FORTIN's Evil Pumpkin – Made in China?

[scottosan]

If this Corona issue persists for an extended timeframe, Anything using electronic components will likely experience supply chain disruption regardless of where it’s actually made. Since most of the components come from China anyway.

Thanks God - but nothing of the components which I'm using for my builds originate of China

Yes but chances are they will still get said Fortin amp before yours.

Yes they will get an amp with Fortin's name on it

 

[novosibir]

If this Corona issue persists for an extended timeframe, Anything using electronic components will likely experience supply chain disruption regardless of where it’s actually made. Since most of the components come from China anyway.

Thanks God - but nothing of the components which I'm using for my builds originate of China

Yes but chances are they will still get said Fortin amp before yours.

Yes they will get an amp with Fortin's name on it

Interesting also and what makes me thinkful ist the fact, that about all the Fortin amp models which have been built from Mike himself in Canada before and which are the Bones, the Meathead and the NATAS now on the Fortin web page it says:

"currently not available"

I don't know, whether you already know, that the Meshugga and the Cali anyway never have been built by Mike himself in Canada, but have been and still are being ghost built of other people's hands in the USA as well as his speaker cabinets.

The Evil Pumpkin and the SIGIL are claimed being made in the U.K. – so it seems that the undisputed master of plagiarism already doesn't have enough time left over anymore, to build his rip-offs currently by himself, using his own hands?

What might be the reason? Maybe meanwhile he's dedicating all his time for dealing with his chinese partners and the companies over there?

Fortin doesn't need components anymore, since he isn't an amp manufacturer anymore, meanwhile only an amp dealer

 

[japetus]

If this Corona issue persists for an extended timeframe, Anything using electronic components will likely experience supply chain disruption regardless of where it’s actually made. Since most of the components come from China anyway.

Excellent point.

I’m just sitting here laughing, thinking about how badly these posts are going to age. Wew.

 

[Beyond Black]

Larry modded Marshall sounds rightous

This Marshall rebuild I've accomplished already back in 1995
The circuit of this amp never has been updated since then, just retubed the amp once.
It's been 25 years ago - with my knowledge & experience of 25 years ago
You really can't imagine, how a current DINO is sounding in reality.

Holy shit that’s sounds amazing! Lush, fat and juicy. A ton of gain yet still articulate. Beautiful sounding amp!
And to all of you guys disparaging Larry for how many hours he puts it, just STFU. If you have an amp on order, then you knew how long the wait was going into it. If you don’t, it’s none of your concern. If the man can make a comfortable living doing what he loves without working a ton of hours, then he’s got it all figured out. Not all people are greedy and think that wealth equals happiness!
Same goes to whoever is questioning how good his amps sound based on a few shitty YouTube clips. Would he be able to charge what he does, have customers wait as long as they do, and still enjoy legendary, almost mythical status if they were all hype? No, he wouldn’t. Because word of such undeserved hype would spread like an Australian wildfire. Unless you know what the hell you’re talking about, refrain from cluttering posts with ignorant comments....

 

[japetus]

Damn! Come meet my Smith and Wesson sure sounds like a threat to me. You say that shit to me you better be ready to pull that trigger!.

Limp Bizkit 2020

 

[SBlue]

Re: Fascinating Topic over at Rig-Talk...
Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:50 am

what a crazy circus this entire thing is.
i've owned many Fortin modded marshall's, they sounded great.
I've always had a good relationship with Mike Fortin.
When he left Randall he was looking at possibly getting out of the music gear business.
I offered encouragement and even offered to help him finds jobs thru career headhunters etc.
It was a tough time for him and as a friend I tried to be supportive.
Then the pedals came and he bounced back. great for him.

I was always a Meshuggah fan and Mike knew that, when he handmade the first 6 meshuggah amps he offered me one, of course I bought it.
I paid $3600 ish after the smoke cleared.
It was underwhelming and I took it to Friedman for him to check out.
Friedman looked inside and said it was a "double Jose" made from $1400 in parts.

