Deraps playing the Marshall 20 watters

  • Thread starter Thread starter Kapo_Polenton
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My Silver Jubillee Mini kicks ass and does low volume pretty good and gets loud. I used it at practice a few weeks ago and had both volumes at 7 and did fine with a loud drummer and bass player.

My EVH 5150-III 6L6 Stealth 50 Watt at 9 o'clock, Marshall Silver Jubillee at 2 o'clock, and Orange Super Crush 100 at 11 o'clock, all are in the same ballpark volume wise and feel. Granted there is a bit of difference but it isn't a huge one. I could gig with any of those and would be perfectly happy.

I'll have the Soldano Mini SLO head soon and really looking forward to hearing that alongside my other amps and seeing how it does.
 
Briman24 said:
I have owned lots of 100 watters and 50 watters........ this thing is pretty close to as loud as the 1987x. I forget how many db difference there is but I think it was 4db.
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A 20W amp should be only - 7dB quieter than a 100W amp

Of course, "100W" Marshalls are never actually 100W, so let's not forget that 😂

Honestly this is why I don't care for them. They're around 3-4 dB quieter than a 1987X without the coolness factor or the punch.

If they're already that loud, then why the heck wouldn't I just get the bigger amp with the bigger iron, especially when they have the same tubes?
 
Are any of the people saying “it doesn’t punch you in the chest” playing ‘chest punchers’ anywhere but at home and / or by themselves??
 
I love that they are way easier to carry around to gigs etc. I had my jcm 800 2203 in wet dry wet setup and replaced it with the sv20h. There is a 4/12 cab in middle and two 2/12's on left and right. There is no difference in punch or thump imo. The only difference is the plexi snarl. I am so happy with it, I sold the 800 for alot more money than i paid for the sv20h.
 
Briman24 said:
I love that they are way easier to carry around to gigs etc. I had my jcm 800 2203 in wet dry wet setup and replaced it with the sv20h. There is a 4/12 cab in middle and two 2/12's on left and right. There is no difference in punch or thump imo. The only difference is the plexi snarl. I am so happy with it, I sold the 800 for alot more money than i paid for the sv20h.
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I just ran all my amps yesterday to keep the filter caps healthy and had my 72 50 watt on a 4x12 and my 68 Metro plexi on another 4x12 into a Rivera Rockcrusher variaced down to 85 volts and the 100 watter and 100 punched way more and was bigger sounding no matter how loud I turned up the 50 watter, yes the 50 watter could get just as loud it just doesn't punch the same amount. My main experiment was that I usually run with my 68 plexi with two tubes pulled and the impedance halved and even with two tubes pulled it still punches and sounds/feels bigger than my 50 watter every single time.

Victor at Mojave amps used to use 100 watt output transformers in his 50 watt Scorpion so they would punch on par with the 100 watt Peacmaker.

https://legendarytones.com/mojave-ampworks-scorpion/

Design and Construction


Mojave Scorpion (Cover Removed)The Scorpion has components mounted on a turret board, wired up very cleanly in an all point-to-point fashion. To many amp and tone purists, this style of build is the best method to use even though it is much more labor and time-intensive. It’s how most tube amplifiers were built in the ’50s and ’60s and is virtually non-existent today as far as mass-production name brands are concerned.


The transformers and choke are custom-specified and built Mercury Magnetics units. The output transformer in particular is of interest. It’s a larger unit that would be seen more often in 100 watt models. Victor Mason states that there was more to this integration than simply taking a 100 watt specified output transformer and using it for the Scorpion’s 50 watt design.


All technical challenges aside, the Scorpion chassis is housed in an attractive birch-ply cabinet lined with silver piping and steel cross-patterned vents for the front and back. A nice final cosmetic touch is the fact that the panels themselves on the chassis are laser engraved rather than being silk-screened.


Your W/D/W setup sounds great, are you running the SV20 attenuated or full volume? What power amp are you using to drive the 2x12 Cabinets?

I do think these little Marshalls sound great and if you are happy with the SV20 that's all that counts but my experiences have led me to conclude that the 100 watter will always sound bigger and punch harder than a 20 watt amp even if the DB volumes are exactly the same.
 
