Einstein plus what Diezel cab?

[dass101]

I recieved the G12ks the other day and tested them in a few configurations. First, I replaced the V30 that I have in my small 1x12 open back. I use the cab mostly at home, at low levels. For this, the G12k was more of a dissapoinment, the V30 deliveres a better low volume midrange.
Next I replaced one of the V30s in my Mesa 2x12, and listened to them separately with the Diezel Einstein, at medium-high level.
Each speaker has something that the other one lacks. The G12k has better midrange definition but definitely scooped, a less boomy bass, and more pronounced highs. The V30 has a muddier midrange, but a much better "growl", the famous high mid that you either love or hate, and less highs.
I kept going back and forth and really couldn't decide if I was to chose only one, which will it be.
I can surely understand why some people, probably players who play very heavy stuff, love the G12ks. They are very clear, no frequency "choking", with tight bass and scooped.
Indeed, it seems that the very mid rich Diezel sound is better served by them, but I'm not sure that the lack of upper mids would be ok in a band mix.
Obviously in the end I tested the combination, and it seems to be a winner. I will have to play it some more, with the whole band. When I will have a little more time I will also test the cab with both G12ks, but I already have the feeling that I won't like it better.
It's quite possible that in a front loaded cab they would sound better, from what I understand that brings up the upper mids a bit, which would definitely help.

 

[DvE]

Nice little review and totally share your experience (even if I have a herbert and not an einstein).

To me the G12ks have a GREAT bottom end, but sound neutral/lifeless alone. Your words capture those tonal characteristics the same way I would have described it.
I have my 4x12 Diezel fl cab with 2 g12Ks on the one side and 2 v30s on the other. Love the mix, but if I want one type alone, I can still use it as a 2x12 - realy flexible in this way

 

[dass101]

Thanks, I figured I could help a bit on the neverending V30 vs G12k debate

 

[sombersoul]

Definitely an interesting read! I still haven't ordered a Diezel cab, since the frontloaded ones with G12K100 had gone out of stock by the time I decided, haha. I e-mailed Peter S. to ask about availability (and the possibility to get a mixed configuration) almost a week ago but never got any sort of response.

 

[Rob Tahan]

Its done now... GK100's mixed with Hempcones in my new diezel RL 4x12.
Sounds pretty bangin. I only got to play it for a little while on my Einstein, but its intended to be for playing on the road with my herbert. So while i want to report awesome stuff, i cant till the 23rd (our next big show).
HOWEVER..i did compare it to my Bogner 1X12 with cl-80s that i love.
I can say that overall there are things i love about it which include ARTICULATION, No apparent Spike, and great Dynamics! Andy Timmons would be proud
Things i did not seem to like that much (but not really bad) were the fact that the cab is a little bright for my liking. I really like dark warm cabs. But i can also say that because i love that warm compressed feel. This cab still seems to retain that feel but yet making it a little on the bright side.
OVERALL, when comparing this to my Bogner, this cab wins out for overall better tone.
The GK's seem to overpower the Hemps for whatever reason. Even before, the hemps seemed to be a speaker that easily seems to get buried in the mix. They also colour your sound. Very Greenback'ish.. AMAZING rythym tone though..!
For the Eric Johnsony tone i like the GK's and actually my OLD diezel RL with the Custom Eminence speakers. This is why i thought this combo would be great together. I like my Rythym stuff grainy and my lead stuff smooooooth and clear.
I have faith that this will be a great combination and hope to report back with even more results.
So far i recommend it highly for players who want several sound combinations and who like to play multiple styles. Try it and let me know your thoughts about it as well. Im really curious as to what others may think about it also.
Cheers

Im reposting this in a separate thread for ease of finding this topic.

 

[sombersoul]

Just a little update from the thread starter:

I still haven't bought a new cab. I'm a bit frustrated at the moment, since I seem to be stagnating with my decision. And this after (or maybe because of) reading about 90% of all relevant posts on the Internet.

I've discarded the idea of a 4x12 cab. Been there, done that. In recent years I've been playing through 2x12 cabs (sometimes one, sometimes two), and with good reasons (space, volume etc.). While I certainly enjoy 4x12 cabs, they are just not practical for me. So they're out of the question (for the moment).