After years of doing video demos of Fortin's , being a staunch supporter and considering myself a friend of the guy , I realized that I may have overpaid for that amp and Mike was glad to take my money without any consideration for my efforts in promoting his brand.
I sold it for 3700 and got out of it. I wasn't happy. the truth is the amp was designed to be used a very specific way to get a sound for a specific band in a specific tuning with specific guitars, none of which was my intended use, but i still bristled a little at the lack of a discount or any consideration considering it was at best a $3k amp imho.

I never had a problem with Zack, but he turned on me in my own ESP Guitars Fanatics group on FB and started to attack me. I've been going to NAMM since the mid 90's (when he was a baby). I know people in a lot of companies and have many relationships that pre date his involvement in any music retail gear business. He was always the guy selling "artist" owned guitar from bands he would fanboy over. Never had a problem with him being a dickrider for these bands and always trying to align himself as an "insider" with the bands. Ive seen plenty of those cats who crave attention and association thru fanboyism. TO his credit, he parlayed that into the best gig of his life. He gets to say he "reps" Fortin amps at the height of their popularity! Is he the best person for the job, NOPE. But I bet it doesnt really pay a whole lot but gives him ACCESS and CLOUT which he has ALWAYS wanted to have. Unfortunately in my experience with him and watching his responses on some of the threads, He is completely unprofessional and imo not handling this with any real skill or the marks of someone experienced in the game of brand Public relations.

I make large and small scale video productions for manufacturers. Ex:
I have a lot more going behind the scenes than my shitty little lo-fi youtube channel that's only for hard core gear hounds.
Zack really has no idea the depth of my involvement in the business or my experience yet he tried to character attack me in MY group in front ESP Guitars top brass that all know me better!
It was pathetic and ended what I considered was a decent internet based "friendship". But now I got no love for Zack. He showed his true colors to me and from these threads he has been attacking Larry on, he has no class. Especially bringing Steve K into the mix, trying to lean on an old friend of mine's death for attack fuel on Larry. Its ugly and weak to do that.

Needless to say i'm happy that Mike Fortin found someone so desperate and hungry for clout and "power" in this space to help him market and hype his business. Mike makes gear people like and deserves all the success he can garner in a really tough business. I don't have to like Zack, but I'm glad Mike has help. i'm cool with Jason and anytime he comes to LA i'm always down to grab a bite and do some guitar safari.

all of that being said.

I have had a Larry on order for close to 16 months, Larry says I should have it by October of this year, a few months over the previous delivery date of june/july.

Larry has been responsive and communication has never been strained via FB messenger.

I don't have any problem with the deposit or the wait time. I have waited 12 months for an ESP custom shop, 11 months for a Jackson Custom shop, almost 2 years for a Ken Lawrence explorer...

you want boutique and rare, you gotta wait. I don't have a problem with the price either. i know Larry is making the amps by hand himself and his work looks incredibly clean. that's art to me.
i'm paying for the level of attention to detail and quality of sound. Hopefully it feels like $6k of tone.

My Ken Lawrence's both FEEL like they are worth every penny. They sound and play like a dream and I understand the value of the instrument is equal to the tag.

People are paying $6k and waiting for a relic'd TELECASTER from Fender...and for the most part...they end up being the best sounding telecasters!

Hopefully the Larry amp will have sound to match the wait and meets my expectations, if not it will find a new home and i will go back to any of the other amps I have.
Last edited by ADVGANG on Mon Feb 17, 2020 11:25 am, edited 2 times in tota

Oh man! What model are you getting from Larry?

 

[skullfxr]

I really don't understand why people have an issue or wait with lead time or 'why' he doesn't put out more.

From what people are saying, they are aware of the lead time and don't have a problem waiting.

From what I gather, (Larry, correct me if I am wrong) Larry is content where he is at. If he wanted to work more, he could.

I said in another thread regarding myself, I choose to work a LOT less than I could, and yes I could make a lot more money. But I am happy where I am at. I have time to enjoy my daughter, and I actually set aside about two hours a day to play guitar. I enjoy where I am at. And I think Larry is too (again Larry, correct me if I am wrong).

Money is not happiness. Some people don't want to grind their nose into the ground their whole life.

Also as wiseblood said, it's a specialty product, and at that level, wait times are a common thing. If you want a custom spec'd whateverthefuck it takes time. From custom guitars to cars and motorcycles. I have a family member big in the cycle world. He has a long wait last time I talked to him. It's a 152ci motor with a turbo and he goes for whatever spec the customer wants to a degree. His bikes aren't mass produced Harleys, just as Larry's aren't off the shelf mass produced Marshalls or what have you.

