So which production EL34s actually sound good enough to buy?

[Centralizer]

If you decide on JJs, Amplified Parts has them on sale 10% off.

 

[stephen sawall]

I did a EL34 type comparo with what I have through my Trainwreck build into a Rockcrusher and Fane F70's. I don't have an Airplane Hanger, so everything was recorded at low volume..

Tubes biased at 42.5 ma's, 70% PD..

From what I can tell, it's mostly subtle differences with the EL34L being the biggest and most aggressive. The 6CA7 and KT77 have more of a 6L6 top end.

This sounds accurate to me. I have them all but the JJ 6CA7.

 

[BesaMoogie]

Vacuum tubes are like century old technology, wonder what the deal is. Kinda hard to imagine amp makers are putting up with subpar tubes, they’re not out searching for NOS…

When producing amps on a larger scale, you can`t rely on parts that are per se limited. You need reliable sources and build your circuit/amp the best way possible around what`s available at the moment. A boutique builder that maybe puts out like 5-6 amps per year and has stacked up NOS parts can do this.

 

[SpiderWars]

It might make a difference if you are using a MV or cranked non-MV amp. The power section is run clean in the MV amps and is pushed/distorting in the non-MV amps. I base my preference on non-MV amps. But I need to try some JJ in my MV amps, it would be great if I liked them there. I hated the ones I tried in my non-MV amps. The 'bloated and muddy' tone I got with my non-MV amps might be the 'big and aggressive' tone others get with their MV amps.

 

[Nigel]

I did a EL34 type comparo with what I have through my Trainwreck build into a Rockcrusher and Fane F70's. I don't have an Airplane Hanger, so everything was recorded at low volume..

Tubes biased at 42.5 ma's, 70% PD..

From what I can tell, it's mostly subtle differences with the EL34L being the biggest and most aggressive. The 6CA7 and KT77 have more of a 6L6 top end.

What's the plate voltage? KT77 and E34L are 30+ watt tubes. If you bias them like 25 watt tubes they sound wrong.

 

[midnightlaundry]

^^^ Nah.. 10 ma's isn't going to transform that sound for this demonstration.

I have a Combo with KT88'S. I've biased it for 20 watts per Tube, I've biased it for 42 watts a Tube and the difference is negligible with it being slightly warmer with less top end. You especially won't notice with a drummer smashing cymbals in your ear.. I'm not worried about it.

 

[matttornado]

They all sound pretty much the same. Very subtle differences that you may or may not notice. I like Ruby for there reliability.

 

[acceptance]

When producing amps on a larger scale, you can`t rely on parts that are per se limited. You need reliable sources and build your circuit/amp the best way possible around what`s available at the moment. A boutique builder that maybe puts out like 5-6 amps per year and has stacked up NOS parts can do this.

Yeah, I understand that. I am just a bit incredulous that everyone is having so many problems. Maybe I am not as discerning or just lucky, but I would assume commercial amp makers would have a hard time marketing tube amps with crappy tubes and would secure alternative sources of current production tubes. Maybe they just don't care. My other point was that I don't understand why tube quality has deteriorated so much apart from perhaps using lesser inputs for cost savings. Usually manufacturing processes become more efficient and precise over time, not less.

 

[Nigel]

^^^ Nah.. 10 ma's isn't going to transform that sound for this demonstration.

I have a Combo with KT88'S. I've biased it for 20 watts per Tube, I've biased it for 42 watts a Tube and the difference is negligible with it being slightly warmer with less top end. You especially won't notice with a drummer smashing cymbals in your ear.. I'm not worried about it.

I beg to differ. In my experience with JJ KT77’s / E34L’s, 10ma makes ALL the difference. If they sound uninspiring, they’re too cold most likely. They are 33/31 watt tubes respectively, plate & screen. Bias them like 25 watt tubes based on the plate alone and they will under perform. This is not the case with their regular EL34 which is a true 25 watt specimen.

