Van Halen I tones

[311splawndude]

EVH CAN'T get that tone...he WANTS it, but he can't get it. When he built 5150, he bought EVERYTHING they recorded their first album on...console, tape deck, outboard gear, monitors, etc, etc, etc...I read that in a recording mag back in the day...then years later there was an interview in one of the guitar mags where he actually said he'd been chasing VH1 this whole time and he can't get it...my feeling is that it is the EMT plate that contributes some sizzle and obviously that wet quality, but Ed's stated he hated reverb, which is why when VHII came out it was gone....replaced by the "jape".

It is a known fact that Eddie's word back in the day cannot be trusted

You really need to read the current interview in Guitar World so you can reform your opinion.

 

[Mr. Willy]

EVH CAN'T get that tone...he WANTS it, but he can't get it. When he built 5150, he bought EVERYTHING they recorded their first album on...console, tape deck, outboard gear, monitors, etc, etc, etc...I read that in a recording mag back in the day...then years later there was an interview in one of the guitar mags where he actually said he'd been chasing VH1 this whole time and he can't get it...my feeling is that it is the EMT plate that contributes some sizzle and obviously that wet quality, but Ed's stated he hated reverb, which is why when VHII came out it was gone....replaced by the "jape".

It is a known fact that Eddie's word back in the day cannot be trusted

You really need to read the current interview in Guitar World so you can reform your opinion.

Therein lies the rub...if Eddie's word can't be trusted and the interviewee in Guitar World is Eddie, can we assume he's telling the truth this time? I did read it, and I got the impression that he was telling the truth on this particular occasion.

 

[the rossness]

From the MTS perspective...

I've got a Jaded Faith Grailtone on order. I played it the other week and it really does the dimed plexi sound, flubby bass, but it sounds liked a cranked amp at reasonable volumes. It does Lizzy well too.

from a non MTS standpoint, I've had good results with..
Krank Rev 1+. Like the name says, you gotta crank them to get them to open up. Its a shame they went out of business. I've had good luck with the H&K switchblade too.

 

[metalmaniac93]

How about this?

 

[Bob Savage]

Anybody that wants the VH1 tone just needs a Pignose classic and an EH Little Big Muff.

 

[paulyc]

EVH CAN'T get that tone...he WANTS it, but he can't get it. When he built 5150, he bought EVERYTHING they recorded their first album on...console, tape deck, outboard gear, monitors, etc, etc, etc...I read that in a recording mag back in the day...then years later there was an interview in one of the guitar mags where he actually said he'd been chasing VH1 this whole time and he can't get it...my feeling is that it is the EMT plate that contributes some sizzle and obviously that wet quality, but Ed's stated he hated reverb, which is why when VHII came out it was gone....replaced by the "jape".

It is a known fact that Eddie's word back in the day cannot be trusted

You really need to read the current interview in Guitar World so you can reform your opinion.

I wouldn't reform my opinion anyway, do you think that after 3 generations of 5150 amps and all the money he spent chasing the tone with the studio gear and buying up all the NOS 6CA7s he could find and warehouse that NOW he's telling the truth ??? Doubt it.

Strangely enough, there IS an EMT plate in 5150...but I don't think they use it on the guitars.

I've heard the dry guitar tracks from VHI on the 'net somewhere...they sound like shit, really. Don was the key I think. Ed's tone on the Beat It solo is also awesome...it's a Pearce solid state preamp borrowed from Holdsworth...Ed had Don Landee engineer that too...I see a connection.

 

[paulyc]

EVH CAN'T get that tone...he WANTS it, but he can't get it. When he built 5150, he bought EVERYTHING they recorded their first album on...console, tape deck, outboard gear, monitors, etc, etc, etc...I read that in a recording mag back in the day...then years later there was an interview in one of the guitar mags where he actually said he'd been chasing VH1 this whole time and he can't get it...my feeling is that it is the EMT plate that contributes some sizzle and obviously that wet quality, but Ed's stated he hated reverb, which is why when VHII came out it was gone....replaced by the "jape".

If he were trying to achieve the VH I sound, why would he use a 5150 amplifier?

The VH I tones sound like a 'slaved' set-up to me. I don't know of any other way to get that level of power tube compression at studio volumes. I think I may actually prefer his tone on VH II.

