Matt Walsh Demonetised on YouTube ~ Free-speech Debacle

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Donnie B said:
What is your definition of change though?

DNA?
The way a person chooses to live their life?
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I understand where you're coming from mate; that's the left's argument in this thing (the "choice" thing).

Obviously I'm talking biologically. The day it becomes possible for a man to conceive, deliver a baby and have his chromosomes switched-over, I'll be first-in-line to acknowledge that it's possible.

As I said, I understand. I've counselled trans people. I totally get it. This whole kerfuffle and others like it revolve around folks refusing to recognise biological facts due in most cases to their emotional investment in their chosen genders.

Many trans peeps totally get this; we just tend to hear only the loudest, most-vehement protestations these days... unsurprisingly.
 
Monkey Man said:
I understand where you're coming from mate; that's the left's argument in this thing (the "choice" thing).
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You keep saying you get it but then you say things like "the left's argument", which is a terribly generalizing statement.

Let's just part ways on this one.
Cheers.
:cheers:
 
Yeah, it's a generalisation, and a fair one at that... but still a generalisation.

How about I just just state the obvious - that one side says that which gender you are is biologically-defined and immutable, whilst the other says it's your choice / how you feel?
 
Monkey Man said:
How about I just just state the obvious - that one side says that which gender you are is biologically-defined and immutable, whilst the other says it's your choice / how you feel?
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How about I just state the obvious - that one side respects the conclusions of the medical and scientific fields when it comes to gender,
whilst the other chooses to be willfully obtuse on the matter.

:D
 
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Donnie B said:
How about I just state the obvious - that “one side respects the conclusions of the medical and scientific fields” when it comes to gender,
whilst the other chooses to be willfully obtuse on the matter.

:D
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Just when you hit the ridiculous nonsense ceiling, you take it to yet another level.

Congratulations, you’ve taken twisted liberal bullshit to new heights, Donnie.
 
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JackTheBear said:
Just when you hit the ridiculous nonsense ceiling, you take it to yet another level.

Congratulations, you’ve taken twisted liberal bullshit to new heights, Donnie.
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I think he demonstrated that mindset to a T. My takeaway from his statement is that even when faced with indisputable medial and scientific fact; no matter what the topic is, those of a similar viewpoint to his will willfully ignore those facts and create a false narrative that fits with their agenda and ideology to the point of complete absurdity.
 
MadAsAHatter said:
My takeaway from his statement is that even when faced with indisputable medial and scientific fact; no matter what the topic is, those of a similar viewpoint to his will willfully ignore those facts and create a false narrative.
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In this particular case, what medical and scientific facts are being willfully ignored?
 
Donnie B said:
How about I just state the obvious - that one side respects the conclusions of the medical and scientific fields when it comes to gender,
whilst the other chooses to be willfully obtuse on the matter.

:D
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I see the smiley face in your post so I'm not sure if you were kidding or being in jest so take this with a grain of salt. Also please do not knee jerk and/or tell me to "fuck off" or that I "hate fags". I think what Monkey Man along with some of the rest of us are saying can be summed up below in a quote below from the AMA. So I don't think MM was being obtuse at all, but I will let him speak for himself after he wakes up (hoping he gets some much needed rest as I'm assuming this place, OTC, is wearing him out). :LOL:

AMA-
"The Mars versus Venus distinction is commonly used to refer to the age-old dialog over the differences between men and women, differences that undoubtedly will be pondered, researched, and challenged for lifetimes to come. The subject of the sex and gender difference is now advancing with renewed vigor to the forefront of the study and practice of medicine. Just as it has long been known that children are not miniature adults, there is increasing focus on how the differences between the sexes affect how illnesses are diagnosed, run their course, and respond to treatment.

First though, it is necessary to point out that the terms sex and gender are not synonyms. Sex refers to the biological differences between males and females. Gender refers to the continuum of complex psychosocial self-perceptions, attitudes, and expectations people have about members of both sexes. Even the terms male and female, man and woman are not interchangeable. What it means to be male or female originates from physical characteristics derived from sex chromosomes and genes that lead to certain gonads, internal and external genitalia, and physiological hormones. Being a man or a woman holds broader meaning, with cultural concepts of masculinity and femininity coming into play."

So IMO, perceptions, attitudes and expectations are subjective. Not fact.
 
MadAsAHatter said:
I don't really feel like laying it all out there when you'll just ignore it or ask another ridiculous question in response. It's not worth my time. And no point being redundant when others have already stated it.
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What I posted:

that one side respects the conclusions of the medical and scientific fields when it comes to gender

What part are you taking issue with?
 
MadAsAHatter said:
I think he demonstrated that mindset to a T. My takeaway from his statement is that even when faced with indisputable medial and scientific fact; no matter what the topic is, those of a similar viewpoint to his will willfully ignore those facts and create a false narrative that fits with their agenda and ideology to the point of complete absurdity.
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This👌
 
311splawndude said:
I see the smiley face in your post so I'm not sure if you were kidding or being in jest so take this with a grain of salt. Also please do not knee jerk and/or tell me to "fuck off" or that I "hate fags". I think what Monkey Man along with some of the rest of us are saying can be summed up below in a quote below from the AMA. So I don't think MM was being obtuse at all, but I will let him speak for himself after he wakes up (hoping he gets some much needed rest as I'm assuming this place, OTC, is wearing him out). :LOL:

AMA-
"The Mars versus Venus distinction is commonly used to refer to the age-old dialog over the differences between men and women, differences that undoubtedly will be pondered, researched, and challenged for lifetimes to come. The subject of the sex and gender difference is now advancing with renewed vigor to the forefront of the study and practice of medicine. Just as it has long been known that children are not miniature adults, there is increasing focus on how the differences between the sexes affect how illnesses are diagnosed, run their course, and respond to treatment.

First though, it is necessary to point out that the terms sex and gender are not synonyms. Sex refers to the biological differences between males and females. Gender refers to the continuum of complex psychosocial self-perceptions, attitudes, and expectations people have about members of both sexes. Even the terms male and female, man and woman are not interchangeable. What it means to be male or female originates from physical characteristics derived from sex chromosomes and genes that lead to certain gonads, internal and external genitalia, and physiological hormones. Being a man or a woman holds broader meaning, with cultural concepts of masculinity and femininity coming into play."

So IMO, perceptions, attitudes and expectations are subjective. Not fact.
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I liked your AMA quote.

It IS a fact that these perceptions etc exist and will continue to exist. What we have is one side hating on the other sides perceptions as they are changing with the times.

Men wore wigs in the court of Louis XIV. And what would pass as panty hose plus makeup and false beauty marks. Things change.
 
In the spirit of trying to keep the thread nonpartisan, Numbers are all over the place but even on the very low end, 1:5000 people are born with “ambiguous genitals”. That also doesn’t account for people with chromosome disorders that further blue the area between male and female.
This isn’t a huge number but it means most every town in America statistically have people like this in it.

What I’m saying is that there are people out there who are scientifically inbetween the genders. Why is it a big deal if it makes them feel better to chose which gender they would prefer people refer to them as?
 
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