The ultimate high gain head for my needs?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Achilles
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braintheory said:
I agree, it’s just the JVM is so artificial sounding. It’s like hearing a recording of a great Marshall
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And I completely disagree. I love my JVM's, I buy other amps for fun now but the JVM is and has been my main amp since they first came out. And I grew up with Marshall. My first two "real" amps when I started playing were 50 Marshall JMP's back in the early 80's. You mentioned a Mezzabara earlier and yet I couldn't get rid of that amp fast enough. I marveled at the build quality but I couldn't dial the low end flub out for anything. Amp EQ, eq in the loop, eq in the front...and OD. I just couldn't bond with it. And yet some guys are slaying with those things.

That's why people need to try stuff out for themselves because everyone hears and feels something different. I love giving idea's but ultimately the player has to be the gauge. That's just my old man opinion lol.
 
jabps said:
And I completely disagree. I love my JVM's, I buy other amps for fun now but the JVM is and has been my main amp since they first came out. And I grew up with Marshall. My first two "real" amps when I started playing were 50 Marshall JMP's back in the early 80's. You mentioned a Mezzabara earlier and yet I couldn't get rid of that amp fast enough. I marveled at the build quality but I couldn't dial the low end flub out for anything. Amp EQ, eq in the loop, eq in the front...and OD. I just couldn't bond with it. And yet some guys are slaying with those things.

That's why people need to try stuff out for themselves because everyone hears and feels something different. I love giving idea's but ultimately the player has to be the gauge. That's just my old man opinion lol.
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Yes there’s no argument there: no valid substitute for trying in person (clips aren’t enough). I fully agree also that the Mezzabarba is not the tightest amp by any stretch, but I was able to get something eventually that I thought worked for metal. The JVM is tighter and well voiced for sure, for me it was just once I started comparing it to other amps it sounded like a recording of an amp to me and felt artificial from my perspective, but like you said that’s just me and others should try for themselves to see if they feel the same or not. The Mezzabarba to me sounded more raw and organic than most recent made amps I’ve tried, particularly if we’re talking high gain stuff. That’s why it impressed me. I don’t like Engl’s also for that artificial sound. I sold my Mezzabarba Mzero OD years ago anyway fwiw
 
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Remember when the jvm’s came out around here?? Guys were saying it was gonna put small builders and modders out of business cause it was supposedly so good. I think there was some sort of group preorder with 15 or something dudes
 
RaceU4her said:
Remember when the jvm’s came out around here?? Guys were saying it was gonna put small builders and modders out of business cause it was supposedly so good. I think there was some sort of group preorder with 15 or something dudes
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Good point, I clearly remember that👍
 
Love my Revv Generator 120. Does all you ask for. And the EVH EL34 is killer also. No disappointment in either.
 
Speeddemon said:
Why no Engl amps? I mean, I don't care for a Fireball or Powerball either and I sold an EL34 SE, but the Savage and maybe the Inferno and Artist Edition would be right up your alley.
The Invader probably not; while CH1 is one of the best clean sounds on a high gain amp (other ones I loved: Mesa Mark IV/V and Diezel D-Moll) and Channel 3 does the Göteborg thing pretty well, CH2 is probably perhaps slightly too thick and polite for your modded JCM800-desires. It does have awesome gain and saturation. CH4 is too loose and saturated though. I hardly use it.

And like someone else already commented, most Diezels can definitely sound more processed (in the low mids particularly) than some of the more organic/dynamic sounding Engls. So NOT the Powerball. ;-)
A Diezel D-Moll is very close to what you're looking for, EL34 or KT77, 100W, 3 channels, but you've gotta love the sound.
I was on the verge of buying one used, brought the cash, tried it out and walked away without an amp. You can't dial out that overly saturated, almost fuzzy thick grind that it has in the low-mids. Engls typically are definitely tighter sounding. And the Savage has enough raw clarity as well, without suffering from the dryness that VHT/Fryette can have. (Sold a Sig:X for chump change too... saw it at some European music store later with a 40% mark-up)

Regarding the BE-100; I recently did a show together with The Iron Maidens and Courtney was playing a BE-100...Great 'bigger than life' lead tone, but waaay too thick, big, chewy and blunt for Maiden-rhythm tones. The other girl (subbing for Nikki) played a DSL100, way more what you expect for Maiden. It would not be my pick for Scandinavian death metal. You need more 'surgical precision' with the right amount of compression and saturation, but clarity and rawness. And clarity/rawness are not the LEADING traits I would bestow on most Bogners or the BE-100. FWIW.

