, doesn't mean the pedal has any less "worth" to the sound. I dig pedals into overdriven amps, I really haven't heard an amp that I like better than an overdrive pedal into a Marshall.

 

[thiswaythatway]

Alright this will probably start a war, but I am just looking for thoughts:

Scenario: You walk into a music store to buy a amp. I real expensive amp. Say like a Diezel or Soldano or ENGL or Marshall or whatever. After trying one, you decide that a TubeScreamer or Boss SD-1 or whatever overdrive pedal you choose is needed to tighten up your tone. Does that make sense? I mean if a $3000-$4000 dollar amp cannot give you your tone, how does a $50-$200 pedal suddenly make it magic?

I mean look at the list of guitar players out there that have a amp with their name on it and they still claim they use a overdrive to fatter up their sound. Why didn't they just design the amp to compensate for that little foot pedal? It just drives me crazy when I hear someone say that I use this or that pedal to get my tone, but when you look at their rig it is top of line stuff with rack gear, processors, etc.

I would think an amp company/designer would have figured that out by now and sold a amp that has the magic little foot pedal sound added to the amp......................

Mesa Boogie delivered a long time ago with the Mark II, III, and IV. With the gain turned up high you can step on an OD pedal, shut it off, and not hear much difference.

In fact. Most newer expensive amps do deliver a lot of gain where pedals aren't needed. You really don't need a Tube Screamer for an Engl Powerball or a Diezel Herbert.

 

[jkdsteve]

Would it make you happier if the overdrive/fx/whatever pedal was a significant percentage of the amps price, say $500?