 

[SandyRavage]

After reading this whole thread I’m surprised how insanely unproductive many people have been on almost every level...

You could say peavey stole the soldano circuit for the 5150, or soldano stole from Marshall and so on and so forth. The Dino sounds cool and I had never heard of it until this thread.

That being said I couldn’t give a fuck where these are made or who stole what from who because they sound cool.... ordering a Sigil this week.

 

[duesentrieb]

@ Larry: echt jetzt?

 

[Luca79]

Friedman looked inside and said it was a "double Jose" made from $1400 in parts.

1400$ for a 50 watt single channel is a good budget. I doubt the most expensive amp have much more value in parts.

 

[scottosan]

Friedman looked inside and said it was a "double Jose" made from $1400 in parts.

1400$ for a 50 watt single channel is a good budget. I doubt the most expensive amp have much more value in parts.

The cost is in the iron. Some higher end transformers will add cost and well as channel switching and any custom chassis or cabinets. That amp though is for the most part complety off the shelf everything

 

[Luca79]

Friedman looked inside and said it was a "double Jose" made from $1400 in parts.

1400$ for a 50 watt single channel is a good budget. I doubt the most expensive amp have much more value in parts.

The cost is in the iron. Some higher end transformers will add cost and well as channel switching and any custom chassis or cabinets. That amp though is for the most part complety off the shelf everything

Ok, but usually i see around 100$ each transformer, so 200/300$ choke included? I still think 1400$ in parts is a quality build, IMO. Correct me if i'm wrong.

 

[scottosan]

wisebloods last post was actually rezamatix and no one figured it out...

Reza’s actually crying about how it was posted here. Wiseblood you better delete it!

Hey scottosan why still no answer? You seem to know everything but can’t answer my simple question. I asked twice and still nothing. The reason is obvious.

There is also a very interesting post on the guitar gear forum by user name “theghostnow”. It’s a long one.

Are you referring to the Peavey, Mesa, and Marshall? I'm not going to defend their crappy business practices either. Why do you think I got i to building my own amps? I have said many times outside of this thread that this industry seriously lacks transparency. You name it, amps, pedals, etc.. I don't like it, but I tend to "tolerate" it to some level based on several factors. Those factors are

1. Is the maker supplementing their existing portfolio of existing designs? The big 3 have shown they are capable of their own R&D and have skins on the wall. Some had a firm market base before they make "based on" amps. Fortins whole ride to fame was built on copy other people work. He had no skins on the wall.

2. Value add. This being customer support, consistancy and longevity in its product lines and peace of mind to the customer that they have both the financial backing, resources and longevity in the industry to be there 10-15 years down the road and be able to provide support outside of Facebook and emails.

 

[scottosan]

Friedman looked inside and said it was a "double Jose" made from $1400 in parts.

1400$ for a 50 watt single channel is a good budget. I doubt the most expensive amp have much more value in parts.

The cost is in the iron. Some higher end transformers will add cost and well as channel switching and any custom chassis or cabinets. That amp though is for the most part complety off the shelf everything

Ok, but usually i see around 100$ each transformer, so 200/300$ choke included? I still think 1400$ in parts is a quality build, IMO. Correct me if i'm wrong.

for a.100 watt Mercury set, expect to pay $500 just for iron. $200 for chassis and nameplates, $280-300 for a cabinet etc. Labor, parts sourcing , blah blah blah. You get it

 

[RedB4Black]

If this Corona issue persists for an extended timeframe, Anything using electronic components will likely experience supply chain disruption regardless of where it’s actually made. Since most of the components come from China anyway.

Excellent point.

I’m just sitting here laughing, thinking about how badly these posts are going to age. Wew.

May or may not be an issue, I don't know...I'm no expert. There's no point arguing about it...it is certainly a reasonable concern at this point. I'm not talking specifically about amp production. Why do you think there's been stock market volatility related to corona virus news? Just use google to find countless articles on the subject...

https://www.eetimes.com/coronavirus-tes ... esilience/

https://technology.ihs.com/620903/omdia ... deployment

https://www.forbes.com/sites/annashedle ... e0274369c7

https://www.cnbc.com/2020/02/08/coronav ... idays.html

 

[skullfxr]

Krull- what is your dog in the fight? Just curious and not attacking. Just curious. You are very passionate in your responses. I have no beef with you.