It was widely reported that he felt the amp broke...that it lost something. It's widely known that he and Matt Bruck took that amp to LOTS of LA techs...Bogner, Fryette, Friedman, Van Wielden, etc...trying to fix it or restore it back to what it once was...they couldn't. The last known appearance of that amp was on "Big Fat Money" solo on Balance...doesn't really sound high gain at all, and it's an old Gibson 335 into it, so it's got the vintage PAF thing going on.

I'm sure once he started with the Soldano it was hard to go back to a Marshall that you had to dime to make sound right. Remember Mike Soldano publicly stated that Peavey ripped off his design with the 5150 ? High gain amps were in vougue then, and a company like Peavey knew it...the amp has more gain than Ed would ever use (he set it around 7 on the dial), but it sold amps to kids that didn't have the strength in their hands to pull off his licks without it.

I doubt there was any slaving going on until the live tours for 1984 and after. His live rig was multiple Marshall heads strung together (daisy chained) until 1984, so why wouldn't he have slaved live if it sounded so good ? He complained that moving off to one side of the cabs or on the other side of the stge sounded like shit on the early tours. Bob Bradshaw takes credit for the w/d/w/ slave set up, and THAT was the tour for 5150...much later than VH1.

 

[Shandog]

I had read that here about the Microamp.

http://www.electrosmash.com/mxr-microamp

 

[Schaf]

EVH CAN'T get that tone...he WANTS it, but he can't get it. When he built 5150, he bought EVERYTHING they recorded their first album on...console, tape deck, outboard gear, monitors, etc, etc, etc...I read that in a recording mag back in the day...then years later there was an interview in one of the guitar mags where he actually said he'd been chasing VH1 this whole time and he can't get it...my feeling is that it is the EMT plate that contributes some sizzle and obviously that wet quality, but Ed's stated he hated reverb, which is why when VHII came out it was gone....replaced by the "jape".

It is a known fact that Eddie's word back in the day cannot be trusted

You really need to read the current interview in Guitar World so you can reform your opinion.

I wouldn't reform my opinion anyway, do you think that after 3 generations of 5150 amps and all the money he spent chasing the tone with the studio gear and buying up all the NOS 6CA7s he could find and warehouse that NOW he's telling the truth ??? Doubt it.

Strangely enough, there IS an EMT plate in 5150...but I don't think they use it on the guitars.

I've heard the dry guitar tracks from VHI on the 'net somewhere...they sound like shit, really. Don was the key I think. Ed's tone on the Beat It solo is also awesome...it's a Pearce solid state preamp borrowed from Holdsworth...Ed had Don Landee engineer that too...I see a connection.

Pete Thorn gets very close with the 5153.

 

[TrueTone500]

EVH CAN'T get that tone...he WANTS it, but he can't get it. When he built 5150, he bought EVERYTHING they recorded their first album on...console, tape deck, outboard gear, monitors, etc, etc, etc...I read that in a recording mag back in the day...then years later there was an interview in one of the guitar mags where he actually said he'd been chasing VH1 this whole time and he can't get it...my feeling is that it is the EMT plate that contributes some sizzle and obviously that wet quality, but Ed's stated he hated reverb, which is why when VHII came out it was gone....replaced by the "jape".

If he were trying to achieve the VH I sound, why would he use a 5150 amplifier?

The VH I tones sound like a 'slaved' set-up to me. I don't know of any other way to get that level of power tube compression at studio volumes. I think I may actually prefer his tone on VH II.

It was widely reported that he felt the amp broke...that it lost something. It's widely known that he and Matt Bruck took that amp to LOTS of LA techs...Bogner, Fryette, Friedman, Van Wielden, etc...trying to fix it or restore it back to what it once was...they couldn't. The last known appearance of that amp was on "Big Fat Money" solo on Balance...doesn't really sound high gain at all, and it's an old Gibson 335 into it, so it's got the vintage PAF thing going on.

I'm sure once he started with the Soldano it was hard to go back to a Marshall that you had to dime to make sound right. Remember Mike Soldano publicly stated that Peavey ripped off his design with the 5150 ? High gain amps were in vougue then, and a company like Peavey knew it...the amp has more gain than Ed would ever use (he set it around 7 on the dial), but it sold amps to kids that didn't have the strength in their hands to pull off his licks without it.

I doubt there was any slaving going on until the live tours for 1984 and after. His live rig was multiple Marshall heads strung together (daisy chained) until 1984, so why wouldn't he have slaved live if it sounded so good ? He complained that moving off to one side of the cabs or on the other side of the stge sounded like shit on the early tours. Bob Bradshaw takes credit for the w/d/w/ slave set up, and THAT was the tour for 5150...much later than VH1.

