Back from Europe

[Bob Savage]

I try to stay away from fragile topics. How 'bout the UK coming in 2nd to S. Africa though? That's pretty good for them it seems eh?

Let's not forget that you weren't properly dressed for a conversation of any kind, let alone football.

 

[moronmountain]

I try to stay away from fragile topics. How 'bout the UK coming in 2nd to S. Africa though? That's pretty good for them it seems eh?

Let's not forget that you weren't properly dressed for a conversation of any kind, let alone football.

That is true. I should've known better.......

 

[Bob Savage]

By the way, I have no issue with Europeans or people of any nation... well, maybe Nigerians. Anyway, what I don't like are rude people, no matter where they're from.

 

[moronmountain]

By the way, I have no issue with Europeans or people of any nation... well, maybe Nigerians. Anyway, what I don't like are rude people, no matter where they're from.

Same here. FWIW I thought the German and Irish people were cool. I think if you got rid of the language barriers I would've had zero issues in either of these countries. Most of the peeps in Germany and Ireland spoke "English" but there were still barriers there. My first impression of peeps in Italy were the ones who rented us our B & B, so it was positive. Then we went outside heh. Not only was it obvious that they didn't want us there, but they didn't seem to be nice to each other even. I guess it's a cultural thing, but being pushy and rude is pushy and rude no matter what your culture is. I'd still go back to Italy just for the sights though. It was worth it.

 

[Jakem]

You know, many European countries don't have this "small talk" thingie like americans do. Finnish people don't basically do any small talk at all and that's why many tourists think that Finns are rude...

 

[moronmountain]

You know, many European countries don't have this "small talk" thingie like americans do. Finnish people don't basically do any small talk at all and that's why many tourists think that Finns are rude...

I understand that, but I was pointing out specific things like slamming into people while simply walking down the side walk. I wasn't expecting small talk from Italian people at all. Especially considering that I don't speak Italian. I could see that the peeps in Germany and Ireland didn't do much "small talk" either, but they would say excuse me if they bumped into you, or let you pass if you both came to the same spot at the same time. They would do their best to explain where something was if you were lost. Some of the people in Ireland were even a tad talkative at times. We had a great conversation with our cab driver and the first bus driver we came across drove us all the way to our hotel to save us from getting lost since the bus stop was about 5 blocks away. The only "rude" people I found in Ireland were immigrants. I could see how the people outside of Dublin would be very friendly had we got to meet any of them. I automatically assume that people in larger cities are going to be less friendly than in small ones, and the people in Dublin were friendly enough as it was. I do get what you mean though. My first post had more to do with choices and prices than people however. I think this thread went astray at some point hehe.

 

[Bob Savage]

My first post had more to do with choices and prices than people however. I think this thread went astray at some point hehe.

So basically, you're saying that Europeans are rude pigs, right?

 

[moronmountain]

My first post had more to do with choices and prices than people however. I think this thread went astray at some point hehe.

So basically, you're saying that Europeans are rude pigs, right?

That must be it..........

 

[Telephant]

They way you describe Romans is how Id describe yankees.

]

 

[neilrocks25]

You know, many European countries don't have this "small talk" thingie like americans do. Finnish people don't basically do any small talk at all and that's why many tourists think that Finns are rude...

I understand that, but I was pointing out specific things like slamming into people while simply walking down the side walk. I wasn't expecting small talk from Italian people at all. Especially considering that I don't speak Italian. I could see that the peeps in Germany and Ireland didn't do much "small talk" either, but they would say excuse me if they bumped into you, or let you pass if you both came to the same spot at the same time. They would do their best to explain where something was if you were lost. Some of the people in Ireland were even a tad talkative at times. We had a great conversation with our cab driver and the first bus driver we came across drove us all the way to our hotel to save us from getting lost since the bus stop was about 5 blocks away. The only "rude" people I found in Ireland were immigrants. I could see how the people outside of Dublin would be very friendly had we got to meet any of them. I automatically assume that people in larger cities are going to be less friendly than in small ones, and the people in Dublin were friendly enough as it was. I do get what you mean though. My first post had more to do with choices and prices than people however. I think this thread went astray at some point hehe.

I get yah

 

[philb]

So far, I've been to Ireland (Dublin), Sweden (Stockholm) and France (Paris).
I really liked every country. For food, Paris was tops. Ireland was really cool as well, nice people all around. Stockholm was somewhat of a letdown. Unfortunately, I went there in February and it's no fun in February. Prices were reasonable but I'm from Canada...