The only problem I have here is the lack of professionalism on the Fortin A&R guy Engage, but I have no problem with him in general. I would not keep an employee around with that behavior tbh. But if Mr. Fortin likes him and keeps to have him around, that is his deal.

Larry is a fine guy. I just think he feels wronged that his life work got ripped off. I don't blame him.

But the real question is what do all of you want? I will probably never own a Fortin or Larry (as I have mentioned prior) because frankly they are out of my preferred budget.

Larry if you got acknowledgement for your design would you be happy? Royalties? Or just press? All of which is your own personal business.

I would like to get some answers for people instead of people making personal attacks. I am not a person to make personal attacks, that gets you nowhere.

 

[wIsEbLooD]

So you pick a side randomly and argue with people on the internet?

 

[skullfxr]

Krull- what is your dog in the fight? Just curious and not attacking. Just curious. You are very passionate in your responses. I have no beef with you.

The only problem I have here is the lack of professionalism on the Fortin A&R guy Engage, but I have no problem with him in general. I would not keep an employee around with that behavior tbh. But if Mr. Fortin likes him and keeps to have him around, that is his deal.

Larry is a fine guy. I just think he feels wronged that his life work got ripped off. I don't blame him.

But the real question is what do all of you want? I will probably never own a Fortin or Larry (as I have mentioned prior) because frankly they are out of my preferred budget.

Larry if you got acknowledgement for your design would you be happy? Royalties? Or just press? All of which is your own personal business.

I would like to get some answers for people instead of people making personal attacks. I am not a person to make personal attacks, that gets you nowhere.

Hey man. I have literally no affiliation with Fortin and am definitely not getting paid for this. I just like to challenge the narrative. I think I bring up good points and maybe some not so good points. But in the end I just like arguing against people who literally parrot the same things over and over again.

We obviously don’t know the whole story but one thing we do know is the argument of someone copying an amplifier, tweaking it, or not, re-labeling it calling it the latest and greatest is the name of the game. They all do it. It’s up to the customer to decide if they like when they hear it. And to me a Fortin and a Larry sound different. Just like a Soldano SLO sounds different that a Mesa Rectifier.

Fair enough brother ?

 

[Wizard of Ozz]

Re: Fascinating Topic over at Rig-Talk...
Mon Feb 17, 2020 10:50 am

what a crazy circus this entire thing is.
i've owned many Fortin modded marshall's, they sounded great.
I've always had a good relationship with Mike Fortin.
When he left Randall he was looking at possibly getting out of the music gear business.
I offered encouragement and even offered to help him finds jobs thru career headhunters etc.
It was a tough time for him and as a friend I tried to be supportive.
Then the pedals came and he bounced back. great for him.

I was always a Meshuggah fan and Mike knew that, when he handmade the first 6 meshuggah amps he offered me one, of course I bought it.
I paid $3600 ish after the smoke cleared.
It was underwhelming and I took it to Friedman for him to check out.
Friedman looked inside and said it was a "double Jose" made from $1400 in parts.

After years of doing video demos of Fortin's , being a staunch supporter and considering myself a friend of the guy , I realized that I may have overpaid for that amp and Mike was glad to take my money without any consideration for my efforts in promoting his brand.
I sold it for 3700 and got out of it. I wasn't happy. the truth is the amp was designed to be used a very specific way to get a sound for a specific band in a specific tuning with specific guitars, none of which was my intended use, but i still bristled a little at the lack of a discount or any consideration considering it was at best a $3k amp imho.