Great post!

Guy Hedrick told me that he was the first to rebuilt Ed's '68 while working as a tech Guitar Oasis. I think he said it was back in '85 or '89 maybe? He said that Jose had replaced the transformers and the 'mustard' caps, but nothing special in terms of modifications. He recommended to Ed that he rebuild the amp from the bottom up (transformers included), which is what he did. He said he made a few tweaks to the circuit... Something to do with the plate voltage if I recall correctly. I was told by a Suhr SL68 owner that the amp was designed by Guy Hedrick while he was employed at Suhr; and that the SL68 is based on the rebuild he did on Ed's '68 Plexi. What I respect about Guy, is that he (unlike others) has never used it his experience with Ed's amp to promote himself, or his products.

http://guyhedrick.com/Welcome.html

I was lucky enough to purchase #003 (Guy Hedrick built) Guytron GT20 combo, and I can't remember the last time I was so happy with a purchase. At the recommendation of Graydon Stucky, I removed the stock speaker yesterday, and replaced it with a Celestion Alnico Blue... Best sounding speaker I've ever played through! The GT20 is essentially a VOX AC15 circuit with mods on-the-fly! Master volume, dual effects loops (that work), built-in attenuator level select, slope resistor select, and focus select controls make it the most versatile amp I've ever owned. It has an XLR padded output with phase select for slaving and/or direct recording after the EL84 power amp. It also has a built-in Sennheiser mic mounted to the center side of the speaker cone.

 

[TrueTone500]

I had read that here about the Microamp.

http://www.electrosmash.com/mxr-microamp

The Micro Amp was a 'secret-weapon' of a lot of players back in the 70's. Most would paint them black, so others couldn't see what you were using... Seems a bit cheesy now, but relevant back then. I use to use one with a Seymour Duncan 'Convertible' amp with excellent results. I played a reissue, but it didn't sound as good as the old (painted black) white one I had.

 

[nitro]

That info on the micro amp is wrong,it didn't come in 1973,it's misleading.

 

[TrueTone500]

That info on the micro amp is wrong,it didn't come in 1973,it's misleading.

I had mine back in '94, so you could be right. The ones guys were painting may have been DOD pedals. A Tampa area player by the name of John Levell used one, and that was back in '79/'80 ish. He ran it into a Fender Champ, and it sounded great! My friend Brian also had one, and that was around the time when VH II was released.

 

[nitro]

Van halen II was released in 1979,micro amps were released 1980.My info came right from Keith Barr who started MXR in Rochester NY in his basement

 

[TrueTone500]

Van halen II was released in 1979,micro amps were released 1980.Im info came right from Keith Barr who started MXR in Rochester NY in his basement

Sounds about right then... VH II was big at the time, and so was Pat Benatar Crimes Of Passion.

 

[gtrwun]

EVH CAN'T get that tone...he WANTS it, but he can't get it. When he built 5150, he bought EVERYTHING they recorded their first album on...console, tape deck, outboard gear, monitors, etc, etc, etc...I read that in a recording mag back in the day...then years later there was an interview in one of the guitar mags where he actually said he'd been chasing VH1 this whole time and he can't get it...my feeling is that it is the EMT plate that contributes some sizzle and obviously that wet quality, but Ed's stated he hated reverb, which is why when VHII came out it was gone....replaced by the "jape".

It is a known fact that Eddie's word back in the day cannot be trusted

You really need to read the current interview in Guitar World so you can reform your opinion.

I wouldn't reform my opinion anyway, do you think that after 3 generations of 5150 amps and all the money he spent chasing the tone with the studio gear and buying up all the NOS 6CA7s he could find and warehouse that NOW he's telling the truth ??? Doubt it.

Strangely enough, there IS an EMT plate in 5150...but I don't think they use it on the guitars.

I've heard the dry guitar tracks from VHI on the 'net somewhere...they sound like shit, really. Don was the key I think. Ed's tone on the Beat It solo is also awesome...it's a Pearce solid state preamp borrowed from Holdsworth...Ed had Don Landee engineer that too...I see a connection.

Funny...I have a Pearce G1 that I bought off E-BAY that used to belong to Holdsworth

 

[paulyc]

I had read that here about the Microamp.

http://www.electrosmash.com/mxr-microamp

The Micro Amp was a 'secret-weapon' of a lot of players back in the 70's. Most would paint them black, so others couldn't see what you were using... Seems a bit cheesy now, but relevant back then. I use to use one with a Seymour Duncan 'Convertible' amp with excellent results. I played a reissue, but it didn't sound as good as the old (painted black) white one I had.

