Choosing a Diezel....

teestone

teestone

Active member
Virgin post here on Rig-Talk....

I'm a long time member of TGP...don't throw anything at me please.

Anyway....

For the last 15 years I've rocked a Rivera S-120 combo as stereo pedal platform. I briefly went down the Fractal rabbit hole but emerged without harm. I recently got tapped to back up a buddy in his hard rock/metal cover band. I tried a Sherlock V3 in front of the Rivera but it just doesn't hold up. It's time to get a half stack! I've since looked into a bunch of different options....Mesa, Bogner, Fryette/VHT, KSR...a few others. Not that those aren't great amps....but I kinda want to go with a Diezel. I've lusted for one for many years but never had the reason to pursue one.

There seems to be a large group of people over here that use Diezel amps. I've been lurking around and trying to educate myself on Diezel amps. There's lots of choices.

I'm looking hard at the Herbert currently. The D-Moll also is intriguing as it's touted as Herbie's little brother. I think the VH4 is more than I need and takes bit more volume to really shine. Most, if not all Diezel's have a great Master Volume from what I've read. This will help keep reasonable volume during practice. Even the Paul looks interesting as the 50W platform has it's benefits. I'm not really familiar with some of the older models...Schmidt, Einstein. Hagen is another I'm not familiar with.

I'd love to say price isn't an issue but it is. Looks like a mk1 or maybe mk2 Herbert can be had for sub $2k. Same with the D-Moll, Paul, Schmidt and Einstein. A mk3 Herbert is up closer to $4k.

So a rear loaded 4x12 and a head for sub $3k is a pretty handsome option.

What should I know about the various iterations of the Herbert?

Should I be considering the Schmidt or Einstein? D-Moll or Paul?

Cleans are important. Crunch and lead a little more important. MIDI switching isn't required. Solid effects loop for time based effects and modulation is important. Usable volume from practice space to stage use is important.

Diezel experts....what say you?
 
teestone":1h2fy91z said:
Virgin post here on Rig-Talk....

I'm a long time member of TGP...don't throw anything at me please.

Anyway....

For the last 15 years I've rocked a Rivera S-120 combo as stereo pedal platform. I briefly went down the Fractal rabbit hole but emerged without harm. I recently got tapped to back up a buddy in his hard rock/metal cover band. I tried a Sherlock V3 in front of the Rivera but it just doesn't hold up. It's time to get a half stack! I've since looked into a bunch of different options....Mesa, Bogner, Fryette/VHT, KSR...a few others. Not that those aren't great amps....but I kinda want to go with a Diezel. I've lusted for one for many years but never had the reason to pursue one.

There seems to be a large group of people over here that use Diezel amps. I've been lurking around and trying to educate myself on Diezel amps. There's lots of choices.

I'm looking hard at the Herbert currently. The D-Moll also is intriguing as it's touted as Herbie's little brother. I think the VH4 is more than I need and takes bit more volume to really shine. Most, if not all Diezel's have a great Master Volume from what I've read. This will help keep reasonable volume during practice. Even the Paul looks interesting as the 50W platform has it's benefits. I'm not really familiar with some of the older models...Schmidt, Einstein. Hagen is another I'm not familiar with.

I'd love to say price isn't an issue but it is. Looks like a mk1 or maybe mk2 Herbert can be had for sub $2k. Same with the D-Moll, Paul, Schmidt and Einstein. A mk3 Herbert is up closer to $4k.

So a rear loaded 4x12 and a head for sub $3k is a pretty handsome option.

What should I know about the various iterations of the Herbert?

Should I be considering the Schmidt or Einstein? D-Moll or Paul?

Cleans are important. Crunch and lead a little more important. MIDI switching isn't required. Solid effects loop for time based effects and modulation is important. Usable volume from practice space to stage use is important.

Diezel experts....what say you?
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Hey man! I'm no expert on these amps, but I've got an Einstein and it is amazing. I'm not a fan of the Crunch channel on it as it's not my style. The clean channel and Mega channel are very very nice. It also has an effects loop which I haven't used, but it has it's own volume knob.
 
any of the revisions of herbert will be fine.
I have Mk1, with external bias, very happy with it.
loops on Herberts works great.

regarding VH4 vs Herbert I made detailed comparison couple weeks ago. https://youtu.be/CMS5iIanq5k
didn't play Hagen yet, seems to be more updated and differently voiced VH4 version , but for some reason it looks like a bit underrated amp, everybody talks about VH4. I personally prefer herbert over VH4.
 
Keeping price in mind, and complete and utter versatility for that price?

The D-Moll.

