Anyone compare a JEL100 vs a Wizard MC I or II?

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Currently own a 100w MC1 and w800. I have also owned and played plenty of Friedmans, including the JEL and currently own the SSv2 100...another model touted as being a more punchy/raw/etc Friedman.

My opinion: All the Friedmans, including the JEL, are more similar than different; they are all what I would call very refined, modded Marshall's, with fantastic give/feel and a smoother delivery. For example, my SSV2 is indeed punchier and more aggressive in GENERAL, than a BE100. But overall, they are more similar than different.

My Wizards have much more punch, rawness and overall brightness in comparison. If I want a modern amp with supreme clarity, punch, tightness and an open gain character....I grab my Wizards. Pretty tough to beat. That said, I love my SSV2 as well; it is voiced very well, with no frequencies that "get in your way" so to speak. Combined with a killer bounce/give and it is such a fun an amp to play!
 
Yehuda said:
I find it hard to believe an el34 one would match the headroom or punch of the ones I’ve had but haven’t played one so not sure- I know @braintheory doesn’t like kt88s usually but liked them in my wizard
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It’s got more than enough headroom and punch needed but it has Ricks el34 magic . I only get el34s with Rick because what the razor sharp highs have .
 
VHTStark said:
Currently own a 100w MC1 and w800. I have also owned and played plenty of Friedmans, including the JEL and currently own the SSv2 100...another model touted as being a more punchy/raw/etc Friedman.

My opinion: All the Friedmans, including the JEL, are more similar than different; they are all what I would call very refined, modded Marshall's, with fantastic give/feel and a smoother delivery. For example, my SSV2 is indeed punchier and more aggressive in GENERAL, than a BE100. But overall, they are more similar than different.

My Wizards have much more punch, rawness and overall brightness in comparison. If I want a modern amp with supreme clarity, punch, tightness and an open gain character....I grab my Wizards. Pretty tough to beat. That said, I love my SSV2 as well; it is voiced very well, with no frequencies that "get in your way" so to speak. Combined with a killer bounce/give and it is such a fun an amp to play!
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Very cool, thank you for sharing this! Have you played either the MTL, the MC/MTL Hybrid or the Hell Razor?

How would you characterize those amps vs yours? Also, do you feel the W800 and the MC can do 80s thrash tones in the vein of Metallica/Megadeth? Thanks!!!
 
Nashville Riff Co said:
Very cool, thank you for sharing this! Have you played either the MTL, the MC/MTL Hybrid or the Hell Razor?

How would you characterize those amps vs yours? Also, do you feel the W800 and the MC can do 80s thrash tones in the vein of Metallica/Megadeth? Thanks!!!
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No problem!

The other Wizards I have played are an MCII mk2 and a MTL. No experience with a Hellrazor. Compared to the MC1, MC2 and w800, the MTL has more low and low-mid content and is capable of more gain and saturation.

Oh ya....both can do 80's thrash very very well! The MC has more thump and low end and a bit more overall gain on the 3rd/boost channel. W800 has real deal aggressive and unhinged Marshall upper mids, but less overall gain and low end.

The MCII mk2 is great because it can cop the tone/feel of both my MC1 and w800 pretty well. Matt here @RedB4Black has a great video comparing then.

That said, even with the Hellrazor and other Wizards, I feel no want or need to "trade up". I really love the two I have. My w800 is probably my overall favorite amp, past or present!
 
VHTStark said:
No problem!

The other Wizards I have played are an MCII mk2 and a MTL. No experience with a Hellrazor. Compared to the MC1, MC2 and w800, the MTL has more low and low-mid content and is capable of more gain and saturation.

Oh ya....both can do 80's thrash very very well! The MC has more thump and low end and a bit more overall gain on the 3rd/boost channel. W800 has real deal aggressive and unhinged Marshall upper mids, but less overall gain and low end.

The MCII mk2 is great because it can cop the tone/feel of both my MC1 and w800 pretty well. Matt here @RedB4Black has a great video comparing then.

That said, even with the Hellrazor and other Wizards, I feel no want or need to "trade up". I really love the two I have. My w800 is probably my overall favorite amp, past or present!
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very cool, this is terrific to hear. Between the MCII and the MTL, did you feel the MTL having more gain lost that raw wizard tone that would tear right through a mix?

Aside from the new info about the Hell Razor which I need to delve into more, I'm leaning MCII vs. MTL but perhaps go with the Hybrid or just the MTL for more optionality.

I think key for me is retaining the traditional Wizard ability to cut through a mix. The more I learn about recording, the more I've come to appreciate keeping the gain low and getting a clean signal into the DAW and then adjusting the amps "true character" in post.
 