Thanks for info. Yeah i am using a super old bgw amplifier for the wet cabs. The thing is built like a tank. It is like 30 lbs. My sv is not fully cranked but close. The right volume is at 2 oclock and left at 12. I attenuate it with a weber mini mass. When the wife is home i have it at a little louder than bedroom volume and when she's not...... i crank it as if there is a drummer beside it. ( so fun)

Yeah you're making me wish i hung onto the 800 a little longer to do a accurate comparison between them but honestly when i pulled out the 800 and plugged in the sv20h, i didn't notice much difference. The only thing that stood out to me right away was the sv20h sounded more plexish in tone. I find it does ac dc tones a little bit better and clean tones. But the differences are not huge. For what i do, I am very happy. I have always aimed for evh's plexi brown sound.

My 800 was an old one. It was a 1981. The guy i got it from owned a studio and said he loaned it to Billy Duffy to play a show in town when his amp died in rehearsal. The guy could be lying but he seemed like a legit guy and trustworthy. Everything thing else he told me about the amp and cab was accurate.
 
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I'm waiting for the used market to catch up the new pricing in the USA. People still seem to be asking $1,200 for used sv20 and sc20 heads. I would buy one at around $800 which is around where they should be.
 
Leroymyman said:
I'm waiting for the used market to catch up the new pricing in the USA. People still seem to be asking $1,200 for used sv20 and sc20 heads. I would buy one at around $800 which is around where they should be.
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Yes i agree
 
This video demo is the one that convinced me to buy the sv20. I have pretty much dialed in like he has but with wet dry wet setup which makes it sound bigger.



 
Briman24 said:
Thanks for info. Yeah i am using a super old bgw amplifier for the wet cabs. The thing is built like a tank. It is like 30 lbs. My sv is not fully cranked but close. The right volume is at 2 oclock and left at 12. I attenuate it with a weber mini mass. When the wife is home i have it at a little louder than bedroom volume and when she's not...... i crank it as if there is a drummer beside it. ( so fun)

Yeah you're making me wish i hung onto the 800 a little longer to do a accurate comparison between them but honestly when i pulled out the 800 and plugged in the sv20h, i didn't notice much difference. The only thing that stood out to me right away was the sv20h sounded more plexish in tone. I find it does ac dc tones a little bit better and clean tones. But the differences are not huge. For what i do, I am very happy. I have always aimed for evh's plexi brown sound.

My 800 was an old one. It was a 1981. The guy i got it from owned a studio and said he loaned it to Billy Duffy to play a show in town when his amp died in rehearsal. The guy could be lying but he seemed like a legit guy and trustworthy. Everything thing else he told me about the amp and cab was accurate.
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I thought the SV20 was the Plexi and SC20 was more like the 800. Is that right?
 
Briman24 said:
Thanks for info. Yeah i am using a super old bgw amplifier for the wet cabs. The thing is built like a tank. It is like 30 lbs. My sv is not fully cranked but close. The right volume is at 2 oclock and left at 12. I attenuate it with a weber mini mass. When the wife is home i have it at a little louder than bedroom volume and when she's not...... i crank it as if there is a drummer beside it. ( so fun)

Yeah you're making me wish i hung onto the 800 a little longer to do a accurate comparison between them but honestly when i pulled out the 800 and plugged in the sv20h, i didn't notice much difference. The only thing that stood out to me right away was the sv20h sounded more plexish in tone. I find it does ac dc tones a little bit better and clean tones. But the differences are not huge. For what i do, I am very happy. I have always aimed for evh's plexi brown sound.

My 800 was an old one. It was a 1981. The guy i got it from owned a studio and said he loaned it to Billy Duffy to play a show in town when his amp died in rehearsal. The guy could be lying but he seemed like a legit guy and trustworthy. Everything thing else he told me about the amp and cab was accurate.
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My first foray into W/D/W ran a Mosvalve 962 for my W/D/W wet cabs it was alright and then I had a Peavey 50/50 Classic for years(I still have that power amp) it sounds great but I still wanted to try an H&H V800 mosfet amp but I didn't want to pony up the coin then I bought a Matrix GT1000FX for a few years it's pretty good but I still felt it could hit harder and lately still wanting to try big power and big transformers like the H&H to get big power and punch. Which led me to the Peavey CS800X and I couldn't be happier with it as it's on par with the V800 power ratings and they are built like tanks and they have 1/4" input and output jacks making connections easy. They pop up for cheap all the time, I got mine for $200 bucks and worth checking out IMHO for W/D/W.