And this is coming from a Hagen fanboi, a longtime VH4 lover, and user of all but the Paul/Lil'Fokker amps in the Diezel lineage. I am not a mega fan of the Herbert (plus, c'mon, you need 6 tubes?!?!?), just never gelled with it, but that's not to say the Mk.3 won't change my mind - haven't tried one yet. But the V and Herbert and Hagen are hefty priced heads. Check out the D-Moll. There's a lot of chatter out there about love/hate on this amp. As mentioned, I've been a long time Diezel owner and fanboi; the D-Moll offers a ridiculous amount of tone, power, versatility and controllability in one compact but very heavy head (52lbs??). I can conjure some VH4 out of it, I can definitely conjure the notorious "midcut" Herbert metal from it, it's got a kickass shimmering clean on it....it's solid man. Does a little bit of everything, but if I had to summarize, it's 40% Herbert, with the other 60% being Hagen, VH4, Einstein, and some of its own UNIQUE pixie dust added for good measure. It's a righteously wicked amp.

Good luck. Oh, and the D-Moll plays well with many cabs and cones - just FYI. Takes some time to get used to its EQ, but 2 MVs, MIDI controllable, 2.5 Channels which is really 3 channels given the flexibility of the amp, multiplied by the midcut now equals 6 channels, then your parallel and series loops, shit man.......if I'd never known about Diezel, and wanted to dip my foot into their camp, and money was a consideration, the D-Moll is by far my recommendation. And this IS COMING from a devout Hagen fanboi and VH4 comrade!! And the tubes are biased in pairs so one could mix and match 2x2 similar to that of the Herbert (don't quote me on that, just a hunch).

The D-Moll has its own thing going on, but can also cop a damn good rendition of the other flagship amps in the lineup. It's a killer amp :salute:

Unkle Mo
 
DMoll owner here. It is awesome. Slap a clean OD 808 or Grind in front with mid cut and it is monstrously modern. go to ch2 with no mid cut and boosted mids and it is mega Marshally magic.

and if you stumble onto a Kruse modded Diezel, snatch it up. Kruse mods offer dials that bring it back to stock so it's really just more tonal choices that are all fun. They often get sold at great discount because mods just don't hold resale value.

Good Luck!
 
Thanks for the insight guys!

D-Moll might just be the ticket....

How is the master? I'd prefer to avoid buying an attenuator for using at home and practice. The 100W power sections is certainly hefty.

And on the other hand....would the Paul be considered a more versatile amp than the D-Moll? I've watched a couple videos of the Paul sounding pretty heavy. The low to mid gain stuff sounds very impressive too.

As it appears the D-Moll and Paul are similar in platform, does one cover more ground than the other? The Paul with its 50W might be easier to control volume wise than the D-Moll with its 100W.

But there's usually a trade off...better high gain versus better cleans/low gain.

I have no problem adding pedal(s) to the front end. I have plenty of options...Precision Drive, PTD Copper Penny, PTD Rotobone, Proanalog Dirt Royale w/Cheese are all killer in front of an amp.

Definitely plan to go with a 4x12 for whichever head gets the call. That might be the subject of whole different thread though.
 
teestone":jblv3j9n said:
Thanks for the insight guys!

D-Moll might just be the ticket....

How is the master? I'd prefer to avoid buying an attenuator for using at home and practice. The 100W power sections is certainly hefty.

And on the other hand....would the Paul be considered a more versatile amp than the D-Moll? I've watched a couple videos of the Paul sounding pretty heavy. The low to mid gain stuff sounds very impressive too.

As it appears the D-Moll and Paul are similar in platform, does one cover more ground than the other? The Paul with its 50W might be easier to control volume wise than the D-Moll with its 100W.

But there's usually a trade off...better high gain versus better cleans/low gain.

I have no problem adding pedal(s) to the front end. I have plenty of options...Precision Drive, PTD Copper Penny, PTD Rotobone, Proanalog Dirt Royale w/Cheese are all killer in front of an amp.

Definitely plan to go with a 4x12 for whichever head gets the call. That might be the subject of whole different thread though.
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The D-Moll is extremely versatile and will do crunch, clean and vintage in spades. Where it'll outshine the Paul is in the trademark 3D rubbery "VH4 Ch.3'esque" capabilities. Yes, you can get there - very very close. And yes, the Herbert, you can get there - very very close. The 100W provides amazing headroom, the cleans on this thing are fucking outrageous. And the sheer flexibility of the amp to be so versatile?? Clean to mean, vintage to modern, rock to metal, it's a glorious beast.

And JUST to let you know. My first impressions when setting this amp up were, um, well... Let's just say I wasn't blown away. But what happened was some time with the EQ, also choosing the right guitars/pups, and next thing I know, it was HERE WE GO!!!! :rock: :rock: :rock: :rock: :rock: :rock:

The 2 Master Volumes are awesome - sure - it's pretty saturated at low volumes on Ch.2 and 3, fair game, turn back the gain. As the MVs get cranked, it opens up, and the gain can be reapplied. It's got an amazing taper to both MVs so no attenuator is needed IMHO. But when you do let this baby loose, it's just supreme. And I actually dig the mid-cut savage metal'esque tones out of Ch.2 and 3 moreover the Herbert Mk.1

YMMV, but it's a hella lot cheaper than a new Herbert. Or even a used Herbert or VH4 or Hagen. So, my money's on the D-Moll. And now that I've "figured out how it likes to play" with specific guitars and how sensitive it is to subtle EQ changes, it's by far a trophy tone machine.

