Perspective on Mods, Costs, Jose, and Cameron (long post)

  • Thread starter Thread starter scottosan
  • Start date Start date
scottosan said:
At 12 per year @$4k is only 48k and 40% of that would be in parts. You’d qualify for food stamps and have no benefits or retirement. Not worth it. Steve Henning would be one to ask input from. He could probably weigh in since it’s not his main gig. Add in emails, tire kickers, people bitching on forums about turnaround times. It’s no longer fun.
Click to expand...
I never said 12 amps a year was full time work. If someone was doing this full time one amp a week wouldn’t even count as full time work. 12 a year is one a month (obviously), thats total part time territory. This isn’t a business model, it’s maybe a side business model.
 
paulyc said:
I never said 12 amps a year was full time work. If someone was doing this full time one amp a week wouldn’t even count as full time work. 12 a year is one a month (obviously), thats total part time territory. This isn’t a business model, it’s maybe a side business model.
Click to expand...
So here is another example. Equ1nox on this forum and SloClone forum has reverse engineered more amps by far than anyone on that forum. He’s probably reverse for Cameron’s than anyone on this forum. He took the next steps and is making amp. I know for certain this he has a full PCB version of the CCV based on having owned Brad’s #1 prototype. He has tried to sell the amp a few time for roughly $2500 if I recall and hasn’t sold it from what I understand. Regardless how close it may be people will not pay Cameron money nor will anyone acknowledge that the circuits can be reproduced. But, in the same breath we acknowledge it’s not voodoo. So what gives. My $4k example was not realistic and unless you are a big name and have Ola do his detuned 2 string flogging circus of your amp you will struggle to sell at any worthwhile price point unless you are a big name. Then at that point you’ve likely for your own thing going.
 
How much are the brad era CCV's going for these days? I never see one for sale, people must like the tone:dunno:

"nor will anyone acknowledge that the circuits can be reproduced" I acknowledge the circuit of any amp can be reproduced.. whether or not it sounds exactly the same is the point, not mere reproduction.

If an amp couldnt be reproduced then why goop it?
 
Last edited:
scottosan said:
So here is another example. Equ1nox on this forum and SloClone forum has reverse engineered more amps by far than anyone on that forum. He’s probably reverse for Cameron’s than anyone on this forum. He took the next steps and is making amp. I know for certain this he has a full PCB version of the CCV based on having owned Brad’s #1 prototype. He has tried to sell the amp a few time for roughly $2500 if I recall and hasn’t sold it from what I understand. Regardless how close it may be people will not pay Cameron money nor will anyone acknowledge that the circuits can be reproduced. But, in the same breath we acknowledge it’s not voodoo. So what gives. My $4k example was not realistic and unless you are a big name and have Ola do his detuned 2 string flogging circus of your amp you will struggle to sell at any worthwhile price point unless you are a big name. Then at that point you’ve likely for your own thing going.
Click to expand...

Name/brand recognition is a massive factor. You could build an incredibly great product, but without the cred it'll be a hard sell, and worth a lot less.
 
scottosan said:
So here is another example. Equ1nox on this forum and SloClone forum has reverse engineered more amps by far than anyone on that forum. He’s probably reverse for Cameron’s than anyone on this forum. He took the next steps and is making amp. I know for certain this he has a full PCB version of the CCV based on having owned Brad’s #1 prototype. He has tried to sell the amp a few time for roughly $2500 if I recall and hasn’t sold it from what I understand. Regardless how close it may be people will not pay Cameron money nor will anyone acknowledge that the circuits can be reproduced. But, in the same breath we acknowledge it’s not voodoo. So what gives. My $4k example was not realistic and unless you are a big name and have Ola do his detuned 2 string flogging circus of your amp you will struggle to sell at any worthwhile price point unless you are a big name. Then at that point you’ve likely for your own thing going.
Click to expand...
I'm pretty sure dawnofdreams has the schematics from reversed amps as well...
 
scottosan said:
I can’t explain enough to people that the CCV is really just a Jose with more refined filtering ,lots of features/switches and a clean channel. Not something that is easily done even with a PCB and once on the PCB, much harder to tweak. You have Friedman that releases a bunch of amps that are basically the same circuit with a few tweaks and can get people to buy multiple and then you have have the the CCV that puts a lot of similar options into a single package so you don’t have to buy 3 similar amps. It’s really a versatile circuit. The later BE/Deluxe took some of those ideas.
Click to expand...
Your single channel CCV "clone", does it have the high/low power modes ?
 
