FORTIN's Evil Pumpkin – Made in China?

  • Thread starter Thread starter novosibir
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Who would even send money to a pos who runs his shop like he does. Especially a straight ripoff who has no skills other than to Xerox everyone else's work. Fuck Fortin?
 
311splawndude":2fdhx86p said:
guidedbyechoes":2fdhx86p said:
I know this isn't the gear page but do we have any patent lawyers here? I'm curious how much of a modification is needed to be considered a different circuit.
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I'm not an EE nor a patent lawyer but it was my understanding that in order for that to be a thing:

a.) Larry would need to have a pretty unique design element
b.) Larry would need to have registered that officially as intellectual property (IP)
c.) Larry would need to have proven that his design was unique and proactively protected it himself

It doesn't appear any of these things were done.

There was a deeper discussion about this in this thread around Feb 19th, 2020:

search.php?keywords=Larry+%2B+Trademark&terms=all&author=&sc=1&sf=all&sk=t&sd=d&sr=posts&st=0&ch=300&t=0&submit=Search

Mike Fortin didn't do anything illegal per say. I think it is his morals and marketing that come into question.
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Yeah the whole Sigil issue was one of the reasons I don't like them. Fortin seems like a very shady company. If Larry can get some hard evidence on them lying about where they are manufactured he might have a case. But it seems like a very tough battle to be compensated for the alleged copy of his amps.
 
exo-metal":16tfu1xk said:
Who would even send money to a pos who runs his shop like he does. Especially a straight ripoff who has no skills other than to Xerox everyone else's work. Fuck Fortin?
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That's easy. Anyone that loves the tone and has the money for it. Most people just buy what they think sounds good. If it's reliable, and sounds good then a lot of people don't care about much else.
 
exo-metal":3azyr0ax said:
Who would even send money to a pos who runs his shop like he does. Especially a straight ripoff who has no skills other than to Xerox everyone else's work. Fuck Fortin?
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The sad thing is, when you look at the long ago question/answer thread on the Metro forum, and another forum (Plexi Palace, back in 2006 i think) you can see for your own eyed the help Larry gave Mike F when it came to specifics on certain circuits...at the time Fortin was waiting for his Larry amps to be completed. Little did Larry know that Fortin was preparing himself for the cloning of those very amps he sold to Mike. All questions pertaining to certain parts of the Larry circuit, like Punch/Bite etc. Pretty obvious and damn shady to say the least.
 
And people know and you tell me people don't care. I know I do so if you are one of them worthless fucks you're on the list, FU too. Nothing cool about you.
 
exo-metal":147u2bug said:
And people know and you tell me people don't care. I know I do so if you are one of them worthless fucks you're on the list, FU too. Nothing cool about you.
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triggered much?


Racerxrated":147u2bug said:
exo-metal":147u2bug said:
Who would even send money to a pos who runs his shop like he does. Especially a straight ripoff who has no skills other than to Xerox everyone else's work. Fuck Fortin?
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The sad thing is, when you look at the long ago question/answer thread on the Metro forum, and another forum (Plexi Palace, back in 2006 i think) you can see for your own eyed the help Larry gave Mike F when it came to specifics on certain circuits...at the time Fortin was waiting for his Larry amps to be completed. Little did Larry know that Fortin was preparing himself for the cloning of those very amps he sold to Mike. All questions pertaining to certain parts of the Larry circuit, like Punch/Bite etc. Pretty obvious and damn shady to say the least.
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I agree it is super shady. Back in 2006 I probably couldn't have named one component in an amplifier nor probably cared. Thing is, didn't people realize they were on a public forum? That people might steal something from you? That the tones everyone was talking about and wanting might get copied? Again, not condoning it all - just sayin'
 
311splawndude":1rqre718 said:
exo-metal":1rqre718 said:
And people know and you tell me people don't care. I know I do so if you are one of them worthless fucks you're on the list, FU too. Nothing cool about you.
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triggered much?


Racerxrated":1rqre718 said:
exo-metal":1rqre718 said:
Who would even send money to a pos who runs his shop like he does. Especially a straight ripoff who has no skills other than to Xerox everyone else's work. Fuck Fortin?
Click to expand...
The sad thing is, when you look at the long ago question/answer thread on the Metro forum, and another forum (Plexi Palace, back in 2006 i think) you can see for your own eyed the help Larry gave Mike F when it came to specifics on certain circuits...at the time Fortin was waiting for his Larry amps to be completed. Little did Larry know that Fortin was preparing himself for the cloning of those very amps he sold to Mike. All questions pertaining to certain parts of the Larry circuit, like Punch/Bite etc. Pretty obvious and damn shady to say the least.
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I agree it is super shady. Back in 2006 I probably couldn't have named one component in an amplifier nor probably cared. Thing is, didn't people realize they were on a public forum? That people might steal something from you? That the tones everyone was talking about and wanting might get copied? Again, not condoning it all - just sayin'
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The real theft happened after Fortin received the amps from Larry. I'd imagine the 'question-answer' session dealt with specifics of how the circuit worked, i.e. how everything interacted within the circuit...things that couldn't be gleaned from just 'paint by numbers' cloning.
 