This still leaves me with some major decisions like 2x12 FL or RL, V30s or Hempcones or any possible mixture (also including other speakers such as the K100 or even a G12H30).

I decided it would be best to talk to someone at Diezel about the various cab and speaker options. Reading these (and other) forums I always got the impression that it's easy to get hold of one of the Peters and perhaps even order directly through them. I tried phoning Dillingen several times - without success - and I also wrote two e-mails to Peter S.

Another reason why I simply can't go ahead and get a cab is the fact the the major online stores never have the full Diezel line in stock. They usually have the 4x12 RL and FL with V30s and the 2x12 RL V30.

Naturally, if I get a Diezel 2x12, I want one of the latest build. Can someone please tell me if there have been cosmetic changes as well? What I mean: Do the newer 2x12 cabs also have the salt & pepper grill cloth? I'm asking because I've certainly seen Diezel 2x12s with a black grill cloth - or maybe that's just the new 2x12 hempcone? And what about the new 2x12 FL? Product photos at the online shops show the normal-sized version. But I remember reading repeatedly that the new 2x12 FL cabs are also oversized now.

So, even if I were to come to a decision myself, I'd be hesitant to order for fear of getting old stock, but maybe that's just silly. Hopefully, someone can clear this up and tell me about the latest versions of the Diezel 2x12 cabs.

Right now, and I know I shouldn't be saying this, I'm also considering the Bogner 212 OS, since I've been reading nothing but great things about it. I wouldn't mind the brand mismatch, as this 2x12 cabs seems to be a great all-rounder. I certainly want to get a cab I can keep for years to come and which also maybe works well with many other amps.

However, a Diezel 2x12 would be fantastic! But at the moment, it is not foreseeable when I'll be able to get one (or get hold of one of the Peters).

 

[dass101]

Just a quick update. I decided against the G12K in my cab, and will most likely return to the original 2xV30. I tried recording with only miking the G12k, and was pretty dissapointed. I can't say anything about how would these speakers sound in FL cabs, or in 4x12, but a RL 2x12 with V30 is something that's too good to try and fix it

 

[duncan]

Yeah, I ended up getting rid of that MF400 cab after hearing it mic'd. In the room, it sounded good (a bit boomy, but that's probably from the OS Marshall cab) but through a mic it sounded like crap.

I still really REALLY want some Hemp cones. Anyone getting rid of any?

 

[sombersoul]

To round off this thread...I finally went ahead and ordered a new Diezel 2x12 RC with V30s. Haven't been able to try it with my Einstein yet but tomorrow will be the day!

 

[PBGas]

I have a Diezel 2x12FL. It had the Diezel Eminence speakers in it. I changed them out and just by fluke.....(I had ordered 2 G12K-100s - one showed up with a squashed cone). I took a new V30 they had in stock and put them both into my cab.

Well....I must say, I was really surprised. Must be the combination of the two of them but it just works very nicely for me! Great clarity and bottom end. Perfect!

Keeping this setup!

 

[dass101]

To round off this thread...I finally went ahead and ordered a new Diezel 2x12 RC with V30s. Haven't been able to try it with my Einstein yet but tomorrow will be the day!

Hey, did you get the cab, can you post some initial impressions?

 

[sombersoul]

Hey, did you get the cab, can you post some initial impressions?

Sure! I got to play the cab yesterday for a few hours. At first, I tried it out alone but when the rest of the band came, we immediately started playing together, so I don't feel I have deeply explored the cab. Nevertheless, here are my initial impressions:

The cab is very well built. I immediately liked the way it looks and feels. It seems to me that despite its size, it is still somewhat lighter than my Orange PPC 212. But I haven't looked at any figures.

The cab comes with casters which you can easily slip into an already installed metal mounting on the bottom. With casters installed, the cab rolls smoothly. Other cabs I had would give a bumpier experience, so to speak.

Hooking up my Einstein to the cab, I was satisfied with the now homogeneous look and feel of my setup.

