HEAVY pedal to make hi-gain amps more Brutal

  • Thread starter Thread starter CoolGuitarGear
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This thread was a good laugh. I have to agree though. It just doesn’t make sense to slam the front end of your amp with a pedal marked “heavy” to purposely compress/saturate the preamp, then roll back the volume on the guitar. Just counter productive.
 
A high gain amp has a channel that is already overdriven and doesn't need a pedal to sound boosted.

Neither a Plexi nor a JCM800 is a high-gain amp. They are both medium gain amps that can be used for high gain when augmented with pedals and EQ. A boosted JCM800. A Plexi can achieve hard rock with a treble booster in front. A cranked Plexi and EQ can do early metal also. The Y-jumped Plexi rock sound isn't really high gain either. It's a good lead rock sound that can cross over into early metal sound. Same with the EVH Brown Variac augmented Plexi sound. They are using much less gain than we think.

The OP is using a high gain ENGL amp and blending it with a distortion pedal. So the channel is already overdriven and applying a distortion pedal to that to see what happens. The OP got more brutal tones according to them. I think overall that shouldn't be controversial in light of it being a high gain channel. Brutal is subjective but getting tone from that combination is hard and if doable then can be very interesting.

There are high-gain Orange amps with a single channel. There are some dirt pedal combinations that can work there, like with a ProCro Rat blended with Orange distortion gives a sort of Laney sound.

Empress pedals are very good quality pedals also. The Parametric EQ is one of the very few you can buy in pedal form. Q control on your pedalboard.

I like seeing new ideas for combinations like this because that's how some tones get discovered. We don't know how good they are until it sits in the mix anyway.
 
Mailman1971 said:
Dude playing his guitar Volume 3-4
Kicks the pedal on. Rolls guitar volume to 10. Then thinking it’s all the pedal.
Makes me laugh.
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Actually, I never did that... I kept the volume off a quarter-inch turn from max and left it there. Either you're lying to add to the retard commentary, or you're retarded.
 
Readyaimfire said:
This thread was a good laugh. I have to agree though. It just doesn’t make sense to slam the front end of your amp with a pedal marked “heavy” to purposely compress/saturate the preamp, then roll back the volume on the guitar. Just counter productive.
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Not if you want a clearer signal so that the note detail comes through better. That was demonstrated, but ignored. The comments from the peanut gallery certainly are good for a laugh.
 
DanTravis62 said:
LETS HEAR YOUR CLIPS BRO ...oh wait, you did

WELL YOUR PLAYING DOESNT JIVE WITH THE META-COMMENTARY I IMAGINED IN THE CHARLIE BROWN CHRISTMAS SPECIAL
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Check out the reviews section... you will see plenty on the first page. Have a good one, Dan.
 
the recording demo is the equivalent of showing how some car part gives you more horsepower, by driving below the speed limit in the before video.
 
scottosan said:
the recording demo is the equivalent of showing how some car part gives you more horsepower, by driving below the speed limit in the before video.
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It's the quality of the tone with the added detail and aggression I was going for, which has been stated more than once. You can crank those amps, but the result is different. It's no different than adding ANY type of drive or distortion to a hi-gain amp... it drives the amp harder. But with HEAVY being very aggressive, it's gain has to be reduced to accommodate the HEAVY. Very straight forward. As Ola demonstrated, it usually is done with a clean channel, whereas I wanted to demo the PEDAL with a dirty channel. So straightforward and explained, but whatever.
 
Mark Skid said:
You should try backing-away from using distortion, and focus on learning how to play the instrument. Banging around on two-note power chords with heaping distortion and delay is counterintuitive. As a beginner, you shouldn't be using distortion, at all. You need to be memorizing notes, and you can't do that when the notes are polluted with distortion.

Memorize the intervals, so that you can practice chord building. Stick with chords, as this how your ear learns to recognize harmonic content. The one thing that most professional writers/players all have in common, is that they can recognize the notes from memory. Test yourself, by having someone play random notes (labeled) on a piano, and then try to identify each note. If you feel so inclined, couple note memorization with learning to read music. Prior to the rise of Bolshevism, this was standard teaching.

When the time comes, you can begin to introduce pre-amplification distortion and echo effects. Once you become a proficient harmonic player, you can begin focusing on learning melody. i.e. Lead. Melodic playing must be using collectively and contextually. Without backing, melody should be restricted to arpeggiation. e.g. Hotel California.

When you watch 'A Charlie Brown Christmas' this year, notice the part where Lucy asks Schroeder to play Jingle Bells. He attempts to entertain Lucy with various harmonic renditions on the composition, though, Lucy is unimpressed. Schroeder is eventually reduced to playing the melody only, to which Lucy celebrates! Think about it...
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:confused:I assume you are replying to the OP. You had to have quoted the wrong clip.
 
