Johan Segeborn tests 15 Greenback Clones and Reissues Compared to an Original 1968!

[Soundstorm]

Ironic coming from someone who insists on being correct on something he was being corrected multiple times but hey, have at it.

The "counterfeit" or "broken SM57" argument from 57 fanbois are always hilarious. Also nice addition with the Line6, because anyone who doesn't use or like SM57 on guitars such as Michael Wagener must record with a shitty Line 6 amp.

Also showing your divine intellect by accusing me pointing one dead center of the speaker while I mentioned already in this thread how you need to set it closer to the edge of the cone to get a better sound of it.


Is this the best you can come up with after being told off?


Regardless, you absolute studio wizards claimed to have worked in the industry or in studios, because I'm sure you guys have made something big happen yourselves. The only problem here is that I've never heard none of that.

Fucking megalomaniacs at it again.

 

[gruggmanny]

I have to warn you, telling me off is, quite possibly, impossible.

Didn't expect anything else from you. My job here is done.

 

[phil b]

Ironic coming from someone who insists on being correct on something he was being corrected multiple times but hey, have at it.

The "counterfeit" or "broken SM57" argument from 57 fanbois are always hilarious. Also nice addition with the Line6, because anyone who doesn't use or like SM57 on guitars such as Michael Wagener must record with a shitty Line 6 amp.

Also showing your divine intellect by accusing me pointing one dead center of the speaker while I mentioned already in this thread how you need to set it closer to the edge of the cone to get a better sound of it.


Is this the best you can come up with after being told off?


Regardless, you absolute studio wizards claimed to have worked in the industry or in studios, because I'm sure you guys have made something big happen yourselves. The only problem here is that I've never heard none of that.

Fucking megalomaniacs at it again.

Nothing for nothing but I owned a commercial studio for 20 years quite a long time ago. No digital to speak of. Ampex MM1000 16 track 2 inch.
The 57 was the standard and kind of an all purpose for a ton of things. What worked, worked. When you record a whole album of Bagpipe music for a week straight it really doesnt make a difference what mic yer using. At the end of the day its whatever sounds the best. Fast forward to today and the 57 is still a great go to mic. You say it sounds harsh but the graph that you posted in those upper freqs wouldnt really make it sound harsh.

A guitar cab most speakers cant get near that range to begin with. Altecs can reproduce up to 8k and more than likely some JBLs. If anything if those upper freqs. are really bothersome it only takes a tweak of your EQ to tame it. I've never found that to be an issue and you're the only person who has ever said that mic is harsh. I know guys who dont care for the 57, but never have I heard it described as harsh. Whats on paper and what you hear can be very different, and not just because of your ears. Throw digital recordings in the mix and its so much more than just a mic that will make things harsh. A LOT of digital recordings are harsh from the start, no matter what mic someone is using. You're entitled to your opinion but its not the mics fault if things sound harsh.

 

[VESmedic]

Ironic coming from someone who insists on being correct on something he was being corrected multiple times but hey, have at it.

The "counterfeit" or "broken SM57" argument from 57 fanbois are always hilarious. Also nice addition with the Line6, because anyone who doesn't use or like SM57 on guitars such as Michael Wagener must record with a shitty Line 6 amp.

Also showing your divine intellect by accusing me pointing one dead center of the speaker while I mentioned already in this thread how you need to set it closer to the edge of the cone to get a better sound of it.


Is this the best you can come up with after being told off?


Regardless, you absolute studio wizards claimed to have worked in the industry or in studios, because I'm sure you guys have made something big happen yourselves. The only problem here is that I've never heard none of that.

Fucking megalomaniacs at it again.

Corrected by who? I back up what I say with facts galore homie. Now opinions? Sure, everyone has them. But correcting me? Mmmmmm try again converter guy.

 

[DanTravis62]

Didn't expect anything else from you. My job here is done.

 

[thegame]

Man, Steve Albini really let himself go toward the end

 

[DanTravis62]

Corrected by who? I back up what I say with facts galore homie. Now opinions? Sure, everyone has them. But correcting me? Mmmmmm try again converter guy.

The thing is, if it was just a "subjective" version of "Grugg likes other options better than the 57" this would have gone a lot differently

But of course, he had to do the "heh, everyone except me IS STEWWWWPID because the 57 is HARSH, SEE LOOK A GRAPH" route

Starting everything with a confrontational attitude is not a cash money move

Man, Steve Albini really let himself go toward the end

TBH I think barney hits harder than any Shellac record, there's no way I could confuse them

 

[thegame]

TBH I think barney hits harder than any Shellac record, there's no way I could confuse them

I'll take your word for it. I've never listened to uber indie-avant garde-post-herion chic-noisefuzz-more pretentious than thou-Thurston Moore is god-we make the Melvins sound like Dream Theater by comparison-rock in my life. Albini's face just looks like that's the kind of music he makes.