The EVH Stealth 100 is probably a good call too; just make sure you like that plasticy honk in the mids. I tolerate it on my 50W 6L6, but if Engl would release a 2.5/3 channel Savage 50/60 (or Mesa with a Mark V:50) in 60cm head width with EL34's, I'd be all over that in a heartbeat.
Why not just use my old Savage 60 you ask? Lack of switching options I need live. And I've sworn off full sized heads for gigging.

Oh, another European option; Driftwood Nightmare or Mini Nightmare. Tone-wise could be right up your alley. I'm considering the 6L6 Mini Nightmare myself.
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Agreed. The Artist Edition is a smokin' amp! I haven't played an Inferno, but they seem to get a lot of love.

If the EVH's didn't have such an out of control red channel, that would be a great choice. Throw some 5751's in V3 & V4, or ECC81's.
 
RaceU4her said:
Remember when the jvm’s came out around here?? Guys were saying it was gonna put small builders and modders out of business cause it was supposedly so good. I think there was some sort of group preorder with 15 or something dudes
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All smoke and mirrors, courtesy of the OG New Jersey circle jerk crew. Always knew those guys were full of shit.
 
Speeddemon said:
Why no Engl amps? I mean, I don't care for a Fireball or Powerball either and I sold an EL34 SE, but the Savage and maybe the Inferno and Artist Edition would be right up your alley.
The Invader probably not; while CH1 is one of the best clean sounds on a high gain amp (other ones I loved: Mesa Mark IV/V and Diezel D-Moll) and Channel 3 does the Göteborg thing pretty well, CH2 is probably perhaps slightly too thick and polite for your modded JCM800-desires. It does have awesome gain and saturation. CH4 is too loose and saturated though. I hardly use it.

And like someone else already commented, most Diezels can definitely sound more processed (in the low mids particularly) than some of the more organic/dynamic sounding Engls. So NOT the Powerball. ;-)
A Diezel D-Moll is very close to what you're looking for, EL34 or KT77, 100W, 3 channels, but you've gotta love the sound.
I was on the verge of buying one used, brought the cash, tried it out and walked away without an amp. You can't dial out that overly saturated, almost fuzzy thick grind that it has in the low-mids. Engls typically are definitely tighter sounding. And the Savage has enough raw clarity as well, without suffering from the dryness that VHT/Fryette can have. (Sold a Sig:X for chump change too... saw it at some European music store later with a 40% mark-up)

Regarding the BE-100; I recently did a show together with The Iron Maidens and Courtney was playing a BE-100...Great 'bigger than life' lead tone, but waaay too thick, big, chewy and blunt for Maiden-rhythm tones. The other girl (subbing for Nikki) played a DSL100, way more what you expect for Maiden. It would not be my pick for Scandinavian death metal. You need more 'surgical precision' with the right amount of compression and saturation, but clarity and rawness. And clarity/rawness are not the LEADING traits I would bestow on most Bogners or the BE-100. FWIW.

The EVH Stealth 100 is probably a good call too; just make sure you like that plasticy honk in the mids. I tolerate it on my 50W 6L6, but if Engl would release a 2.5/3 channel Savage 50/60 (or Mesa with a Mark V:50) in 60cm head width with EL34's, I'd be all over that in a heartbeat.
Why not just use my old Savage 60 you ask? Lack of switching options I need live. And I've sworn off full sized heads for gigging.

Oh, another European option; Driftwood Nightmare or Mini Nightmare. Tone-wise could be right up your alley. I'm considering the 6L6 Mini Nightmare myself.
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Hei there!
Thank you so much for taking the time to write such a thorough review!!
Much appreciated 🍻
 
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thegame said:
All smoke and mirrors, courtesy of the OG New Jersey circle jerk crew. Always knew those guys were full of shit.
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I guess somehow I didn’t know about this crew despite living near New York City, although I didn’t start playing guitar till around 2007 or 8
 
mooncobra said:
I had a JVM for about 2 days. Many years back, whoa…….I still shudder thinking about those two days of pain, misery, anguish, and the worst tone I’ve ever heard.
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Haha I wouldn’t go that far, but it’s been years now since I last tried one. When I was newer to guitar it was one of the few tube amps at my local guitar center. Back than it seemed decent to me until I tried other stuff later on. I remember the Satriani JVM being better, but still not holding up too well when compared to other quality amps
 
braintheory said:
Haha I wouldn’t go that far, but it’s been years now since I last tried one. When I was newer to guitar it was one of the few tube amps at my local guitar center. Back than it seemed decent to me until I tried other stuff later on. I remember the Satriani JVM being better, but still not holding up too well when compared to other quality amps
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Bro, grab a JVM and put it up against your vh4 prototype or wizard and those childish toy fx you speak of? Well, that’s what the JVM will seem like to you.
 
