Sell your mark IIC+: the black album was a mark 3.

  • Thread starter Thread starter VESmedic
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Ya know, now that Gibson owns Mesa and they love to be greedy, maybe they will be smart enough to capitalize on the IIC+ craze, hit up Het 'n Hammet for licensing and create a signature crunch berries IIC++ People would eat that shit right up and they would make a fortune. You can't count Gibson out of this. Its quite possible.

And don't talk to me about the excuses Mesa has made on not reissuing the amp in regards to original components for accuracy. It sure didn't stop them from adding the IIC+ setting on the MKV or better yet making the JP2C as a whole.
 
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Marykelly said:
Mesa was playing fast and loose with cosmetic features and faceplates in those transitional eras so you cant really look at a grainy picture of an amp and say definitively what the amp in the picture is. That could be a IIC+ or it could easily be a medium chassis III using a leftover faceplate just to get the amp out to a big name client before they had the updated cosmetic stuff.
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Well, this is the same amp and it literally says MK II C++ on it.
EC062A50-FE12-409A-A3D2-F30FAC2AEB69.png
 
This thread brings the LOL’s for sure.
Anything Metallica/ C+ related is just hilarious if you go against the fans.
There is room for all to speak their mind……
 
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PurityS.L.G said:
Ya know, now that Gibson owns Mesa and they love to be greedy, maybe they will be smart enough to capitalize on the IIC+ craze, hit up Het 'n Hammet for licensing and create a signature crunch berries IIC++ People would eat that shit right up and they would make a fortune. You can't count Gibson out of this. Its quite possible.

And don't talk to me about the excuses Mesa has made on not reissuing the amp in regards to original components for accuracy. It sure didn't stop them from adding the IIC+ setting on the MKV or better yet making the JP2C as a whole.
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Yea! They could sell it for 9000 dollars, and all the fanboys will think it’s a steal! People will make iPhone clips of it in the room, say it doesn’t sound like a ++++++++ and then fights will break out among elitist fanboys. They will both make in the room iPhone clips demoing their 2C+++++++’s vs the reissues, and more fights will break out between the two groups arguing about an amp that no one has ever actually used to make a record ever. It’ll be a beautiful thing, I need this to happen.
 
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VESmedic said:
Yea! They could sell it for 9000 dollars, and all the fanboys will think it’s a steal! People will make iPhone clips of it in the room, say it doesn’t sound like a ++++++++ and then fights will break out among elitist fanboys. They will both make in the room iPhone clips demoing their 2C+++++++’s vs the reissues, and more fights will break out between the two groups arguing about an amp that no one has ever actually used to make a record ever. It’ll be a beautiful thing, I need this to happen.
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Well, I'm making a record with one now. Does that count? Probably not since I'm not famous or cool. Or modern.

What about that guy Petrucci? I think he's made a few records with them. I get it why Marks aren't more popular with modern metal though, there are better tools for the job of djent.

You should read a book called Fierce Conversations. I believe you're standing on a different color stripe of the beach ball than most guys.
 
GJgo said:
Well, I'm making a record with one now. Does that count? Probably not since I'm not famous or cool. Or modern.

What about that guy Petrucci? I think he's made a few records with them. I get it why Marks aren't more popular with modern metal though, there are better tools for the job of djent.

You should read a book called Fierce Conversations. I believe you're standing on a different color stripe of the beach ball than most guys.
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Yes, congratulations, you found literally the one guy who actually used one, and solely it to record an album.

I never said anything about djent, couldn’t care less about it. But I guess you could throw that in there as well. YOU may get why they aren’t more popular for heavy rhythm tones, but the rest of the fanboys are in denial…


As far as beach balls and going against the grain: I’m not at all, I hate to break it to you. Hence my point about literally no one in modern metal using then. So who is really going against the grain here? The guys and bands who make records and don’t use it and never have, or the internet fanboys trying to convince us they do and ARE fantastic, and have tried to do this online for the last 20 years? I know my answer to that one…



I also ONCE AGAIN would like to reiterate I’m not anti Mesa mark series amps at all, even though there are lots of things I like more than them. I’m just living in reality here, while the rest of the internet tries to blow these things up to god like levels of tone: a tone supposively so great, it’s never been on a record by itself. It always needs help.
 
VESmedic said:
Yes, congratulations, you found literally the one guy who actually used one, and solely it to record an album.

