What's the Scam Here?

[SomedudeinTX]

They are gonna ask you to cover the “haulers” fees upfront. They will come up with some excuse as to why they can’t pay them and probably offer you over your asking price to do it. Once the seller pays the “haulers” fees the scammer vanishes.

It’s the same as the Nigerian prince who has millions of dollars in a bank somewhere, but needs you to pay a certain amount up front and then you get your millions.

 

[gtrwun]

This is the oldest one in the book guys.
They will send you a check. Not a check from them, but a stolen check from an account that is not related to them in any way.
Check could clear, you ship the item, then the person or business reports the fraudulent transaction and your screwed. End of scam.

Very common on Craigslist. Don’t spend another minute thinking about this or any other scammer who offers to “have someone pick it up for me”. End of conversation right there.

 

[FourT6and2]

Understood. Thanks guys

 

[FourT6and2]

Oh, and what I should do is accept the offer on Reverb for my asking price lol. The scammer will have to pay or get reported for non-payment and get suspended.

 

[scottosan]

Feels scammy. But not sure how they benefit. Any guesses? Guitar listed on Reverb. I receive an offer, not a message, but an offer for $50 less than my asking price. So if I hit accept, they're supposedly bound by their offer. Along with the offer, buyer includes a message:

"Hi,This is so lovely,still available?,if yes kindly email me…. [EMAIL ADDRESS]"

I've sold off Reverb before, so no problems there. I email the guy and this is his response:

"I asked you to message me because I’m willing to do this off reverb to avoid the tax,I’m willing to pay with check and have an hauler pick it up when check clears."

Word choice seems suspect. "Hauler"? WTF is that. Pay with a check? Nobody does that in 2022. But he says I can wait for check to clear. If check bounces, I'm ok because my bank won't ding me. If check clears and then I ship, what could happen? What's the scam here? A reasonable person would not say they'd pay with a check and then have their own 3rd party "hauler" come pick up the guitar. Makes no sense. A legit buyer would ask to pay via PP for buyer protection and then I would ship.

I told him to call me and his response is:

"I’m out with my family so I can do the calling later when we seal the deal."

I said no phone call, no deal.

They can dispute the check weeks after it clears claiming it was fake. Because the hauler picked it up, you have no address that you can prove it went to. It clearing just means that funds were in the account.

 

[scottosan]

Oh, and what I should do is accept the offer on Reverb for my asking price lol. The scammer will have to pay or get reported for non-payment and get suspended.

You should report them either way in this case

 

[FourT6and2]

They can dispute the check weeks after it clears claiming it was fake. Because the hauler picked it up, you have no address that you can prove it went to. It clearing just means that funds were in the account.

I asked my bank. Once a check clears, it can't be reversed and a stop payment can't be issued. Only in the case of fraud/identity theft can the check be reversed after it clears. So yeah, maybe the scam is a stolen check. It clears. And then weeks later, the real owner of the account discovers the payment and reports it.

 

[scottosan]

Th

I asked my bank. Once a check clears, it can't be reversed and a stop payment can't be issued. Only in the case of fraud/identity theft can the check be reversed after it clears. So yeah, maybe the scam is a stolen check. It clears. And then weeks later, the real owner of the account discovers the payment and reports it.

Thats exactly it. Check numbers are easier to get than credit card numbers

 

[War_in_D]

I asked my bank. Once a check clears, it can't be reversed and a stop payment can't be issued. Only in the case of fraud/identity theft can the check be reversed after it clears. So yeah, maybe the scam is a stolen check. It clears. And then weeks later, the real owner of the account discovers the payment and reports it.

I would have the bank define what they mean by "clears" though. If they mean the actual transmission of funds from one institution to another, then I feel like this would apply. However, many banks will release the funds (I.E. clear the check) to you before they actually have the funds from the other institution though, especially if you have enough in the account to cover the amount of the check being deposited. If this is the case, and the bank releases the funds to you only to find out that the check was bad to begin with (drawn on a fictitious account, etc.), I would suspect that they would reverse it in that case and you'd be out the money. Most of the scams that revolved around this that I saw used a legit bank's name, but a fake account and phony "verification" phone number, etc.

Of course, all this being said, my experience with the banking industry ended around the mid/late 2000's so the technology may be better now with regard to how they determine whether a check is legit or not when it's presented.

 

[FourT6and2]

I would have the bank define what they mean by "clears" though. If they mean the actual transmission of funds from one institution to another, then I feel like this would apply. However, many banks will release the funds (I.E. clear the check) to you before they actually have the funds from the other institution though, especially if you have enough in the account to cover the amount of the check being deposited. If this is the case, and the bank releases the funds to you only to find out that the check was bad to begin with (drawn on a fictitious account, etc.), I would suspect that they would reverse it in that case and you'd be out the money. Most of the scams that revolved around this that I saw used a legit bank's name, but a fake account and phony "verification" phone number, etc.

Of course, all this being said, my experience with the banking industry ended around the mid/late 2000's so the technology may be better now with regard to how they determine whether a check is legit or not when it's presented.

What you're talking about is usually referred to as "posting to your account." When you deposit a check, if you have plenty of money/history with your bank, the check will "post" to your account and the funds are available immediately on the basis of you having enough money to cover it. Then the check will actually clear. Or not.

 

[War_in_D]

What you're talking about is usually referred to as "posting to your account." When you deposit a check, if you have plenty of money/history with your bank, the check will "post" to your account and the funds are available immediately on the basis of you having enough money to cover it. Then the check will actually clear. Or not.

Well, yes and no. Posting is when you "see" the money in your account, and it becomes available for you to use. "Posting to an account" happens as a result of the "release of the funds" which is usually governed by the bank's policies. Some banks release immediately, dependent upon if it's a cash deposit, certified funds, what time of day you deposit, etc. but this is all dependent upon thier policy so funds will not post to an account until the bank has released it in accordance with their policy. Clearing is something that happens between financial institutions, but the use of all these terms are semantic at best and interchanged all the time as meaning the same thing.

The basic gist of it all, is that if you deposit a bogus certified check (or any check for that matter) and your bank's policy is to "release funds" to you same day/next day/three days, etc. and you see it "post" to your account and think everything is cool and you ship out said item.. you run the risk of that check coming back in ~10 days as no good when it doesn't "clear" the financial institution it was drawn upon and you'll be stuck for the money. Whatever terminoligy a person wants to place on the action of the funds showing as available doesn't matter (call it clearing, releasing or posting). You're still screwed. LOL

**Edit**

I would also say, that as mentioned earlier, my experience in banking is many years removed from any new and/or current technologies that have probably been employed since I left. So, there may be much better safeguards in place today than there were when I was involved.