I have an old Kramer Pacer that I stuck the guts from a Micro Amp into with a small trim pot for the gain control and a mini toggle switch to switch it in and out of the signal, with a stereo jack to interrupt power when not in use (unplug the guitar so battery doesn't go dead)...was a decent clean boost but not a real overdrive...still, it was cool to have it right there all the time on a switch. Could also plug headphones straight into the guitar and play with a clean tone.

 

[paulyc]

EVH CAN'T get that tone...he WANTS it, but he can't get it. When he built 5150, he bought EVERYTHING they recorded their first album on...console, tape deck, outboard gear, monitors, etc, etc, etc...I read that in a recording mag back in the day...then years later there was an interview in one of the guitar mags where he actually said he'd been chasing VH1 this whole time and he can't get it...my feeling is that it is the EMT plate that contributes some sizzle and obviously that wet quality, but Ed's stated he hated reverb, which is why when VHII came out it was gone....replaced by the "jape".

If he were trying to achieve the VH I sound, why would he use a 5150 amplifier?

The VH I tones sound like a 'slaved' set-up to me. I don't know of any other way to get that level of power tube compression at studio volumes. I think I may actually prefer his tone on VH II.

It was widely reported that he felt the amp broke...that it lost something. It's widely known that he and Matt Bruck took that amp to LOTS of LA techs...Bogner, Fryette, Friedman, Van Wielden, etc...trying to fix it or restore it back to what it once was...they couldn't. The last known appearance of that amp was on "Big Fat Money" solo on Balance...doesn't really sound high gain at all, and it's an old Gibson 335 into it, so it's got the vintage PAF thing going on.

I'm sure once he started with the Soldano it was hard to go back to a Marshall that you had to dime to make sound right. Remember Mike Soldano publicly stated that Peavey ripped off his design with the 5150 ? High gain amps were in vougue then, and a company like Peavey knew it...the amp has more gain than Ed would ever use (he set it around 7 on the dial), but it sold amps to kids that didn't have the strength in their hands to pull off his licks without it.

I doubt there was any slaving going on until the live tours for 1984 and after. His live rig was multiple Marshall heads strung together (daisy chained) until 1984, so why wouldn't he have slaved live if it sounded so good ? He complained that moving off to one side of the cabs or on the other side of the stge sounded like shit on the early tours. Bob Bradshaw takes credit for the w/d/w/ slave set up, and THAT was the tour for 5150...much later than VH1.

Great post!

Guy Hedrick told me that he was the first to rebuilt Ed's '68 while working as a tech Guitar Oasis. I think he said it was back in '85 or '89 maybe? He said that Jose had replaced the transformers and the 'mustard' caps, but nothing special in terms of modifications. He recommended to Ed that he rebuild the amp from the bottom up (transformers included), which is what he did. He said he made a few tweaks to the circuit... Something to do with the plate voltage if I recall correctly. I was told by a Suhr SL68 owner that the amp was designed by Guy Hedrick while he was employed at Suhr; and that the SL68 is based on the rebuild he did on Ed's '68 Plexi. What I respect about Guy, is that he (unlike others) has never used it his experience with Ed's amp to promote himself, or his products.

http://guyhedrick.com/Welcome.html

I was lucky enough to purchase #003 (Guy Hedrick built) Guytron GT20 combo, and I can't remember the last time I was so happy with a purchase. At the recommendation of Graydon Stucky, I removed the stock speaker yesterday, and replaced it with a Celestion Alnico Blue... Best sounding speaker I've ever played through! The GT20 is essentially a VOX AC15 circuit with mods on-the-fly! Master volume, dual effects loops (that work), built-in attenuator level select, slope resistor select, and focus select controls make it the most versatile amp I've ever owned. It has an XLR padded output with phase select for slaving and/or direct recording after the EL84 power amp. It also has a built-in Sennheiser mic mounted to the center side of the speaker cone.

I have 6 of those...4 16 ohm and 2 8 ohm. They do sound kick ass. I'd like to try the golds.

 

[paulyc]

It's also frustrating as a bastard that since he started with the damn Soldano, all his own amps have used 6L6s instead of EL34s, which just do everything SO much better IMO.

 

[paulyc]

Van halen II was released in 1979,micro amps were released 1980.My info came right from Keith Barr who started MXR in Rochester NY in his basement

Micro Amps were out before 1980...no doubt about it.