I totally agree.... the SV20 sound like a great plexi all the clips sound great and I think the El34's were the great way to go tubewise. I would imagine they are running the power tubes somewhere in the DCV range of 300 DCV's which will brown the entier amp out already much in the same way Mike Soldano designed his HR25 amp.
 
Briman24 said:
Thanks for info. Yeah i am using a super old bgw amplifier for the wet cabs. The thing is built like a tank. It is like 30 lbs. My sv is not fully cranked but close. The right volume is at 2 oclock and left at 12. I attenuate it with a weber mini mass. When the wife is home i have it at a little louder than bedroom volume and when she's not...... i crank it as if there is a drummer beside it. ( so fun)

Yeah you're making me wish i hung onto the 800 a little longer to do a accurate comparison between them but honestly when i pulled out the 800 and plugged in the sv20h, i didn't notice much difference. The only thing that stood out to me right away was the sv20h sounded more plexish in tone. I find it does ac dc tones a little bit better and clean tones. But the differences are not huge. For what i do, I am very happy. I have always aimed for evh's plexi brown sound.

My 800 was an old one. It was a 1981. The guy i got it from owned a studio and said he loaned it to Billy Duffy to play a show in town when his amp died in rehearsal. The guy could be lying but he seemed like a legit guy and trustworthy. Everything thing else he told me about the amp and cab was accurate.
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There is nothing wrong at all with the tone that the 20 watt SV/SC Marshalls are putting out and if it performs to your liking in your setup that's awesome when you are happy with your rig. I just hear/feel a difference in how my 50 watt punches versus my 100 watt amps and there is some technical reasons as to why. I'm sure the 20 watters move a good amount of air in their own right. I just hear/feel a difference and I somewhat have a preference for my 100 watters for the full on punch factor as others do.

Another plus with the 20 watt Marshall and the lower B+ they must be running the power tubes at to get the lower wattage you will get prolonged tube life even cranking then up, about the same effects as variacing a 100 watt plexi down to 70-90 volts which roughly lowers the B+ to 300-400DCV as denoted in the Jim Gaustad videos.:2thumbsup:
 
harddriver said:
There is nothing wrong at all with the tone that the 20 watt SV/SC Marshalls are putting out and if it performs to your liking in your setup that's awesome when you are happy with your rig. I just hear/feel a difference in how my 50 watt punches versus my 100 watt amps and there is some technical reasons as to why. I'm sure the 20 watters move a good amount of air in their own right. I just hear/feel a difference and I somewhat have a preference for my 100 watters for the full on punch factor as others do.

Another plus with the 20 watt Marshall and the lower B+ they must be running the power tubes at to get the lower wattage you will get prolonged tube life even cranking then up, about the same effects as variacing a 100 watt plexi down to 70-90 volts which roughly lowers the B+ to 300-400DCV as denoted in the Jim Gaustad videos.:2thumbsup:
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Glad to hear about possible longer tube life! I don't know much about amps besides doing my own biasing when installing new tubes and making sure that i run amps every few months if not in use. Besides that, I ask questions here or take it to my tech!
 
Leroymyman said:
I'm waiting for the used market to catch up the new pricing in the USA. People still seem to be asking $1,200 for used sv20 and sc20 heads. I would buy one at around $800 which is around where they should be.
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Yes, I am seeing prices at 1425 CAD and I too would expect these to come down to around 1000-1100 CAD. Good on Marshall for making an affordable version of their flagship. I think it was quite a good business move given the clones creeping into that price point.
 
Kapo_Polenton said:
Yes, I am seeing prices at 1425 CAD and I too would expect these to come down to around 1000-1100 CAD. Good on Marshall for making an affordable version of their flagship. I think it was quite a good business move given the clones creeping into that price point.
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I was expecting reality to hit much sooner, but it will at some point.
 
BlueParfait said:
A 20W amp should be only - 7dB quieter than a 100W amp
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A 3dB increase results in a doubling of perceived volume so doing the math a 100 watt is over 3x as loud as a 20 watt.

* velcro-fly * said:
Are any of the people saying “it doesn’t punch you in the chest” playing ‘chest punchers’ anywhere but at home and / or by themselves??
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I have an outdoor gig on saturday that I pretty much crank a Twin at every month.
 
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