thegame said:
All smoke and mirrors, courtesy of the OG New Jersey circle jerk crew. Always knew those guys were full of shit.
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Those dudes must have been here before I joined. Some guys live to hype up new gear so in case they don’t like it they can attempt to sell for close to purchase price. Those dudes are wankers.
 
mooncobra said:
Bro, grab a JVM and put it up against your vh4 prototype or wizard and those childish toy fx you speak of? Well, that’s what the JVM will seem like to you.
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Haha the amps alone should suffice I’d think. Maybe I’ll just give the proto or Wizard the fx to make it a more even battle or maybe the worse amp needs them to cover up, pick your poison

I appreciate you remembering my fx opinions btw. I can pm you later the clips to show what I meant
 
From what you are describing, I would go rack and get the preamps for those tones and a nice poweramp.
 
Hi guys!

Sorry for the late response but it has been a busy week.
I want to thank each and everyone of you for your responses so far and for taking the time to help me in my search.
Every suggestion counts.
Thank you all 🙏

So far there has been mentioned a lot of interesting amps.
Unfortunately I don't have the time to go to a guitar shop and try the amps that I'm interested in, with all the family duties and work. It's a very tight schedule. Also, we don't have the variety of shops and amps here. That's why I started this post.

So, an update:

I came to the conclusion that an amp with all those sounds I need, does not exist. I'll have to buy more than one head.

I also came to the conclusion that what I'm searching for in my basic heavy distortion sound, is the mix of the upper mids and note definition of the "British sound" with the low mids and lows of the "American sound" TOGETHER in one channel. I need an organic full boded distortion sound with this combination.
I don't want to buy 2 different amps just for that one sound and mix them together every time I want to play guitar. It's unpractical and luxurious for my purposes.

So which amps & manufacturers are out of the game for one reason or another :
-Marshalls (I can't use them as a standalone amp, too much treble & upper mid focus, lack of low mids and lows). That's why they shine in a band context and in a mix.
-JVM (very poor quality, almost like a digital unit, like a collection of distortion boxes)
-Engl (not organic, dislike the signature sound)
-Diezel (not organic, dislike the signature sound)
-Revv 120 (only liked the purple 3rd ch.)
-Mezzabarba (dislike the signature sound)
-Bogner Exctasy: No use for it as I'll buy a different amp for the cleans. 3rd ch nothing interesting.

I might have to sell the Mark and the Recto and start all over again.

Amps & manufacturers I'm considering:
- Fender Reverb amp for true american cleans.
Basic heavy distortion sound:
- MESA Triple Crown 100w:
Organic, but I don't know how brutal and modern the 3rd ch can be for my needs. I can use the 2nd ch as my modernized JCM 800 sound. Clean ch i don't know.
- MESA Badlander 100w:
Brutal and modern, organic, i like the sound but I don't know about the tightness and the possible lack of upper mids and definition. Also, I could use the 1st ch as my heavy alternative sound.
- VICTORY Super Kraken 100w:
Nice organic distortion full boded sound but maybe a little smooth/not so modern, only one eq for all 3 channels.
- EVH Stealth 6L6 100w:
1st ch is an imitation of a Plexi sound.
2nd ch is modern tight brutal sound or an 80s heavy rythm sound.
3ch is the solo/lead sound or the basic modern tight brutal sound.
I'm afraid I'll get tired of it after a while, not as organic and inspiring as the Mesas i think.
Too tight perhaps? and it lacks the texture. It's like an one purpose amp. An one dimensional brutal modern distortion.
- ORANGE Rockeverb 3:
Nice clean ch, interesting distortion ch, but ultimately a jack of all trades kind of amp. Distortion gets a little fuzzy and sludgy at times.
- FRIEDMAN BE-100 or Deluxe:
Organic, fantastic Plexi cleans, inspiring marshall distortion sounds that you can actually play as a standalone amp because of the low mids and lows blended in. As opposed to an original Marshall.
- Fryette:
Organic and brutal for sure but too tight and very upforward sound. Doesn't have enough "give" and "chewiness".

These are my conclusions so far, concerning the sonic characteristics.

I tend to gravitate to the mesa sound it seems but I am concerned about the tightness, aggression and definition they might lacking. Especially the Badlander 🤷‍♂️

I also think I might go for a 3 amp setup:
1) Fender Reverb for cleans
2) FRIEDMAN BE-100 or Deluxe for everything Marshall & in-between sounds.
3) A 2ch amp for heavy alternative rythm and brutal heavy rythm that fit my description and needs.

That's it for now.
More to come.
Keep on searching 🏃‍♂️
 
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