I never said anything about djent, couldn’t care less about it. But I guess you could throw that in there as well. YOU may get why they aren’t more popular for heavy rhythm tones, but the rest of the fanboys are in denial…


As far as beach balls and going against the grain: I’m not at all, I hate to break it to you. Hence my point about literally no one in modern metal using then. So who is really going against the grain here? The guys and bands who make records and don’t use it and never have, or the internet fanboys trying to convince us they do and ARE fantastic, and have tried to do this online for the last 20 years? I know my answer to that one…



I also ONCE AGAIN would like to reiterate I’m not anti Mesa mark series amps at all, even though there are lots of things I like more than them. I’m just living in reality here, while the rest of the internet tries to blow these things up to god like levels of tone: a tone supposively so great, it’s never been on a record by itself. It always needs help.
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All the earlier Nightranger albums were 2C and C+. All by their lonesome.
Plus Mob Rules by BS? 2Bs. From what I’ve read anyway.
Marshalls are my fav tone; but Mesa Marks have been used exclusively to record a few records. Purple Rain by Prince is another.
Just sayin.
 
It's not about going against the grain, it's about coming to terms with the fact that different people see the world from different perspectives, and no one person holds the answer. The beach ball is many different colors, even though each person standing on a stripe only sees the color beneath their feet.

There's a thing I learned a long time ago about hobbies. For any given hobby, different people take pleasure in different aspects of the hobby. Take guitars for example, but it's the same for any hobby. Some people like playing solo. Some people like gigging. Some people like writing. Some people like recording. Some people like collecting. Some people like the nostalgia. Some people like obsessing over minutiae. The list goes on.

Clearly you love recording & have a lot of experience doing it, and, that's only one color of the beach ball. Coming forcefully into a conversation while applying value judgments to others who are standing on a different stripe, based on your stripe's perspective, is wholly unproductive. What's more productive is first seeking to understand the other perspectives, and then attempt to describe your reality without assigning blame or judgment.

There's no question about the market value of the IIC+. I believe it's a fair point that this value isn't driven by current recording artists- yet, the value is there, therefore it must be validated by those with other perspectives. I suspect the biggest variable is nostalgia.
 
GJgo said:
It's not about going against the grain, it's about coming to terms with the fact that different people see the world from different perspectives, and no one person holds the answer. The beach ball is many different colors, even though each person standing on a stripe only sees the color beneath their feet.

There's a thing I learned a long time ago about hobbies. For any given hobby, different people take pleasure in different aspects of the hobby. Take guitars for example, but it's the same for any hobby. Some people like playing solo. Some people like gigging. Some people like writing. Some people like recording. Some people like collecting. Some people like the nostalgia. Some people like obsessing over minutiae. The list goes on.

Clearly you love recording & have a lot of experience doing it, and, that's only one color of the beach ball. Coming forcefully into a conversation while applying value judgments to others who are standing on a different stripe, based on your stripe's perspective, is wholly unproductive. What's more productive is first seeking to understand the other perspectives, and then attempt to describe your reality without assigning blame or judgment.

There's no question about the market value of the IIC+. I believe it's a fair point that this value isn't driven by current recording artists- yet, the value is there, therefore it must be validated by those with other perspectives. I suspect the biggest variable is nostalgia.
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Not being a metal guy, for me it’s the quality of the tone. How good does it sound? Clarity? Feel? The C+ checks all the boxes. It’s a very unique amp, that no other amp can duplicate the sound of. I’d have to personally play another 2B/III to believe either come close to what I hear/feel when I play a C+. There are 2500-3K of them out there in the wild; limited supply and no other amp sounds like it.
Therein lies the value, imo.
 
VES…you seem the most riled up about this. I had a red stripe III that was better for metal than the C+ I had. Very aggressive. The IIC++ is my dream amp. Aggressive and gainy yet tight and musical. Have you played thru one?
 
GJgo said:
It's not about going against the grain, it's about coming to terms with the fact that different people see the world from different perspectives, and no one person holds the answer. The beach ball is many different colors, even though each person standing on a stripe only sees the color beneath their feet.

There's a thing I learned a long time ago about hobbies. For any given hobby, different people take pleasure in different aspects of the hobby. Take guitars for example, but it's the same for any hobby. Some people like playing solo. Some people like gigging. Some people like writing. Some people like recording. Some people like collecting. Some people like the nostalgia. Some people like obsessing over minutiae. The list goes on.