How does the cab sound? With the restriction of the new and consequently stiff V30s (which we all know only get better over time), I was pleased with what I was hearing. Firstly, the cab projects much, much better than my Orange PPC 212. This is probably due to the oversized construction and the slanted baffle.

The sound is rich and full without being overbearing or bloated in the bass. There is a certain tightness to this cabinet which works well with the Diezel sound - what a surprise! As mentioned in my initial post, the Orange is somewhat dark, muffled and too bassy with the Einstein. In comparison, the Diezel cab sounds a little less warm and has a tighter bass. It also sounds less woody. All in all, I would say that it is simply more defined (and therefore subjectively a quantum thinner or, let's say, more modern) than the Orange. This is exactly what I wanted with the Einstein!

I still have to find the best EQ settings with the new cab. In a band context, I was certainly able to hear myself much better due to the improved projection. It may have been a matter of positioning but for the first time in a long time, the other guitarist's sound (he was using my Orange) almost disappeared, which demonstrated the directionality of the Orange.

It was a good decision to go Diezel with the cab. However, it is hardly suprising that amp and cab from the same manufacturer are ideal.

I wonder how the Diezel cab works with other amps. I would assume that it fits well with similarly dark voiced amps that produce a thick sound with lots of bass. On the other hand, the Orange is great with bright amps that need some high-mids/treble cut.

Right now, my only point of criticism are the not-yet-broken in V30s. But that's just a matter of time. So far, the highs are not very clear. I haven't carried out any break-in procedure but maybe I will. Or maybe I'll just play the cab and see how it gets better and better.

 

[dass101]

Thanks!
Is there any reason why you went for the RL instead of the FL V30? I find the FL appealing because of the smaller size, and just because I'd like to try something more radically different then my Mesa.

 

[sombersoul]

I was considering the FL for a long time. I'm still tempted to get one sooner or later. But that wouldn't make sense, since I want to keep my setup small and simple.

Why did I go with the RL? First of all, I couldn't find a single store in Central Europe which had the FL in stock or even offers it. Contacting Peter S. or phoning Dillingen wasn't met with success. Then, after some more thought, I concluded that the RL must be the more versatile cab and probably works well with other amps. Not that I have immediate plans but we're musicians with GAS. There's always a new amp around the corner somewhere. My idea was to finally get a really, really good cab and keep it, despite the head that is sitting on top. My other candidate was the Bogner OS.

It is my impression, or at least this is what I've gathered from people's posts and reviews, that the FL is really ideal, if you play heavy most of the time. I decided that a more vintagy flavour suits my band better, even though we do play heavy in quite a few songs but it's certainly not any extreme kind. For quite a few songs, a huge, round wall of distortion is what I want.

I also was a little bit afraid that a FL cab might be too tight and aggressive for me. The 6550 Einstein is already quite tight and has a quick attack. I was also concerned that the overall sound might come out too bright with a FL cab.

But really, these are all speculations. I went with the "rational solution", so to speak. Maybe I was wrong and maybe the FL cab is what I really want. Not being able to try out cabs certainly is a big disadvantage.

If I should ever get another 2x12 for my Diezel, I will most certainly consider a frontloaded cab. For now, I'm content with the classic, well-known sound of a V30 rearloaded. I simply think this is somewhat of a standard piece of equipment that most guitarists have.

 

[dass101]

I totally understand your reasoning, I also don't have any chance to try the cabs, and I actually never heard a FL cab before. I'm pretty satisfied with the Mesa, and keep telling myself that the upgrade just isn't worth it. Hmm, we'll see

 

[sombersoul]

I simply like a rounder and fuller sound. They way frontloaded cabs are usually described, it sounds to me as if they're rather bright, focussed (the word laser beam like was mentioned various times) and super direct. Especially the last bit made me worry if it really suits my playing style. So, yeah, I played safe, so to speak. But I have bought and returned gear often in my life, and I'm just tired of it all. I want a few great pieces of equipment, as versatile as possible.