CoolGuitarGear said:
It's the quality of the tone with the added detail and aggression I was going for, which has been stated more than once. You can crank those amps, but the result is different. It's no different than adding ANY type of drive or distortion to a hi-gain amp... it drives the amp harder. But with HEAVY being very aggressive, it's gain has to be reduced to accommodate the HEAVY. Very straight forward. As Ola demonstrated, it usually is done with a clean channel, whereas I wanted to demo the PEDAL with a dirty channel. So straightforward and explained, but whatever.
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I don’t agree that’s your intent. Your title indicates how to make high gain amps sound more brutal, but you clearly dialed out quite a bit of the available aggression on tap only to add something with a pedal that’s already available on every one of those amps.
 
scottosan said:
I don’t agree that’s your intent. Your title indicates how to make high gain amps sound more brutal, but you clearly dialed out quite a bit of the available aggression on tap only to add something with a pedal that’s already available on every one of those amps.
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BECAUSE the amps sounded more aggressive and detailed in the notes the way I did it, which made the notes pop better. Already explained in the video and multiple times in this thread. One day you'll get it.
 
CoolGuitarGear said:
BECAUSE the amps sounded more aggressive and detailed in the notes the way I did it, which made the notes pop better. Already explained in the video and multiple times in this thread. One day you'll get it.
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But you miss the point. No one dials their amp in that way, so the before comparison isn’t really fair. The criticism is in the end result or what it sounds like boosted. It’s in the purposeful dialing in of suboptimal settings and comparing the 2
 
scottosan said:
But you miss the point. No one dials their amp in that way, so the before comparison isn’t really fair. The criticism is in the end result or what it sounds like boosted. It’s in the purposeful dialing in of suboptimal settings and comparing the 2
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Wrong, I dial my amps in that way. Don't use a universal affirmative when you haven't surveyed every guitar player, particularly when it's already been established that many guitarists do dial back for the rhythm, while turning up for lead... a common practice for decades. You do not have to choose to do so... but that was MY video and application. No one is asking YOU to do it, but don't lay claim to something that is false.
 
CoolGuitarGear said:
Wrong, I dial my amps in that way. Don't use a universal affirmative when you haven't surveyed every guitar player, particularly when it's already been established that many guitarists do dial back for the rhythm, while turning up for lead... a common practice for decades. You do not have to choose to do so... but that was MY video and application. No one is asking YOU to do it, but don't lay claim to something that is false.
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Godamn you are thick headed. I normally wont bag on anyone's playing but you should get off the forums, quit making shitty videos and practice. You' would get more respect around here if you had chops and weren't an asshole.
 
headlessdeadguy said:
Godamn you are thick headed. I normally wont bag on anyone's playing but you should get off the forums, quit making shitty videos and practice. You' would get more respect around here if you had chops and weren't an asshole.
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Thanks Yngwie, your opinion means so much to me. The last thing I need is your approval or your respect. I have zero for you based on your attitude and to actually ask someone to remove himself from this site. Who the fuck are you? Some guy who plays guitar like the rest of us. Any #1 hit records, Yngwie?
 
CoolGuitarGear said:
Thanks Yngwie, your opinion means so much to me. The last thing I need is your approval or your respect. I have zero for you based on your attitude and to actually ask someone to remove himself from this site. Who the fuck are you? Some guy who plays guitar like the rest of us. Any #1 hit records, Yngwie?
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Your reading comprehension sucks too. I never asked you to leave this site. I wouldn't be disappointed if you did but I did not ask you to. As for any #1 hit records? I'm sure I have some in my old vinyl collection.
 
CoolGuitarGear is correct about using the guitar volume knob. Backing-off the volume is SOP when it comes to playing at volume, especially when playing through a NMV amplifier + gain pedal. MV amplifiers are for shit, as they compress the signal beyond a semblance of user control. You can back-off the volume knob, but there's no-way around the excessive compression that multi gain stage amplifiers generate. A lot of players rely on that compression and sustain, as it does wonders for making you sound better than you actually are.

For the accomplished player, nothing beats a good drive pedal + NMV Marshall, VOX or Matchless. Not that there aren't MV amps that I don't dig... The Marshall SJ, Wizard, Boogie IIC+ (w/o EQ) and Fender Pro-Sonic are great amplifiers for straight-in play. My favorite pedal + MV amplifier are the early JCM800, 2203 and 2204. I doubt anyone gives a f*** what I think... I'm just sayin.

Most metal guys are on 11 all the time, so the volume knob is more of an on/off dial. Not all, but most.
 
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