 

['63-Strat]

See, I'm sure you were being polite as far as you understand that term. But to an Italian that has (likely unjustified) prejudice against americans anyways, seeing American tourists coming out of a McDonald's is going to trigger some "rudeness," IMO. Your dress as a tourist plays a big role in how you will be treated in a foreign country too. Big time, IMO.

So because he didn't get setup with an authentic Italian wardrobe, and didn't stay out of McDonalds, he should expect to be treated poorly because he "looks like a tourist?" Man, that's going to make vacations a LOT more expensive. Not only that, I need to remember to be rude to tourists in the U.S. who don't fit in, I guess.

Not what I meant at all, Bob.

To clarify, visiting a foreign country is a privilege. Much of the World doesn't like the US, justified or not. So if you go around wearing cargo shorts and wearing a size XXL shirt that says something lewd like Everything is bigger in Texas with an arrow pointing at your cock, american flag baseball cap, acting like you're entitled to something just because you're there and American etc, camera flashing in locals' faces without asking permission, you shouldn't be surprised when you're treated badly. I'm *not* saying that's the case with moronmountain, because I really don't know the guy nor what he was acting/dressed like etc. But I have been to near 20 different countries and really never had a problem with any locals ever, other than almost getting robbed /mugged by a cab driver in Bangkok, and unfortunately just about any farang has the potential for that to happen, even thais too. I have seen some American tourists acting *very* badly abroad, as well as Canadians and Italians and Brits. Those are probably the worst offenders in my experience. So if moronmountain says some prick slammed into his woman, I don't doubt it. Just that when someone says they weren't thrilled with Europe because people were rude I'm instantly wondering why. That's all

 

['63-Strat]

See, I'm sure you were being polite as far as you understand that term. But to an Italian that has (likely unjustified) prejudice against americans anyways, seeing American tourists coming out of a McDonald's is going to trigger some "rudeness," IMO. Your dress as a tourist plays a big role in how you will be treated in a foreign country too. Big time, IMO.

So because he didn't get setup with an authentic Italian wardrobe, and didn't stay out of McDonalds, he should expect to be treated poorly because he "looks like a tourist?" Man, that's going to make vacations a LOT more expensive. Not only that, I need to remember to be rude to tourists in the U.S. who don't fit in, I guess.

HAHA! No kidding! They are ALL about fashion in Italy. Even the "poor" peeps are metro sexual looking. Everyone there is thin and way overdressed. My wife got scolded by nuns twice. Once for taking a pic of a group of them and once for wearing shorts lol!

See, this is not surprising to me at all. Its their country and their culture, you're entitled to your opinion of it, but your idea of what the "norm" is isn't valid while in another country. You likely seemed heavy and under-dressed, which if we're talking about any religious sites, is totally disrespectful to people who have dedicated their lives to their faith. Not to mention taking photos of locals without permission is asking for trouble anywhere you go IMO. For reference you simply would not be allowed to enter certain buildings period for wearing shorts in other countries, and if you took photos in an area you're not allowed to, or of locals without permission you could easily be in a situation where you're gonna have to bribe your way out of it. I'm not saying its right for people to have prejudice against american tourists due to their political beliefs, but that's the reality. And the shorts and camera etiquette has nothing to do with being American, fwiw.

 

[Bob Savage]

To clarify, visiting a foreign country is a privilege.

This is true and needs to be kept in mind by those who aren't American too. I'm not going to rant, but I've encountered PLENTY of seemingly rude tourists. You know what I do? I chalk it up as a cultural thing and go about my business (in most cases). Perhaps that's the wrong approach?

 

['63-Strat]

To clarify, visiting a foreign country is a privilege.

This is true and needs to be kept in mind by those who aren't American too. I'm not going to rant, but I've encountered PLENTY of seemingly rude tourists. You know what I do? I chalk it up as a cultural thing and go about my business (in most cases). Perhaps that's the wrong approach?

I'm pretty sure I didn't advocate anyone treating tourists badly I use the same approach myself, there are tons of tourists in Vancouver, and of course in hollywood every freaking second of every day... All I'm saying is, when in Rome...

 

[moronmountain]

See, I'm sure you were being polite as far as you understand that term. But to an Italian that has (likely unjustified) prejudice against americans anyways, seeing American tourists coming out of a McDonald's is going to trigger some "rudeness," IMO. Your dress as a tourist plays a big role in how you will be treated in a foreign country too. Big time, IMO.