Yehuda said:
I find it hard to believe an el34 one would match the headroom or punch of the ones I’ve had but haven’t played one so not sure- I know @braintheory doesn’t like kt88s usually but liked them in my wizard
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By nature with both kt88’s and the transformer designed around it I don’t think it would be able to match it in those regards (especially in muscle/efficiency/ease of putting out sound, which is headroom), which is also one of wizards inherent main forte’s vs other amps. I wanna try at some point KT90’s in it. They have a more 34-like character, so can maybe fill out the midrange a bit more
 
Techdeth said:
I still think wizards are best with el34s . Rick and el34s and this unique razor shard highs the others don’t . But all are great of course .
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If anything my KT150 has more aggressive highs than what I could get with the MTL EL34 or MC EL34 I had, but the best of both worlds may possibly be KT90’s in it as those have a more 34-like character than 88’s. I find also 6550’s have excellent highs, which could be killer too if the amp can accept them
 
Nashville Riff Co said:
very cool, this is terrific to hear. Between the MCII and the MTL, did you feel the MTL having more gain lost that raw wizard tone that would tear right through a mix?

Aside from the new info about the Hell Razor which I need to delve into more, I'm leaning MCII vs. MTL but perhaps go with the Hybrid or just the MTL for more optionality.

I think key for me is retaining the traditional Wizard ability to cut through a mix. The more I learn about recording, the more I've come to appreciate keeping the gain low and getting a clean signal into the DAW and then adjusting the amps "true character" in post.
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I didn’t find the MTL I had any less raw the MC I had, but I think the MC would probably still cut through better from having more center and uppermid presence. In terms of optionality it’s no contest the Hell Razor. It can set lower gain like the others if desired and still I think would come out ahead more tight and punchy
 
braintheory said:
In terms of optionality it’s no contest the Hell Razor. It can set lower gain like the others if desired and still I think would come out ahead more tight and punchy
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and with that lower gain setting it would still have that cut that the Modern Classic is known for?

I guess then the question for me is do i need the other bells and whistles...wish there was a way to try these amps in person but i guess that's just the way it is :doh:
 
Nashville Riff Co said:
and with that lower gain setting it would still have that cut that the Modern Classic is known for?

I guess then the question for me is do i need the other bells and whistles...wish there was a way to try these amps in person but i guess that's just the way it is :doh:
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I don’t see why it wouldn’t, I’d think the extra punch or tightness might even help a little, but really none of us can answer this question without actually trying and comparing them in a mix. If the goal really is to cut through as much as possible I think a few of my other amps might do better. I like to keep things as minimal as I can too with features, but to me the Hell Razor is just a better amp that happens to have extra features, which I’m actually using
 
braintheory said:
If anything my KT150 has more aggressive highs than what I could get with the MTL EL34 or MC EL34 I had, but the best of both worlds may possibly be KT90’s in it as those have a more 34-like character than 88’s. I find also 6550’s have excellent highs, which could be killer too if the amp can accept them
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It’s has a magic like no other . But I get how people want bigger tubes . Rick just has THE tone with those tubes
 
Techdeth said:
It’s got more than enough headroom and punch needed but it has Ricks el34 magic . I only get el34s with Rick because what the razor sharp highs have .
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I’m sure there’s plenty of headroom there too, but of all the amps I have the only ones that at all rival it in headroom or power is my megalith beta and maybe OG Uber (can’t compare since it needs to be fixed). It has substantially more headroom than my other amps. Even my Hermansson Triple Rev F, as killer as it is, doesn’t have the horsepower of it. I’m guessing it may be the tranny’s used around it more than just simply having KT88’s. If anything though, I see him as having magic with these as it’s literally been so far the only high gain KT88 amp I’ve wanted to keep
 
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Techdeth said:
It’s has a magic like no other . But I get how people want bigger tubes . Rick just has THE tone with those tubes
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I generally don’t want bigger tubes (usually don’t like them). I just tried Yehuda’s and knew I needed it (listed my Carlsbro 5GS Hermansson after trying it lol). I think it may be the tranny’s being more a factor, but who knows
 
Nashville Riff Co said:
Can i ask which ones, if you would not mind sharing?
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Well again I’d need to actually compare them in a mix, so it’s purely just speculation, I could be 100% wrong lol, but I wanna say my Purpleface vh4 Protoype (one off amp), 1972 Marshall SuperLead 100, 1989 SLO and MLC Silenoz (it might have the most uppermid range grind of all my amps). To clarify, these amps all sound very different than the wizards, but if we’re just strictly talking cutting through these are my guesses that may or may not be accurate. I did briefly try my Purpleface in a reamp for one of my friend’s songs and it did cut like crazy sounding really upfront in the mix
 
braintheory said:
Well again I’d need to actually compare them in a mix, so it’s purely just speculation, I could be 100% wrong lol, but I wanna say my Purpleface vh4 Protoype (one off amp), 1972 Marshall SuperLead 100, 1989 SLO and MLC Silenoz (it might have the most uppermid range grind of all my amps). To clarify, these amps all sound very different than the wizards, but if we’re just strictly talking cutting through these are my guesses that may or may not be accurate
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all good, appreciate the info!
 
braintheory said:
I’m sure there’s plenty of headroom there too, but of all the amps I have the only ones that at all rival it in headroom or power is my megalith beta and maybe OG Uber (can’t compare since it needs to be fixed). It has substantially more headroom than my other amps. Even my Hermansson Triple Rev F, as killer as it is, doesn’t have the horsepower of it. I’m guessing it may the tranny’s used around it more than just simply having KT88’s. If anything though, I see him as having magic with these as it’s literally been so far the only high gain KT88 amp I’ve wanted to keep
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For me it’s just about something special that’s there.
 
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