What's the "growl" frequency?

[racerevlon]

Man, those Ceriatone amps sound good!!!!

 

[petejt]

The trick to "growl" is to get your speakers moving slow enough. For instance, you hear the growl in the dogs throat cycling at a certain speed... that's the trick.

To get that kind of slow movement you need the right mix of bottom end and horsepower combined with a speaker that will do it. If I remember correctly I could get something like that out of G12T-75s when I drove the piss out of them. Big, chunky bottom end with a break up that would come off in slabs. V30s won't chunk... they're too fast/punchy.

I'm using EV 12S 200watt speakers and C90 Black Shadows. They sound excellent and do have that deep sound when I run my MarkIV with them, but to get the crunchy sound I can't quite get the tonality of the "dog" growl. Which is why I want to dovetail another amp with it to handle the growl sound. I don't really want to get more speakers though. But, it's not fully ruled out.

 

[petejt]

I'm curious, do you hear any "growl" at any point in this clip?

Or this clip?

Or this one?

And I equate a "growl" with audible cycling or pulsing of a chord. It's that guttural cycling sound, not a specific frequency. You can growl with your own voice with a low or high pitch. But it requires multiple notes being played at the same time to create a sort of doppler effect.

Yep! Definitely growling there! It was close to the tonality that I'm seeking. It was interesting too what you said about the Doppler Effect, that rippling pulsing sound.


Here's another factor- I'm actually also using a Neunaber Chroma Chorus, which is really a static pitch shifter. Like an Eventide Detune in a pedal. It splits your guitar into three, and offsets the two "outer" signals according to the Width setting. Detunes one and uptunes the other. The three mixed together make the chorus effect.

The problem I had was that the tone sounded more like a high shriek than a low growl. I tried using an EQ pedal to darken the sound, but it didn't get that tonality that I want. Hence this thread. But at least I know I'm on the right track with the Chroma, thanks man. Thanks for your clips too, they sounded great.

 

[petejt]

The trick to "growl" is to get your speakers moving slow enough. For instance, you hear the growl in the dogs throat cycling at a certain speed... that's the trick.

To get that kind of slow movement you need the right mix of bottom end and horsepower combined with a speaker that will do it. If I remember correctly I could get something like that out of G12T-75s when I drove the piss out of them. Big, chunky bottom end with a break up that would come off in slabs. V30s won't chunk... they're too fast/punchy.

That is what I did with my 50 caliber, I had the 80Hz up high, and I was using a Marshall cab with 75's. I had the master and lead master both up at 7 or 8, and I got a really good growl out of my amp. If I still had a Marshall cab, I would make a clip of it. I'll see if I can borrow my friends Marshall cab, then I'll make a clip.

Thanks man, I'm looking forward to it.

 

[petejt]

Very slightly use the side of your thumb while you are picking chords as well.

Like Billy Gibbons?

I'll give it a try, thanks.

 

[petejt]

I always heard that 125 Hz was the "magic frequency."

However, I've always relied on my good old friend the ART SGX2000 Express... it has a five-band global parametric EQ on the front, but there are no frequencies listed. Instead, each has an adjective attached to it, that in the block diagram you can associate to a frequency. So...

Thrust: Centered at 80 Hz this controls your bottom-end sound

GROWL: at 160Hz. Control the upper end of your lows and lower mids to add some depth to the signal.

Warmth: 500Hz--Use to color and fill (FYI, this is the "ROCKMAN" frequency)

Crunch: 2.2 KHz controls upper mid-range

Edge: 5 KHz -- just like it says (kind of like a presence control)

There's a more fine-tuned breakdown out there--if I can find it I'll post it, but this is a good place to start...

Thanks very much for these, and to those that suggested 250-300-500Hz as growl frequencies. Very handy!!!

Although I am a little wary about 240Hz-250Hz since I know the mud lives around there, and I know that 400Hz can sound a little farty. Maybe not so with high Q settings?

The parametric EQ has both a low-pass and high-pass filter, so I guess I can use those to roll off the top end a bit for a generally dark sound (to contrast with the sharp crunchy aggressive high-middy trebly sound from the MarkIV's poweramp), and then fine tune the 160Hz etc. with the individual frequency and Q controls. I don't particularly want this to Squawk like a Rockman, so I'll dial down some of the 500Hz.

 

[skoora]

The growl frequency is right above the "brown" noise.

 

[hawkeye17]

 

[FourT6and2]

I'm curious, do you hear any "growl" at any point in this clip?

Or this clip?

Or this one?

And I equate a "growl" with audible cycling or pulsing of a chord. It's that guttural cycling sound, not a specific frequency. You can growl with your own voice with a low or high pitch. But it requires multiple notes being played at the same time to create a sort of doppler effect.

Yep! Definitely growling there! It was close to the tonality that I'm seeking. It was interesting too what you said about the Doppler Effect, that rippling pulsing sound.


Here's another factor- I'm actually also using a Neunaber Chroma Chorus, which is really a static pitch shifter. Like an Eventide Detune in a pedal. It splits your guitar into three, and offsets the two "outer" signals according to the Width setting. Detunes one and uptunes the other. The three mixed together make the chorus effect.

The problem I had was that the tone sounded more like a high shriek than a low growl. I tried using an EQ pedal to darken the sound, but it didn't get that tonality that I want. Hence this thread. But at least I know I'm on the right track with the Chroma, thanks man. Thanks for your clips too, they sounded great.

You're over-thinking it. Just max out the mids on the amp and run it through some Greenbacks or a similar mid-heavy speaker. Instant growl. Go easy on the treble/presence.

 

[petejt]

I did some bandpass tests on the dog clip, and it looks like the growl is still there when removing below 80hz, and the important range is 80-100hz. If you don't have enough oomph there it won't work.

Is there any free software (compatible on Mac) I can use to run bandpass tests?

I'm trying to work out Giorgio Moroder's Rockman sound on the Scarface movie soundtrack. I know it's a lot of 500Hz or so but that squawk is more than just what you hear on Boston albums.

e.g. (not from YouTube, I have the actual sound file)

 

[petejt]

You're over-thinking it. Just max out the mids on the amp and run it through some Greenbacks or a similar mid-heavy speaker. Instant growl. Go easy on the treble/presence.

Thanks man. Sorry that it took five years to reply! And to realise what you said.

Five years on I AM trying to get that Rockman sound, and for it to growl. But going about it without overthinking things.

 

[mentoneman]

ever try a subtle " 1 octave down" effect, and not overly saturated high gain pickups and amps.

that plus tuning down to Eb, and lower wattage vintage celestions in a 4x12

those are things that come to mind when thinking about growl

 

[Filter500]

I did some bandpass tests on the dog clip, and it looks like the growl is still there when removing below 80hz, and the important range is 80-100hz. If you don't have enough oomph there it won't work.

Is there any free software (compatible on Mac) I can use to run bandpass tests?

I'm trying to work out Giorgio Moroder's Rockman sound on the Scarface movie soundtrack. I know it's a lot of 500Hz or so but that squawk is more than just what you hear on Boston albums.

e.g. (not from YouTube, I have the actual sound file)

I don't know about Mac, but I used GoldWave in Windows.

 

[NoodlerKS]

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