Floyd Eye
Well-known member
You mean men, explaining to me the word of god ?
Let no man be reverend unto you. Sound familiar ?
Let no man be reverend unto you. Sound familiar ?
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VonBonfire
Well-known member
Yes it does. 1 Corinthians 4:15 is the basis for having a spiritual father.
Floyd Eye
Well-known member
Here's an interesting theory. If I was a Christian, which I am not, I would still understand that the bible was written over centuries apart and written by men. And not all bible history is accurate. And not all of that in the bible is properly understood by modern people and modern criteria. For example the earth in 7 days thing you guys were talking about. I've heard it said that a day was 1000 years to god. In reality there is no way to actually know that, but we can assume a day to god isn't a day to us. This could explain why Christians believe the earth is 2500 years old, which is radically inaccurate.
Or take the belief many have that non believers are cast in a burning lake, often referred to as hell. In fact the word Hell is translated from the Greek word Shiel. Which means hole in the ground or tomb. Then you factor in the words of the bible which say that hell is eternity separated from god. That might lead someone to conclude that non believers are not raised from the dead on judgement day and merely continue to not exist, where the faithful are to spend eternity in the kingdom of god.
Then we can talk about the being scattered to the corners of the earth and made to speak different languages so we could not communicate with each other bit. This could be interpreted as humans evolving with different traits, different gods and in different parts of the world. Evolution is not necessarily at odds with creation. What if evolution is how god created humanity ? What if Budda, Allah, Ganesh and the christian god are the same entity.
Like I said, interesting. And there is no way any one person has all the right answers. Or really any of the answers. After all, your lot is blind faith, yes ?
Or take the belief many have that non believers are cast in a burning lake, often referred to as hell. In fact the word Hell is translated from the Greek word Shiel. Which means hole in the ground or tomb. Then you factor in the words of the bible which say that hell is eternity separated from god. That might lead someone to conclude that non believers are not raised from the dead on judgement day and merely continue to not exist, where the faithful are to spend eternity in the kingdom of god.
Then we can talk about the being scattered to the corners of the earth and made to speak different languages so we could not communicate with each other bit. This could be interpreted as humans evolving with different traits, different gods and in different parts of the world. Evolution is not necessarily at odds with creation. What if evolution is how god created humanity ? What if Budda, Allah, Ganesh and the christian god are the same entity.
Like I said, interesting. And there is no way any one person has all the right answers. Or really any of the answers. After all, your lot is blind faith, yes ?
Floyd Eye
Well-known member
The big bang theory. That could easily be the way "God" created the universe. Let there be light, Kablam. Light.
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VonBonfire
Well-known member
The church has had all the answers since it's inception but it's anything but blind faith.
Yes, Christ is that light and everything is created through him and is therefore his possession.
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VonBonfire
Well-known member
@Floyd Eye what I mean to say is that per scripture is "all testimony is to be established by two or three witnesses".
The prophets, the saints, and the martyrs have established that testimony so it's not "blind".
Floyd Eye
Well-known member
The bible literally says it is blind faith. Faith by definition is blind faith. And faith in the existence of god, any god, is blind faith.
Also the church is anyplace where 2 or more men are gathered in his name. You'll need to be much more specific.
Floyd Eye
Well-known member
That is the same as assuming anything believed by more than one person is fact. And it's especially specious when you consider that saints and martyrs are not looked at as specially enlightened by most people. Other than Catholics.
acceptance
Well-known member
Blind faith is not faith. They are different concepts.
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VonBonfire
Well-known member
James 2:14-20 ......Faith without works is dead
You aren't saved by blind faith at all. In fact, you are aren't saved in the past tense at all until the fat lady sings. It's an ongoing process while you are breathing.
The orthodox church. Pre-denominational.
Noah was not looked up to by most people of his day until he was on the boat while they were busy drowning so what you are saying doesn't have bearing to the conversation. It's not a popularity contest and even if it is christian forms of religion are still the most popular.
acceptance
Well-known member
Pre-denominational was like the disciples with Jesus. As far as I can tell there have existed disputes about church authenticity, authority and doctrine since just after that.
Floyd Eye
Well-known member
I wasn't referring to popularity. More that if you are using people, things, as evidence, it's only going to be considered evidence to those who believe those things existed in the first place.
Floyd Eye
Well-known member
Sure in most things. Not the existence of god though. Unless you can point to some incontrovertible proof that god exists, all faith in god is blind faith.
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VonBonfire
Well-known member
There are the 12 and there are the 70. And you are correct which is why they held council with clergy from across the known world gathered to straighten out the disputes. Even the bible itself records some of those heretical people.
Floyd Eye
Well-known member
Isn't it all suspect to you that any and all churches think theirs is the only "True" church ?
acceptance
Well-known member
No, faith is believing in something that you can’t prove, but not without any reason or evidence. Blind faith is believing in something with no reason or evidence.
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VonBonfire
Well-known member
The apostles walked with Christ and all but one were martyred. What's the motivating factor? Belief in a made up lie? You can't expect video footage. To the unbeliever there is no evidence that would be acceptable to convince them otherwise. It's a heart issue.
Floyd Eye
Well-known member
Yeah, I understand that. There is no evidence god exists. Therefore, blind faith.
Floyd Eye
Well-known member
The best Blind Faith.
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VonBonfire
Well-known member
Yes but only the orthodox church can back it up. Everything after it is heretical, and splintered from orthodoxy or other heretical sects. They cannot prove those claims.