 

[DanTravis62]

I'll take your word for it. I've never listened to uber indie-avant garde-post-herion chic-noisefuzz-more pretentious than thou-Thurston Moore is god-we make the Melvins sound like Dream Theater by comparison-rock in my life. Albini's face just looks like that's the kind of music he makes.

Yep, pretty close tbh

The punk gigs i play, we always dread the lineups with AvANt gArdE band names, because it means theres going to be a lot of EQD pedals and a whole lot of pretense

 

[VonBonfire]

But of course, he had to do the "heh, everyone except me IS STEWWWWPID because the 57 is HARSH, SEE LOOK A GRAPH" route

Over a decade ago when I still had a FB account me and an old bass player I used to work with had an argument like this and he kind of took the same position so I haven't spoken to him since lol (hey no more FB!). Sorry but Senheiser and other offerings haven't replaced the ol' 57, they just offer some different flavors. There are always those guys with the newer=better attitude.

 

[DanTravis62]

Over a decade ago when I still had a FB account me and an old bass player I used to work with had an argument like this and he kind of took the same position so I haven't spoken to him since lol (hey no more FB!). Sorry but Senheiser and other offerings haven't replaced the ol' 57, they just offer some different flavors. There are always those guys with the newer=better attitude.

There's tons of great options, they're just all basically the 57 with Paprika, or the 57 with Mint, etc

Everyone's been trying to replace the 57 by reiterating the 57 with a dash of Lemongrass, so it hasn't been replaced yet

 

[Panhead5]

I mean, you're entitled to your opinion, I guess

But the 57 is the industry standard for a reason - it's what the listener expects to hear when they listen to guitar based music

Medic, and I, and literally every other person who has worked in an actual studio for actual money will continue to use 57s and get awesome results

I love these threads !!! I’m over 60 and all I can tell you is I know there’s folks that can take a 5 dollar Radio Shack speaker and make it sound great. I’ve bought and sold more gear that I heard great clips from. These threads really are stupid .Everyone raves about greenbacks . I think they sound like shit it at my house through my 45 year old Marshall’s. I hear a recording or go to a show and hear them with a good sound man or someone with good recording skills and I’m all in . They are the greatest.
I’m just saying!!

 

[Greazygeo]

I love these threads !!! I’m over 60 and all I can tell you is I know there’s folks that can take a 5 dollar Radio Shack speaker and make it sound great. I’ve bought and sold more gear that I heard great clips from. These threads really are stupid .Everyone raves about greenbacks . I think they sound like shit it at my house through my 45 year old Marshall’s. I hear a recording or go to a show and hear them with a good sound man or someone with good recording skills and I’m all in . They are the greatest.
I’m just saying!!

They can sound good in the room. Hate the sound of them close mic recorded. V30’s are the opposite, sound like shit in the room but record ok.

 

[Scumback Speakers]

You can repair an old Greenback if you know what you're doing. Looks like that one had the dust cap removed to re-center the coil or get out debris from crud, dried glue, etc.

As for the Band Aid? LOL

For those that might wonder, the 1967 102 003 Pulsonic G12M 20w white paper voice coil speaker is the "holy grail", IMO, which is why they're in my Queen/Dokken cab. But they're only 20w each. I've punished that cab with a 1971 JMP 50w for years, no issues. But I wouldn't run a 100w head through it.

Just my .02... take it or leave it.

Jim

 

[hbcalisurfer]

I have two 4X12s and two 2X12s all loaded with various Scumbacks. Met Jim at the amp show in LA. Superior speakers. Here is one:

 

[gruggmanny]

Nothing for nothing but I owned a commercial studio for 20 years quite a long time ago. No digital to speak of. Ampex MM1000 16 track 2 inch.
The 57 was the standard and kind of an all purpose for a ton of things. What worked, worked. When you record a whole album of Bagpipe music for a week straight it really doesnt make a difference what mic yer using. At the end of the day its whatever sounds the best. Fast forward to today and the 57 is still a great go to mic. You say it sounds harsh but the graph that you posted in those upper freqs wouldnt really make it sound harsh.

A guitar cab most speakers cant get near that range to begin with. Altecs can reproduce up to 8k and more than likely some JBLs. If anything if those upper freqs. are really bothersome it only takes a tweak of your EQ to tame it. I've never found that to be an issue and you're the only person who has ever said that mic is harsh. I know guys who dont care for the 57, but never have I heard it described as harsh. Whats on paper and what you hear can be very different, and not just because of your ears. Throw digital recordings in the mix and its so much more than just a mic that will make things harsh. A LOT of digital recordings are harsh from the start, no matter what mic someone is using. You're entitled to your opinion but its not the mics fault if things sound harsh.