I kind of wish Friedman would do another run of the Brad era Cameron Atomica's. They sound fantastic. Obviously good and consistent enough to please picky ears and I have picky ears. Then again, it could just be the guys playing them on the demos..
 
mooncobra said:
FourT6and2 knows how to build a killer amp!! I have been to his place and played a couple and they were AMAZING!!! I would say as good as any builder out there, no kidding. He is the real deal.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the kind words dude! It was fun having you stop by and glad I could help fix your amp.
 
scottosan said:
My full CCV clone had both power modes. The voodoo is stock at 515-520v
Click to expand...
Since the CCV comes from a Bogner XTC schematic PCB, i think its price should be in that range to get some profit.
I can't say "if Bogner can work/live with this margin, Cameron should too" because business are business, but I would start at this price point.
 
It’s too bad Bogner doesn’t mod Marshall’s anymore. He could charge 2K to mod an 800 to the Snorkler tone and guys would pay it.
 
turtlefingers said:
Since the CCV comes from a Bogner XTC schematic PCB, i think its price should be in that range to get some profit.
I can't say "if Bogner can work/live with this margin, Cameron should too" because business are business, but I would start at this price point.
Click to expand...
The topology of the XTC are not the same and have significant difference although I would think it’s probably to closest from a complexity standpoint with the XTC being the more complex of the 2. I think the Friedman line is overpriced compared to Bogner
 
scottosan said:
The topology of the XTC are not the same and have significant difference although I would think it’s probably to closest from a complexity standpoint with the XTC being the more complex of the 2. I think the Friedman line is overpriced compared to Bogner
Click to expand...
So a US$3.800-4.000 would be a standpoint price with a reasonable profit, wouldn't?
 
turtlefingers said:
So a US$3.800-4.000 would be a standpoint price with a reasonable profit, wouldn't?
Click to expand...
depends if you’re selling direct or through a retailer. If would take significant time to build up your business and develop cost cutting measures. A lot of upfront money to get enough discounts and right now isn’t a good time due to supply chain issues. California is actually prime for sourcing the woodwork and fabrication stuff. Not so much outside of Cali.

Also for the Bogner brand, Reinhold is not the brains behind the business side. He owes that to Jorge. Bogner is the mad scientist but Jorge is the business side. Same goes for Friedman. BAD takes a lot of that burden off Dave.
 
North Carolina seems to have a small woodworking/ electronics hub for amp makers developing in recent years
 
scottosan said:
So here is another example. Equ1nox on this forum and SloClone forum has reverse engineered more amps by far than anyone on that forum. He’s probably reverse for Cameron’s than anyone on this forum. He took the next steps and is making amp. I know for certain this he has a full PCB version of the CCV based on having owned Brad’s #1 prototype. He has tried to sell the amp a few time for roughly $2500 if I recall and hasn’t sold it from what I understand. Regardless how close it may be people will not pay Cameron money nor will anyone acknowledge that the circuits can be reproduced. But, in the same breath we acknowledge it’s not voodoo. So what gives. My $4k example was not realistic and unless you are a big name and have Ola do his detuned 2 string flogging circus of your amp you will struggle to sell at any worthwhile price point unless you are a big name. Then at that point you’ve likely for your own thing going.
Click to expand...
Is that Rozsa Amplification ?
 
You guys think these mods are expensive? Try getting a Bob Savage Air Mod done to one of your amps and report back!
 
Just curious but why wouldn't Equ1nox list that CCV clone here? I don't look for CCVs or clones but I think I would remember it. If it was listed...it would not go unnoticed on this forum. Just seems curious that he couldn't sell it but I never saw it here.

I did buy a Ceriatone King Kong that had been thru his hands. But the owner between us was a tinkerer too so I have no idea who installed a 33ohm (not 33k ohm) slope resistor on the lead channel stack. :doh: No wonder the treble control didn't work. Easy find and fix tho.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top