So because he didn't get setup with an authentic Italian wardrobe, and didn't stay out of McDonalds, he should expect to be treated poorly because he "looks like a tourist?" Man, that's going to make vacations a LOT more expensive. Not only that, I need to remember to be rude to tourists in the U.S. who don't fit in, I guess.

Not what I meant at all, Bob.

To clarify, visiting a foreign country is a privilege. Much of the World doesn't like the US, justified or not. So if you go around wearing cargo shorts and wearing a size XXL shirt that says something lewd like Everything is bigger in Texas with an arrow pointing at your cock, american flag baseball cap, acting like you're entitled to something just because you're there and American etc, camera flashing in locals' faces without asking permission, you shouldn't be surprised when you're treated badly. I'm *not* saying that's the case with moronmountain, because I really don't know the guy nor what he was acting/dressed like etc. But I have been to near 20 different countries and really never had a problem with any locals ever, other than almost getting robbed /mugged by a cab driver in Bangkok, and unfortunately just about any farang has the potential for that to happen, even thais too. I have seen some American tourists acting *very* badly abroad, as well as Canadians and Italians and Brits. Those are probably the worst offenders in my experience. So if moronmountain says some prick slammed into his woman, I don't doubt it. Just that when someone says they weren't thrilled with Europe because people were rude I'm instantly wondering why. That's all

I never said European peeps were rude, just the ones in Rome.

 

[Telephant]

All I'm saying is, when in Rome...

You witty son of a bitch.

 

[moronmountain]

So because he didn't get setup with an authentic Italian wardrobe, and didn't stay out of McDonalds, he should expect to be treated poorly because he "looks like a tourist?" Man, that's going to make vacations a LOT more expensive. Not only that, I need to remember to be rude to tourists in the U.S. who don't fit in, I guess.

HAHA! No kidding! They are ALL about fashion in Italy. Even the "poor" peeps are metro sexual looking. Everyone there is thin and way overdressed. My wife got scolded by nuns twice. Once for taking a pic of a group of them and once for wearing shorts lol!

See, this is not surprising to me at all. Its their country and their culture, you're entitled to your opinion of it, but your idea of what the "norm" is isn't valid while in another country. You likely seemed heavy and under-dressed, which if we're talking about any religious sites, is totally disrespectful to people who have dedicated their lives to their faith. Not to mention taking photos of locals without permission is asking for trouble anywhere you go IMO. For reference you simply would not be allowed to enter certain buildings period for wearing shorts in other countries, and if you took photos in an area you're not allowed to, or of locals without permission you could easily be in a situation where you're gonna have to bribe your way out of it. I'm not saying its right for people to have prejudice against american tourists due to their political beliefs, but that's the reality. And the shorts and camera etiquette has nothing to do with being American, fwiw.

Well you can say what you want, but I'm not a pushy prick to someone who wears a turban in the US. I understand the nuns giving my wife a dirty look for taking a pic, and for letting her know that shorts weren't allowed in a certain area, but that's not what I'm talking about here. I'm talking about just walking down the street or riding the metro. People were pushy, rude, and jerks in general.

 

[Bob Savage]

I'm pretty sure I didn't advocate anyone treating tourists badly I use the same approach myself, there are tons of tourists in Vancouver, and of course in hollywood every freaking second of every day... All I'm saying is, when in Rome...

I was pretty sure that's not what you were saying, but you seemed to be defending both sides of the argument so I wasn't exactly certain what you were advocating.

I understand the "when in Rome" philosophy, but we need to be practical. Seemless integration while on vacation isn't likely.

 

['63-Strat]

I'm pretty sure I didn't advocate anyone treating tourists badly I use the same approach myself, there are tons of tourists in Vancouver, and of course in hollywood every freaking second of every day... All I'm saying is, when in Rome...

I was pretty sure that's not what you were saying, but you seemed to be defending both sides of the argument so I wasn't exactly certain what you were advocating.

I understand the "when in Rome" philosophy, but we need to be practical. Seemless integration while on vacation isn't likely.

Like I said, I've done a fair bit of travelling and like anything, you learn from experience. It really doesn't take as much effort as you think to stick out a little less. Case in point, to generalize all Romans as pushy, rude and jerks as a result of one trip there (when they were admittedly not behaving entirely kosher) to me just says that maybe cultural travel isn't for them. Even taking the time to browse through a lonely planet first would save people a lot of disappointment. Better yet, read up on the places you're going to first so you can appreciate what you're seeing.