Idk. I mean. The worst thing I know Fortin to have done is hire that jackoff Engage 757. After i posted on here about my dealings with customer service (which was probaly zackoff himself), guy private messages me and says he never saw my pic or whatever and that he would like to post it on their website.. I never responded. But now that he is gone, I think we can see how Fortin really does business. I mean, does anyone know the timeline to say that Zach wasn't the one handling the responses to that guy with the Sigil? And I have trouble jumping on board with Larry when half the time fortin stole his circuit, and the other half that fortin's amps sound like shit...Which is it? I have always heard Mike is a nice guy. And poor mike soldano came up with a really good idea, but wouldn't give evh a free slo, and now we have a peavey 5150. Anyone hate Eddie? What about James Brown?
 
What about James Brown?

C'mon, the poor guy's gotta put up with the fact his name is used by about 5 guys more famous than he is. Make it 10, no 20 guys more famous going around with that name.
 
exo-metal":112gji1x said:
@splawnboy, nope never.
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It really doesn't matter, but @311splawndude is probably one of the more balanced voices on the forum I know. I have known him since probably 2008ISH. Nice dude and his post regarding copyright/patent is spot on.

Patent and copyright law is a pain in the ass. Lots of things are gray and in a lot of ways cost prohibitive for a small guy. VERY expensive, timely, and international just makes it worse. In most cases for a small builder, the patent is not something they do right away, as they do not think it would be stolen. Also the big guy who steals a design liklely has more funds than a builder. Shit if you guys think divorce lawyers are expensive, wait for patent law. So a little old German guy in a shack in his living room who puts out a half dozen amps a year probably wouldn't typically have one.
 
Markedman":1w1mlt6w said:
What about James Brown?

C'mon, the poor guy's gotta put up with the fact his name is used by about 5 guys more famous than he is. Make it 10, no 20 guys more famous going around with that name.
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Man I have to say when I think James Brown I either think of my friend here locally or the amp builder. Im excited to see what he does with EVH. The 5153 dont have something that James Brown's amps had.
 
Racerxrated":1bjoejsk said:
The real theft happened after Fortin received the amps from Larry. I'd imagine the 'question-answer' session dealt with specifics of how the circuit worked, i.e. how everything interacted within the circuit...things that couldn't be gleaned from just 'paint by numbers' cloning.
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Well, that is shady as fack if that is true. It appears, on the surface anyway, that Mike Fortin found a person who was willing to share all their secrets. Something I'm guessing other builders/modders were not as willing to do. Question is, did he befriend Larry for the sole purpose of ripping him off? I'm asking rhetorically I believe. That said, if his ish was so important to him, why did Larry share that level of detail to begin with?

Honestly, both of these guys screwed up.

Also, I'm confident Mike is aware of this thread and has purposely decided not to post or defend. And Larry, as much as I feel for the guy, probably regrets a lot of his posts in here.


@swamptrash - thanks man
 
311splawndude":2g31nier said:
Honestly, both of these guys screwed up.

Also, I'm confident Mike is aware of this thread and has purposely decided not to post or defend. And Larry, as much as I feel for the guy, probably regrets a lot of his posts in here.


@swamptrash - thanks man
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Here is my summary.

Mike had poor choice with having Zakkybitch. He should have cut him loose when he started going nuts a while back. I don't think anyone really knows what content of the customer service is Zakky or Mike either. Unless someone spoke verbally. Which as of this mess nobody seems to have done. Also I am not totally sure that Mike (not defending Mike at all) was aware of the level of Zakkys schananagans.

Larry made a lot of childish, immature, and stupid posts and comments that I find unprofessional. Possibly could have affected the results of the legal case if it ever does happen. His business ethics regarding timeliness and wait and deposits are IMO look bad to say the least. I do feel bad for him though with having the design stolen for sure if that was the case.

Mike stealing designs is fucked. PERIOD. I took a look into a lot of Fortin products as most of us have. Nothing original really at all.

At the end of the day, none of it affects me so it is what it is.
 
The problem in to get money in front is if the builder dies, and people dies.

One of the biggest USA Gunsmiths just die 2 months ago, so now there are hundreds costumers floating away...
 
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