Peace
Unkle Mo

PS: And Ch.1 can get some fur on it too to get you that nice sweet broken up clean feel vibe going... Have I convinced you yet?? :lol: :LOL:
 
Almost 4 years later and here I am....No Diezel. Actually ended up with a Friedman BE-50DLX for this gig. Worked great for this particular gig.

Now I'm struggling again. But this time between a Diezel and a Wizard. Apples and oranges I know.....

GAS never goes away.
 
teestone said:
Almost 4 years later and here I am....No Diezel. Actually ended up with a Friedman BE-50DLX for this gig. Worked great for this particular gig.

Now I'm struggling again. But this time between a Diezel and a Wizard. Apples and oranges I know.....

GAS never goes away.
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almost 5 years later and you've returned 😂

we can't help you unless you help us. but one thing seems evident - if you don't get a Diezel - you will be back here again - somewhere between now and another 5 years from now

Diezels are either "all-in" or "hard-pass" amps. There's no middle ground. Godspeed Young ToneSeeker!!!
 
Ventura said:
almost 5 years later and you've returned 😂

we can't help you unless you help us. but one thing seems evident - if you don't get a Diezel - you will be back here again - somewhere between now and another 5 years from now

Diezels are either "all-in" or "hard-pass" amps. There's no middle ground. Godspeed Young ToneSeeker!!!
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Kinda like ENGL.

They have pretty distinctive characteristics, remarkably unique and signature to their sound.

I personally love the shit out of my ENGL and Diezels, but if someone wrote them off based on opinion, I'd completely understand. They're kinda love em or hate em.

I love em, but the reasons I love em, are understandably the reasons some may hate them (wet gain, saturated, compressed, etc).
 
Ive had my Herbert up for sale 10x the past 12 months, even when someone wanted to pay me a very good price i still ended up canceling the deal.

I recently got a mark V, in enjoying this amp so much!!!!!
So yesterday night i took the time hooking the Herbert up and …….. damn what a beast, the clean was beautifull, with a BB preamp it got me in to the 80s type lead tone. Ch2 was super fun riffing and playing leads. I didnt get the chance to try ch3.

I guess its safe to say its a keeper.

Hopefully this weekend ill be getting a Schmidt, ive been wanting it since it came out. Im using 40% of the Herberts gain capabilitys so i bet the Schmidt is right up my ally.

Although im giving up my jvm combo but with the Mark V channel 2 crunch bring me that close to the JVM i dont mind loosing it.

The thing is, you cant go wrong, after some time you just want something different.

Robert
 
teestone said:
Almost 4 years later and here I am....No Diezel. Actually ended up with a Friedman BE-50DLX for this gig. Worked great for this particular gig.

Now I'm struggling again. But this time between a Diezel and a Wizard. Apples and oranges I know.....

GAS never goes away.
Click to expand...
Tough one. I love both equally

What tone you going for
 
shadow070 said:
Ive had my Herbert up for sale 10x the past 12 months, even when someone wanted to pay me a very good price i still ended up canceling the deal.

I recently got a mark V, in enjoying this amp so much!!!!!
So yesterday night i took the time hooking the Herbert up and …….. damn what a beast, the clean was beautifull, with a BB preamp it got me in to the 80s type lead tone. Ch2 was super fun riffing and playing leads. I didnt get the chance to try ch3.

I guess its safe to say its a keeper.

Hopefully this weekend ill be getting a Schmidt, ive been wanting it since it came out. Im using 40% of the Herberts gain capabilitys so i bet the Schmidt is right up my ally.

Although im giving up my jvm combo but with the Mark V channel 2 crunch bring me that close to the JVM i dont mind loosing it.

The thing is, you cant go wrong, after some time you just want something different.

Robert
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The Schmidt is one of my favourite amps.
I know Peter was really disappointed it didn’t take off , the Paul is really like Schmidt version 2 , without the class A.
Use gold lion KT77’s in it , I’ve tried them all and these are the ones. tubes make an incredible difference in that amp.
 
Thanks for the tip

Is it true i dont have to bias?

I liked the less compressed gain sounds on clips, also being a huge built in reverb fan i know ill enjoy it. Feature wise the schmidt is perfect for me.

Ive got a box with so many tubes, i got them all checked 2 years before.
My marshall has 2 tung sol tubes which are amazing, i might try that to.

I got older, i got more cash to spend, got more gear but…… got less time to play
 
I've owned a VH4, VH2, Paul and VHX and there are great things about all of them. The "growl" from all of them is so unique and fun to hear / play. I actually have a Big Max on order and It should arrive tomorrow. I'm most excited about getting this one, because although I liked all the previous models I've owned I always found the compression to be a bit too much. From my understanding the Big Max is much less compressed and more "raw" sounding. It arrives tomorrow and I cannot wait. The manufacturing quality of these amps in my opinion is the very best in the business with matchless a close second. They are built to last and truly are great machines.
 
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