Why are some used Mesa Boogie Dual Rectifier Solo heads $1600 & other $3000. Which is mine?
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Holy-diver
Well-known member
I think Mesa bois ride the hype train as hard or even harder than anyone else. I’ve owned a bunch of the hyped amps back in the day before they experienced this new wave of ridiculous asking prices and they aren’t necessarily better. A lot of hyperbole and mystique are created by average players with 20k in tube heads that rarely get played.
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Racerxrated
Well-known member
Why do newer Marshall’s sound anemic and flat compared to the vintage versions? Vintage parts and age? Hard to say. With Rectos, there are circuit changes that kept occurring that changed the tone in a big way…the darker smoother Rev G is it’s own thing; defines the 90s tone a bit. But for me, who loves Marshalls I find the earlier versions sound more open, raw and are much brighter to give a Mesa meets Marshall thing. And no, you can’t just turn up the highs to make a G sound like an F or earlier. I’ve tried. The G gets brighter but the F sounds way better in every way. Like a C+ vs a III…sure they both are Marks but the C+ just has a better tone. It’s not hype, there are real differences and they are undeniable to my ears anyway. Worth the price? Up to you. I’ve played vintage strats that are worth 20k+. But I still like my USA Charvels better and wouldn’t even consider dropping that coin on any guitar. But that’s just me. YMMV.
Donnie B.
Banned
Well-known member
Is it true that the first runs of IIIs were designed based on the wrong schematic?
And the subsequent revisions/stripes were to get it back closer to a IIC+?
controlled_voltage
Banned
Well-known member
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Racerxrated
Well-known member
I’ve never heard that; the III that sounds the closest to a C+ is the first version no/black stripe which started off using up the last remaining C+ power transformers, the 100 and 105. But my experience with them is limited to red and purple stripe DRGs…neither of which sounded anywhere near as good as a C+.
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phil b
Well-known member
We had a lengthy discussion about this with a few guys from Boogie at the Rockaway Sat. office. A lot of guys who owned the early DRs were complaining that the clean sucked, so after the 1st 500 they changed it to make the clean a little more user friendly. Problem was that the Orange channel really lacked after that, and lost a lot of what made the Orange channel sound so good.
Now at the time of this conversation I dont even think they were in the 3k serial range and I didnt keep up with the various Revs. and changes after the 1st 1000. My comments are really focused around what happened around the 1st 500 change.
Shask
Well-known member
Changing with the times. The Recto was designed and came out when hair metal and shred were popular. As the 90's went on, grunge, alternative, and nu-metal became more popular, so Mesa re-voiced the Recto to be darker, looser, and have better clean sounds. It matched what people wanted at the time. Now people are back into the super tight thing, so they re-designed again, and now we have the Badlander.
NewWorldMan
Well-known member
Story for another day, but the Recto wasn’t intended to have a clean channel. What’s said above is true - Mesa changed it based on customer feedback and the desire to get a traditional clean sound from an amp that wasn’t intended to have one. The purpose of the original 3 channel amp was to finally have a dedicated clean.
As much as everyone goes fanboy over earlier versions now in the age of the internet telling them they should, players didn’t want that. In fact, there were early Rev C/Rev D models that were “upgraded” to Rev F/Rev G in order to get a clean channel. Guess what? No complaints about the change in dirty tones.
As much as everyone goes fanboy over earlier versions now in the age of the internet telling them they should, players didn’t want that. In fact, there were early Rev C/Rev D models that were “upgraded” to Rev F/Rev G in order to get a clean channel. Guess what? No complaints about the change in dirty tones.
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fretout
Active member
My Revision C (and D) is nowhere near as tight as my Coliseum or my other “normal” Mark IIIs.