Clearly you love recording & have a lot of experience doing it, and, that's only one color of the beach ball. Coming forcefully into a conversation while applying value judgments to others who are standing on a different stripe, based on your stripe's perspective, is wholly unproductive. What's more productive is first seeking to understand the other perspectives, and then attempt to describe your reality without assigning blame or judgment.

There's no question about the market value of the IIC+. I believe it's a fair point that this value isn't driven by current recording artists- yet, the value is there, therefore it must be validated by those with other perspectives. I suspect the biggest variable is nostalgia.
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Seeing the world from other perspectives? I’m literally the one that started this thread that is from another perspective and a commonly held belief? You forget , this thread was started more as a tongue in cheek type of joke thread, because the fanboys get sideways about threads like this . So let’s start with that.


I have my reasons why I believe more than anything it WAS a 3 though . And it’s not just this interview, I’ll leave it at that because I’m sure people would laugh if I told them why I believe it to be so. I very much understand why people believe it to be a C+, clearly the evidence is there to support this. But again, you speak of perspective and understanding, I think it would be wise to listen to other opinions on this, since clearly the perspective many have had over the years is that it’s a C+.


I also realize that’s not what you meant by perspective, but it’s just a point. I fully agree with you about hobbies and what people enjoy etc. there is 100 percent nothing wrong with any of those reasons for loving this hobby, and there is also 100 percent nothing wrong with loving the sound of the C+. But there is also no question people get seriously butthurt if you challenge them on any of this. Not all the information in the world is on the internet. People still hear and learn things that are not well known, if known at all online. So take that into consideration as well.

I also agree completely nostalgia drives the prices of these things, as do youtubers who have become more of an influence than ever in this hobby as well.
 
Tone Monster said:
VES…you seem the most riled up about this. I had a red stripe III that was better for metal than the C+ I had. Very aggressive. The IIC++ is my dream amp. Aggressive and gainy yet tight and musical. Have you played thru one?
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Im not riled up at all. I didn’t bump this thread, another member did and I helped him on the question he had, and then yet again here we are. There was a troll who mad some comment about 5150s for some reason, and then we are back to this topic. I’m over here laughing at how much people need to defend this thing, that’s really it for me. Also yes for sure that people think bob rock is old and senile as well. I can 100 percent tell you for a fact this isn’t the first or last time he has made these comments as well.


And I agree with you on the 3, I think they sound phenomenal for sure. I think the C+ Is extremely soft on the transients and just plain weak sounding compared to other mark series amps. I do agree it’s the most organic sounding of the bunch though.
 
VESmedic said:
Seeing the world from other perspectives? I’m literally the one that started this thread that is from another perspective and a commonly held belief? You forget , this thread was started more as a tongue in cheek type of joke thread, because the fanboys get sideways about threads like this . So let’s start with that.


I have my reasons why I believe more than anything it WAS a 3 though . And it’s not just this interview, I’ll leave it at that because I’m sure people would laugh if I told them why I believe it to be so. I very much understand why people believe it to be a C+, clearly the evidence is there to support this. But again, you speak of perspective and understanding, I think it would be wise to listen to other opinions on this, since clearly the perspective many have had over the years is that it’s a C+.


I also realize that’s not what you meant by perspective, but it’s just a point. I fully agree with you about hobbies and what people enjoy etc. there is 100 percent nothing wrong with any of those reasons for loving this hobby, and there is also 100 percent nothing wrong with loving the sound of the C+. But there is also no question people get seriously butthurt if you challenge them on any of this. Not all the information in the world is on the internet. People still hear and learn things that are not well known, if known at all online. So take that into consideration as well.

I also agree completely nostalgia drives the prices of these things, as do youtubers who have become more of an influence than ever in this hobby as well.
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FWIW, having owned 7 C+ & 7 or so III, just based on what I've been able to eek out of them it wouldn't take much for me to believe that TBA had a III involved. Closest I've gotten to "that" tone was with a blue stripe DG with EL34s in the Class A slots & V30s and a KH2.

I also agree that the level of butt hurt (in society) is high. I think it's unfortunate. Live & let live.

Also also, personally, there is no world I would choose a III over a IIC+ due to the difference in clarity, even though the III is more aggressive. That said, there is no IIC+ that I would choose over my IIB+ Coli- so while I sip the cool aid I don't drink the whole glass!
 
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