I never had a problem with Zack, but he turned on me in my own ESP Guitars Fanatics group on FB and started to attack me. I've been going to NAMM since the mid 90's (when he was a baby). I know people in a lot of companies and have many relationships that pre date his involvement in any music retail gear business. He was always the guy selling "artist" owned guitar from bands he would fanboy over. Never had a problem with him being a dickrider for these bands and always trying to align himself as an "insider" with the bands. Ive seen plenty of those cats who crave attention and association thru fanboyism. TO his credit, he parlayed that into the best gig of his life. He gets to say he "reps" Fortin amps at the height of their popularity! Is he the best person for the job, NOPE. But I bet it doesnt really pay a whole lot but gives him ACCESS and CLOUT which he has ALWAYS wanted to have. Unfortunately in my experience with him and watching his responses on some of the threads, He is completely unprofessional and imo not handling this with any real skill or the marks of someone experienced in the game of brand Public relations.

I make large and small scale video productions for manufacturers. Ex:
I have a lot more going behind the scenes than my shitty little lo-fi youtube channel that's only for hard core gear hounds.
Zack really has no idea the depth of my involvement in the business or my experience yet he tried to character attack me in MY group in front ESP Guitars top brass that all know me better!
It was pathetic and ended what I considered was a decent internet based "friendship". But now I got no love for Zack. He showed his true colors to me and from these threads he has been attacking Larry on, he has no class. Especially bringing Steve K into the mix, trying to lean on an old friend of mine's death for attack fuel on Larry. Its ugly and weak to do that.

Needless to say i'm happy that Mike Fortin found someone so desperate and hungry for clout and "power" in this space to help him market and hype his business. Mike makes gear people like and deserves all the success he can garner in a really tough business. I don't have to like Zack, but I'm glad Mike has help. i'm cool with Jason and anytime he comes to LA i'm always down to grab a bite and do some guitar safari.

all of that being said.

I have had a Larry on order for close to 16 months, Larry says I should have it by October of this year, a few months over the previous delivery date of june/july.

Larry has been responsive and communication has never been strained via FB messenger.

I don't have any problem with the deposit or the wait time. I have waited 12 months for an ESP custom shop, 11 months for a Jackson Custom shop, almost 2 years for a Ken Lawrence explorer...

you want boutique and rare, you gotta wait. I don't have a problem with the price either. i know Larry is making the amps by hand himself and his work looks incredibly clean. that's art to me.
i'm paying for the level of attention to detail and quality of sound. Hopefully it feels like $6k of tone.

My Ken Lawrence's both FEEL like they are worth every penny. They sound and play like a dream and I understand the value of the instrument is equal to the tag.

People are paying $6k and waiting for a relic'd TELECASTER from Fender...and for the most part...they end up being the best sounding telecasters!

Hopefully the Larry amp will have sound to match the wait and meets my expectations, if not it will find a new home and i will go back to any of the other amps I have.
Last edited by ADVGANG on Mon Feb 17, 2020 11:25 am, edited 2 times in tota

Reza is a good dude. We have had our disagreements but I have always defended him against the internet. I like Reza a lot. He is a good dude despite our disagreements at times. Nothing but respect and love for him. Shouldn't diss on him but I am sure someone will.

You sure about that Zachy? Read Reza's post from yesterday 2-17-2020 where he calls you: "a dickrider" "ugly, weak, and without class"... sure doesn't sound like he got the flowers and apology you sent?

I do like the "dickrider" name... pretty accurate too. Looks like you know what to with that Fartin cock like a pro for sho.

You are delusional. Period. You have mental issues. You claim everyone else has issues, is wrong, are liars etc, but not you. Oh... looks like Reza had to BAN you from his ESP Guitars Owners Facebook group too? Dam... another place you tried to infect and were thrown out of? Even Reza doesn't like you. Wow! You really are a POS.

So lets recap... forums, groups, et al Zach Khunty has been banned from:

We are up to 6... and counting:

Don't take my word for it... go to

http://www.sevenstring.org
http://www.metalguitarist.org
http://www.talkbass.com
https://www.espguitars.com/forums
https://www.facebook.com/groups/HEAVYME ... ANDPEDALS/
https://www.facebook.com/pages/category ... 839911887/

Search user: engage757 and see what it says next to his name... BANNED... from at least 6 different gear forums. And growing...

PS: Anybody need "pro-media-representation"... I know someone looking for a job.

 

[Wizard of Ozz]

So you pick a side randomly and argue with people on the internet?

I honestly think he is like 16... and English is not even his native language. Also as some others mentioned he should already be booted for his political posts in the OT section. Sounds like he is not a fan of USA either.