But, with that being said, they play as tight as you can expect an amp to track while having tonal depth they have. It sounds and feels to me like the early Rectos straddle the line between the fast tracking, and depth of tone. If the Pre-500s tracked any quicker, it seems like they would lose the depth and mid focus they have.
controlled_voltage
Banned
Well-known member
holdsworth's fave amp of all time which he greatly regretted selling was a custom 50 watt 1992 Dual rec rev c #120 pre 500 winged C etc that they made just for him but there were a few others floating around with the same specs.
obviously he is going for a fluid tone and gave zero fucks about high gain BROOTZ riffage
it was sold on reverb a few years ago for a reasonable price if i recall correctly
obviously he is going for a fluid tone and gave zero fucks about high gain BROOTZ riffage
it was sold on reverb a few years ago for a reasonable price if i recall correctly
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braintheory
Well-known member
Agreed, probably would be a trade off if it got too much tighter. I like that the Rev D is tighter than other Recto’s, but still has all that sag like the others that I think gives it all that character, depth like you said and that very complete growl. I think also it’s spongey and tube rectification modes are more useable than other revisions since it’s tighter
skoora
Well-known member
You can get a G close to an F with a few tweaks on the board. I don’t get the insane prices but I guess it is, what it is. Glad I got my T-verb for a reasonable price to cover the occasional recto craving. Would never pay more than 1K for a 2 channel G but I wouldn’t really want one anyway…lol Had a chrome chassis, triple F in 2012 or so that I got for $1000 but was a complete impulse buy as I think the chromes are sexy as hell. Realized it didn’t sound as good as it looked (how I feel about all of them, not just this one) ,took it to a GC a month or so later and they gave me 1K for it so I considers it an easy come easy go. It’s just weird. G’s were 800-900 for the longest time.
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Racerxrated
Well-known member
Yes you can…the Boogie Board has some ‘pre 500’ mods you can do. I’ve done a few; jumped 3 resistors, bypassed 1 LDR, changed the red presence and both gain pots and it sounds amazing. Mostly the Red channel was affected; more touch sensitive, better focus and clarity with more upper mids. Closer to a C I’d imagine. The Orange still keeps the wall of sound thing while also improving the focus and clarity.
Mr. Willy
Well-known member
I have no idea what revision it was, nor do I know the difference between the various revisions, but I had a ‘94 2-channel Dual Rec that was modified for an adjustable bias by James Peters. That amp sounded a lot better than the 3 Channel ones. It had more high mids than the later Rectos, was more old school gain. Like a wide, darker, fatter JCM 800. I miss that amp. It would’ve paired perfectly with a good Super Lead. The Orange channel cloned to Modern would get pretty Marshally.
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VESmedic
Well-known member
No I for sure agree. My rev F sent the G packing no doubt. And it’s an amp I’ll never sell more than likely. It’s much better, but at the same time I guess all I’m saying is that I can see why some people don’t feel they are worth it etc, mainly due to them not feeling it’s a big enough difference. It’s in a different league though to me however. But at the same time, i can get great tones with both I thought for sure.
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VESmedic
Well-known member
I live on Orange modern almost exclusively with my rev F as well.
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Racerxrated
Well-known member
My fav also...although now after the few mods I did the Red is right there with the Orange, and more upper mids as well. If I were still playing out, the Orange cloned to modern would be my Rhythm, and Red my lead. More upper mids now, on the Red.
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fretout
Active member
I totally agree! I love the voicing of these early Rectifiers, but I still keep my Rev Gs around because they sound so much different…so much more “Rectifier” like.
EDIT:
Like RXR mentioned above, there are sone mods that can be done to make the modern 3 channel Rectos sound more like the Pre-500s, but those mods were specifically for the 3 Channel.
Around a decade ago, fluff and I were trying to figure out if it was possible to mod a 3 channel and have it voiced closer to the early Rectifiers, and after a few years, I believe it was fluff (or maybe it was Jerry at FJA that modded fluff’s non-multi-watt 3 Channel) that came up with a convincing mod. It wasn’t the “Presence Mod”, but something more similar to a Pre-500.
I personally never tried the mod, but I do remember the clips I heard sounding very, very similar. For anyone feeling adventurous, that is dying to try an early Recto, there used to be a thread over on the “forum for beach accessories” that will guide you through the mod step-by-step
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fretout
Active member
Would you feel comfortable sharing the mods you made? I’d love to hear about them!