 

[VonBonfire]

Vacuum tubes are like century old technology, wonder what the deal is. Kinda hard to imagine amp makers are putting up with subpar tubes, they’re not out searching for NOS…

Ever since they sold out American electronics manufacture everything is sub par by comparison at best, total junk at worst. Junk tubes, junk pots, junk build quality. Communists and socialists do not innovate or achieve excellence. They steal designs from people who do. If you get paid whether you do great work or do shit work then there is no motivation to excel unless you are someone who takes pride in your work and that would mean you are a thinking person and thinking people would decide to say fuck communism and build junk, just to bring the system down.

China seems to be unable to make anything electronic of high quality. They must have a separate army just to keep their planes in the air and their radios working. Ever pulled vintage 50's-60's pots out of a guitar and replace them with modern ones? Big tone loss. Theoretically it shouldn't, but it does, because modern electronics will never reach the same heights of quality as they did in the past, period. How to get great tone, hang all the politicians from a tree and bring back American manufacturing. Have a nice day buddy!

 

[BesaMoogie]

Yeah, I understand that. I am just a bit incredulous that everyone is having so many problems. Maybe I am not as discerning or just lucky, but I would assume commercial amp makers would have a hard time marketing tube amps with crappy tubes and would secure alternative sources of current production tubes. Maybe they just don't care. My other point was that I don't understand why tube quality has deteriorated so much apart from perhaps using lesser inputs for cost savings. Usually manufacturing processes become more efficient and precise over time, not less.

concerning quality, before transistors were developed, tubes were used in medical equipment or even airplanes. Now imagine flying a Mig jet and your on board electronics start to fail. Reliability was much more of a concern back then. Nowadays, if a tube fails in a Bugera no one, apart from a wannabe guitar hero, cares.

 

[phil b]

I don't know. I guess it depends on what you consider too much. I wanna say I paid about $175 for a matched set of NOS RCA Blackplates for my Brown Deluxe. Seemed fair to me.

1st search in Google turns up The TubeDepot.com .I actually have tubes from them years ago and they are legit. Now... NOS RFT EL34 is $165 per tube.NOS Winged C is $120 per tube. I have a set of Winged Cs that showed up today. I didnt pay those prices for them but they were still pretty expensive. Its all about weighing the pros and cons. At a certain price point the sound from a certain tube definitely outweighs the cost. Over that price point you have to think if its a smart decision to dump all that $$$ for what you're getting in return sound wise. Then you have guy overseas that have decent prices but its a crap shoot on what you're gonna get.

I aint complaining or bitching... I'm a big boy and it is what it is. I'm only bringing this up because its a completely different world buying tubes today than it was when I last bought to stock up. There are tons of names on them but from 2019 there were only 4 manufacturers. New Sensor Corp, JJ, Shuguang and Psvane. I believe there was a fire at the Shuguang factory and that added to the shortage of tubes, but I never followed up to confirm.

 

[Floyd Eye]

1st search in Google turns up The TubeDepot.com .I actually have tubes from them years ago and they are legit. Now... NOS RFT EL34 is $165 per tube.NOS Winged C is $120 per tube. I have a set of Winged Cs that showed up today. I didnt pay those prices for them but they were still pretty expensive. Its all about weighing the pros and cons. At a certain price point the sound from a certain tube definitely outweighs the cost. Over that price point you have to think if its a smart decision to dump all that $$$ for what you're getting in return sound wise. Then you have guy overseas that have decent prices but its a crap shoot on what you're gonna get.

I aint complaining or bitching... I'm a big boy and it is what it is. I'm only bringing this up because its a completely different world buying tubes today than it was when I last bought to stock up. There are tons of names on them but from 2019 there were only 4 manufacturers. New Sensor Corp, JJ, Shuguang and Psvane. I believe there was a fire at the Shuguang factory and that added to the shortage of tubes, but I never followed up to confirm.

And the Russian dilemma.