I'm not saying that it's not a standard nor that it didn't sound great back in the day.

When it comes to digital recordings being harsh, that's the reason exactly I prefer a darker mic in my signal chain. I rather nail the sound in the source than rely on EQ. I've owned few SM57's which some of them were new and some used and have never gotten desired results with them.

I first got the e609 as a replacement and it was a step in the right direction, but as a lot of people were raving about the e906 I had to try that one too and with the hi cut engaged it sounds even better imo.

One other mic that I would like to try still is a cheapo Superlux PRA628 MKII mic which is said to be more "neutral" sounding version of the e609. If i'm not happy with that one I'll stick to my e906.

Michael Wagener switched to ribbon mics like Beyerdynamic somewhere around 1985 IIRC.

 

[jabps]

I'm not saying that it's not a standard nor that it didn't sound great back in the day.

When it comes to digital recordings being harsh, that's the reason exactly I prefer a darker mic in my signal chain. I rather nail the sound in the source than rely on EQ. I've owned few SM57's which some of them were new and some used and have never gotten desired results with them.

I first got the e609 as a replacement and it was a step in the right direction, but as a lot of people were raving about the e906 I had to try that one too and with the hi cut engaged it sounds even better imo.

One other mic that I would like to try still is a cheapo Superlux PRA628 MKII mic which is said to be more "neutral" sounding version of the e609. If i'm not happy with that one I'll stick to my e906.

Michael Wagener switched to ribbon mics like Beyerdynamic somewhere around 1985 IIRC.

Look, I'm not an engineer and would never pretend to be but I did stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night.

That said, instead of this "back in the day" BS or having to continually say the 57 is harsh you could have avoided all of this by saying I just don't like it. I prefer other mics. I mean I've actually worked with engineers that didn't care for the 57. Getting into a pissing match with probably the most "used" mic for guitar recordings ever, since it's inception in 1965 to this very day is silly. Bottom line is the 57 is as valid today as it was when it was introduced. Digital has zero to do with it.

 

[phil b]

I'm not saying that it's not a standard nor that it didn't sound great back in the day.

When it comes to digital recordings being harsh, that's the reason exactly I prefer a darker mic in my signal chain. I rather nail the sound in the source than rely on EQ. I've owned few SM57's which some of them were new and some used and have never gotten desired results with them.

I first got the e609 as a replacement and it was a step in the right direction, but as a lot of people were raving about the e906 I had to try that one too and with the hi cut engaged it sounds even better imo.

One other mic that I would like to try still is a cheapo Superlux PRA628 MKII mic which is said to be more "neutral" sounding version of the e609. If i'm not happy with that one I'll stick to my e906.

Michael Wagener switched to ribbon mics like Beyerdynamic somewhere around 1985 IIRC.

Ok fair enough. But if you want to nail the harshness in the source then look to the amp,modeler,plugin etc... You yourself already said it was great back in the day. It still is. It didnt just become harsh. I think thats where you're mixing things up. Mic pre's are so important in the digital world and a lot of the better ones cost a fortune.

Bottom line is use what works for you cause at the end of the day its what sounds best for you. But remember what the source is though. Thats what is going into whatever mic you're using.

 

[gruggmanny]

Look, I'm not an engineer and would never pretend to be but I did stay in a Holiday Inn Express last night.

That said, instead of this "back in the day" BS or having to continually say the 57 is harsh you could have avoided all of this by saying I just don't like it. I prefer other mics. I mean I've actually worked with engineers that didn't care for the 57. Getting into a pissing match with probably the most "used" mic for guitar recordings ever, since it's inception in 1965 to this very day is silly. Bottom line is the 57 is as valid today as it was when it was introduced. Digital has zero to do with it.

But i'll rather piss on your face.

Ok fair enough. But if you want to nail the harshness in the source then look to the amp,modeler,plugin etc... You yourself already said it was great back in the day. It still is. It didnt just become harsh. I think thats where you're mixing things up. Mic pre's are so important in the digital world and a lot of the better ones cost a fortune.

Bottom line is use what works for you cause at the end of the day its what sounds best for you. But remember what the source is though. Thats what is going into whatever mic you're using.

Speaker and mic matter way more than the amp in the signal chain. What i'm trying to say is that SM57 worked back in the day because tape mellowed highs a bit and helped to tame it down. The same is not the case with digital.

 

[jabps]

But i'll rather piss on your face.

Speaker and mic matter way more than the amp in the signal chain. What i'm trying to say is that SM57 worked back in the day because tape mellowed highs a bit and helped to tame it down. The same is not the case with digital.

No thank you. Good to know that you've got digital figured out. We can all feel safe tonight knowing you've cracked the code and are elevating recording from this point forward. Looking forward to hearing some of those "warm" guitar tones from your recordings.

Let's all give this man a round of applause.