Of course, I won't stop investing in gear. It's part of my hobby. But having a solid basic equipment reduces the immediate need to find a good setup. Now I can lean back, relax, knowing that I have a good and working high quality setup. And whenever I got some spare money (haha), I can try out new stuff, which I can return just as quickly, if it doesn't meet my taste, without being left in limbo, i.e. with an incomplete rig.

 

[Nico]

I simply like a rounder and fuller sound. They way frontloaded cabs are usually described, it sounds to me as if they're rather bright, focussed (the word laser beam like was mentioned various times) and super direct. Especially the last bit made me worry if it really suits my playing style. So, yeah, I played safe, so to speak. But I have bought and returned gear often in my life, and I'm just tired of it all. I want a few great pieces of equipment, as versatile as possible.

Of course, I won't stop investing in gear. It's part of my hobby. But having a solid basic equipment reduces the immediate need to find a good setup. Now I can lean back, relax, knowing that I have a good and working high quality setup. And whenever I got some spare money (haha), I can try out new stuff, which I can return just as quickly, if it doesn't meet my taste, without being left in limbo, i.e. with an incomplete rig.

I am in the exact situation right now I have 2 alternatives get a Mesa 2x12 here where I live in Argentina or have my brother bring me a Diezel 2x12 from Europe in a months time. Were actually looking at 300 Dollar difference as well (Diezel most expensive)

What do you guys think of the mesa 2x12 with the Einstein head? I play mostly hard rock and metal...

Regards,

 

[dass101]

Nico, I recently got rid of the Mesa 2x12. Sounded good played live, but the real test for me was a recording session. We're talking about a very expensive studio, with top notch mics and pres, great room, etc. I had a lot of time to set up and try every possible combination of mics, pres and positioning.
In the end, after 2 days I gave up, everything sounded muddy, I had to keep the bass on the amp very low to get any definition, which wrecked the sound of the amp, also the top end was always lacking definition.
I ordered a little 1x12 Suhr CAA cab, loaded it with a V30, and did some more recordings. Everything sounded perfect, everything was balanced and defined.
I sold the Mesa and didn't miss it for a second, even if I still believe that Mesa's V30's are way better then the stock ones, the cab itself was boomy, and all the upper frequencies were smeared.

I really suggest that you take a look at the CAA cabs, they also have a 2x12 model, here in Europe it's less expensive then a Diezel, and about the same as a Mesa. My next 2x12, if I will ever buy one again, will probably one of those.
Again, in the room the Mesa sounds really good, it sounds big and crushing, but if you are looking for studio quality, it's not there...

 

[Nico]

Nico, I recently got rid of the Mesa 2x12. Sounded good played live, but the real test for me was a recording session. We're talking about a very expensive studio, with top notch mics and pres, great room, etc. I had a lot of time to set up and try every possible combination of mics, pres and positioning.
In the end, after 2 days I gave up, everything sounded muddy, I had to keep the bass on the amp very low to get any definition, which wrecked the sound of the amp, also the top end was always lacking definition.
I ordered a little 1x12 Suhr CAA cab, loaded it with a V30, and did some more recordings. Everything sounded perfect, everything was balanced and defined.
I sold the Mesa and didn't miss it for a second, even if I still believe that Mesa's V30's are way better then the stock ones, the cab itself was boomy, and all the upper frequencies were smeared.

I really suggest that you take a look at the CAA cabs, they also have a 2x12 model, here in Europe it's less expensive then a Diezel, and about the same as a Mesa. My next 2x12, if I will ever buy one again, will probably one of those.
Again, in the room the Mesa sounds really good, it sounds big and crushing, but if you are looking for studio quality, it's not there...

Thats excellent to know, could you point me out to a store or a site that has them? Im actually going to buy them through the internet and my brother is going to make me a huge favor and carry it here, I will not make him go out and shop for my cab though.

You have been really helpful, regards...

Does anyone know how much the Diezel cabs weigh? I've seen the 2x12 rear loaded at Thomman online store and they seem huge!!!

 

[dass101]

www.station-music.de carries Suhr stuff, at very good prices, that's where I ordered mine from. You can also check out www.musik-schmidt.de , they also have a video of the CAA 2x12 here is the link http://www.musik-schmidt.de/gb-Custom-A ... -2x12.html